Mini dealers & engineering are something else...
 

We bought a used Mini cooper last week, seemed like a decent deal for a fun beater that we'd use both as a backup car and week end toy (cabrio). Things started to go wrong upon exiting the dealership parking lot, but that's not really the issue (modern cars, you know) I'm ranting about the design of the car and fleecing of customers....

The airbag light came on - turns out the sensor mat under the passenger seat (a US only addition) goes bad. No biggie right? Ha ! The sensor mat is glued to the seat bottom in a manner that requires replacement of the entire seat bottom, or in some cases the whole seat (at the rate dealers charge you can be better off swapping instead of disassembling) - $1600 to $2000 depending on dealers... (the selling dealer is covering this but I almost feel bad for them). It's recalled till 2005. Not after! ??? Same part is recalled on Bimmers for 06-08 I think, not Minis (same part, same manufacturer too).

Then the water pump supposedly leaks. OK fine, we can do this while the seat is on order (we got a lot of time). Get this: $1400 quote, with a straight face. For a water pump. As I recall my old Cayman S pump cost $800 to do. A Mini Cooper's is 1400? Apparently you must disassemble the entire car to get to it. Clever ! I declined and passed by an independent mechanic who quoted me $500 or so... How do those people stay in business with such blatant fleecing? And such poor design? The car is a riot, but that's gotta affect the used market, wouldn't ya think ? (not even, high resale values). I don't get it. Anyway that's my warning if you are considering one of these cars....

A buddy of mine bought one new. He loved it but after the clutch went out TWICE in 20,000 miles and fixed under warranty he sold it before the warranty expired. And no it was not abuse. He only drives manual transmission cars. He sold his old Honda appliance car with 200,000 miles with the original clutch. His Miata has over 100K now on the same clutch.

I bought a used Mini S I only kept it a year or so. I had nothing but trouble with it. I liked the car and it was a blast to drive but its hard to work on and parts are too high. something was always broken on it

My parents sold their 2001 not long ago, one of the first of the boat. Not sure if the issue is still around with your model but make sure you tighten the spark plugs OFTEN, other wise they blow out and cause major damage that all falls back into the engine through the plug hole!

I hear all this but on the flip side, I'm on my second MCS - the first was a 2005 Hardtop, the current one is a '13 Clubman - and both have been flawless. Maybe I've just been lucky.

I already know this is not going to be a long termer in my household.
Besides getting a Cab was a bad idea - it's more flexible than cooked pasta.
From what I read, everything (clutch too) requires taking the entire car apart to get to... Shoulda researched this more, but I owned one of the first Minis years ago and had zero issues with it, so I did not think to do my homework. It's all the more frustrating in that it's a hoot to drive...

ive heard alot of similar stories with the minis

Even people who love them usually say ownership is a bit of a pita

The car is on thin ice... Next big bill and it gets traded in. Shame, there is nothing else like it in that size (great for city parking). It is a lot more fun than, say, a Honda Fit ;-) BTDT with a GTI (great cars, just not that small). Hopefully we can drive it more than 2 days in a row soon...

I like my 2015 Cooper, but small trim parts are falling off.

Also I keep getting recall notices:
-Did not pass side impact standards - they need to add additional bracing
-Not accurate sticker in the door jam

I think when the lease is up, I will be walking away just out of fear of long term costs :(

Thanks for the confirmation.
At one time, I considered a MINI after hearing how wonderful they are to drive, but after learning about their maintenance history, I'll pass.

That's the truly sad part. I hate FWD cars..except this one ! It truly is a gem to drive. But clearly they cannot build/engineer them to be reliable.

Funny, I feel the same way. I'm on my 2nd one and I'm still on the fence. I really like driving it, its just what I need for 90% of the time but I'm not thrilled with the rattles and I'm not sure of his long term viability.

I am not sure about the newest Minis but the first ones had an engine and drive train that was designed by Chrysler, built in Brazil (I think) and sat for a while until some bean counters found a "good deal"! There was some strange engineering design in the 2003 model I bought and sold in 2009 when the engine started making some unusual noises when cold. I used heavier oil and made sure it was hot whenever someone came to see it and finally sold it for cash to a guy with a funny accent from L.A. I got a ticket for car pool lane violation about 7 months later and sent back the copies of the paperwork from the sale with his info on it and that was cleared up.

Tell you what though. I'm super impressed with the dealer that sold me the car (Ford lincoln of Livermore). "As-is" car... Not sure about the legalities of an airbag light in their parking lot, but....
They agreed to replace the entire seat (stupid design) for $$$$. And they are trying to meet me half way on the water pump, buy the parts, put in some labor $, something... That's really pretty good on a used car. If only Ford made a car I want, I'd really consider those guys!

Fingers crossed I get the thing back sometime this month !!!

I've posted this in other MINI threads...

Great cars to drive, but terribly designed POSs IMO. Wife and I bought an '06 MCS new. To be fair, the car was reliable for us, but there were far too many stupid little maintenance issues for my taste. Once out of warranty, I had initially planned to DIY on the car. Spent the $ on the Bentley book (excellent, BTW), some special tools, and my first DIY project was an encouraging success (serpentine belt replacement). When I decided the clutch needed bleeding is when DIY went sideways. Let's just say that the clutch circuit appears to be un-bleedable (to me). Yes I know the factory method is to maintain the slave cylinder in a compressed state during bleeding, I did that. No dice after literally hours of futzing. I gave up, called AAA and had the thing towed to the dealer. Service writer at dealer said their tech took "several hours" to bleed it. That's a factory trained tech, with all the correct tools. Ridiculous!

My wife really likes the MINI so it was her call to trade up for a 2013 model. I told her I wanted nothing to do with it. Still trying to convince her that the Cayman is her next car...might be getting somewhere with that

^BTW, anyone interested in a slightly used Bentley manual for up to '06 model year, PM me ;)

Agreed on the fun to drive, but the lack of quality and sound engineering is absolutely incredible. I've had two, you couldn't give me another because I might have to work on the POS.

This thread has inspired me to complete a little creative writing piece I left unfinished about a month back...you'll see :)

Reading about the Mini's in the latter years I am amazed at how problematic they are. It seems that since BMW deanglicized them they have issues.

My 1970 Austin Mini had 30k trouble free miles until it started to burn oil. Even though not enough heat it was a blast to drive and was an economical car to run.

I think BMW/Mini marketing is very effective and I question its long term future. Too bad. Great concept but quality issues.

Guy

I find BMW build quality sorely lacking. So you take the same engineers and designers and ask them to make a CHEAP car? Yikes....

BMW hasnt made a quality product since the E39. They figured out they could make more money via service.

I am desperately trying to find something more comfortable for my old bones to commute in than my Miata... I posted a question here a few months ago about the Mini... I'm still driving the Miata.

We had an 06 S for three years, only prob was the thermostat blew and lost all coolant. Luckily happened just before warranty expired. Then bought a 12 S.....had it for three months! Horrid piece of junk.
I know they are ugly, but a newer Scion XB is a blast to drive. Only comes in auto but has "shifters". Stomp on the gas and drive it like a go-cart and get 27 mpg. TRD suspension and it'll handle like a well set up 944! :-)

Knock on wood but my 2010 with 90k miles is pretty bulletproof. Had a vans valve issue and swallowed that $500 bill but other than that. Simple maintenance. Doing as much DIY as possible. I think a key in this is that my car is a justacooper; not an S.

our 2008 has been great a few minor niggles like the bonnet cable ceasing but apart from that very reliable and in the uk it is £280 for 3 services at BMW on mini tlc and currently getting nearly 70mpg from the 1.6 diesel. Pretty noisy at speed though.

I've had a lot of cars but bmw argue the least about warranty work.

I wish we got more small diesel vehicles in North America.

For years I've wanted a half-ton or small pickup with a turbodiesel and a manual transmission.

Mine has been generally reliable, bought new and am about to pass 100k. But, I think i have been lucky... and agreed that the thing was not designed for maintenance e.g. something like 20 hours shop time to replace clutch. Fun as hell to drive though and when that turbo spools up.... zoooom!

I'd considered a mini, and had one or two folks talk to me that loved them, but then I saw threads like this one.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic-discussions/792408-mini-inexpensive-commuter-car.html

Well I'm supposedly picking it up today from Mini with a brand new passenger seat that will replace the old (also brand new looking) passenger seat. All that for an airbag mat, Jeezus... I understand the dealer that sold me the car paid Mini through the nose for that... The water pump will be out of pocket at an independent next week (for all I know it's the thermostat, we'll see). I've seen the cost of a clutch replacement so I think I'll only be keeping this for a few months until I can trade it for something else (I don't even have the title yet!!!)

Not much else in that "range" though. This was a sub $13K car, convertible, fun to drive, cute, backseat for kids, qualified as a beater on price and age, and easy to park (small). I think the cabrio part will have to be dropped for whatever replacement I struggle to come up with. Likely a GTI... I have to leave the car on city streets all day, feet away from bike messengers, homeless camps, pick up parking dings and dents - in case you think I exaggerate I once found a homeless dude doing #2 in front of my car using my bumper as a seat back). I'd get another E39 and spend $500 replacing all cooling parts (those cars are unbreakable and super comfy), but parking space is at a premium and I'd like something a little more fun for commuting.

Wouldn't a Honda, Toyota or Mazda fit the bill with better reliability?

Fiesta st

My 2006 MCS has been fairly reliable. Just hit 113,000 miles and replaced the lower control arm bushings last month. Onlt $200 in parts and 4 1/2 hours of my time. Huge difference on on improving the handling and getting rid of the front end clunks.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1428092798.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1428092841.jpg
Airbag light is on due to the passenger seat sensor needing replacement. I plan on using the plug in airbag emulator to extinguish the light and has the PS airbag deploy when needed before sensors were required in the seat pad.

I've had 4 Minis (2 R53, 2 R56). They are small BMWs. Very complex only because BMW only does things one way. I've also had 4 BMWs. So at least the knowledge of how to fix one is pretty reusable across the marques.

If you work on your own cars, the Mini has one of the best support forums around. NorthAmericanMotoring.com. Pictoral how-tos and pretty much every issue addressed. I think some of the people on that forum know more about the cars than BMW does.

I built and used a walnut blasting setup to clean my DI intake/valves for about $50 total with the knowledge off that forum. Good stuff, but too bad I had to do it on a car with only 40k miles on it. My valves probably had close to 3/4" of crap on the backs.

In any case, I wouldn't recommend a Mini as a low hassle commuter. More like exotic car maintenance for an everyday car.

You have an R53, right? The water pump is part of the supercharger, not a directly driven accessory. Might as well get the supercharger rebuilt at the same time. The belt tensioner for the serpentine is a known problem, so replacing it is a good idea too.

>You have an R53, right?

Technically R52 since it's a cabrio but yes, same thing. I didn't know the supercharger needed to be rebuilt too... Serpentine belt makes sense. Since an independent will do the water pump, I'll let him do as he sees fit - it'll cost less than the dealer anyway....

>Wouldn't a Honda, Toyota or Mazda fit the bill with better reliability?

For sure. But I can't think of any of those as a "fun" car, around that budget and size anyway. Mazda3 Sport might fit the bill but doesn't really excite me. I realize I am the problem here, I want a fun reliable beater that I can park in a shoebox ;-(

> Or Fiesta ST

Yes, but that's too new and $$$. I'm talking cheap beater here. The silly Mini ticks all the boxes, if only it were reliable ! I'm debating keeping it forever and beefing up my repair skills, or offloading it the day after I get the title. Problem is I really like the stupid thing...

(then I look at the hours required to change a clutch and I cry)

Well your skills are evidently > to mine, given 1/2 your front end is lying on the floor ;-)

The problem I have with the airbag method you mention is liability. The day you wanna sell your car, that sounds like a risk. You can also turn it off via NCS expert + cable, and it "should" fire with the mat disconnected. But I prefered having the thing replaced with a 2y warranty, as long as someone else paid for it ;-)

Unfortunately its common practice, front end came off for a cooling fan replacement on my car. Not bad really, it just looks like a lot of work.

My Mini is on it's 3td airbag sensor maty. Mini Mania carries tje seat mat with sensor for $650. Here is a long list of complaints filed. Mini Cooper Air Bags - 2006 MINI COOPER Problems With Air Bags

I'm guessing they didn't deglaze the flywheel.

A few others you could consider that are about $10k, fun, seat four, small, and reliable:

Ford Focus SVT - the older SVT Focus was damn good, available in two or four doors, and can be had with HIDs and Recaros.

Mazda 3S - fun car

Mazdaspeed3 - even funner, there's one for sale locally for $8k

Mazda RX8 - 2009+ are the best ones, really great cars

Saab 900/9-3 - this is the 2000-ish hatchback, not the later sedan model that was a terrible car. You could even find a Viggen for under $10k.

Porsche 944 - it had to be said......:)

Porsche 928 - if you are a glutton for punishment. On the upside, the nice ones are slowly appreciating. Not super small though.

Acura RSX Type-S

Honda Civic Si

Honda Prelude SH - was the best handling FWD car when new

Volvo C70 T-5 - another turbocharged Swede

Mazdaspeed6 - might be bigger than you want

Threads like this make me appreciate my 21 year old VW Golf.
Yes it's a POS but when something breaks on it it's easy to fix and there are lots of options for parts.

I was thinking about a second hand Mini as a replacement but maybe I should look at a newer Golf or Polo GTI instead.

Meanwhile the old girl just keeps going and going. I'm actually tempted to keep her until she falls apart around me. :D