To me, these threads are always interesting reads, but in the end, the brand snobbishness is downright silly. As has been pointed out elsewhere, purists scoff at every new Porsche development, and every new Porsche model (including changes to the 911). Heck, 356 owners looked down at the bloated, heavy 911 when it came out; HECK, 356 owners looked down on the 356A as a perversion of the brand when it came out!

If the car is built by Porsche, it's a Porsche, and Porsche has very rarely made a "bad" car. The 912E had its flaws, as did the 924, but they couldn't be called "bad" cars. The 914 was sort of slow, the Panamera was sort of ugly, and the Boxster has a bit of a stigma attached to it, but those perceptions disappear when one actually drives the car.

So, thinking back at the Porsches I've driven, the list is long and varied. I have owned a 83 944, 84 944, 86 951, and 07 Cayman S; I've also driven a 356 Speedster, 911 mid-year, 911SC, 944S2, 928S, 968, 993 C2, 986 Boxster S, 996 C2, Cayenne, Cayenne S, Panamera 4S, and Cayman GT4. My impression of each car has always sort of been "well, I don't know what I should expect here...", but then I'm always pleasantly surprised by how well the car drives. With the possible exception of the 944/968 and the 928, there is a similarity in how the car "feels" that is distinctly Porsche. I'm not saying anything negative about the front-engined cars, mind you; they just drove differently than the 911/Boxster/Cayman, which seem to have a shared experience.

On the day that I drove the Cayman GT4 a few weeks ago, there was a 986 Boxster S for sale. My mother-in-law ended up buying it. It has aftermarket headers and exhaust, and an ECU tune. I took it for a spin along our twisty CT back roads, and I was absolutely floored by how fun it was. Although my 3.4 Cayman S is undoubtedly faster, there was a kind of unexpected rawness to the lightly-tuned Boxster S that was reminiscent of... and here we go... the air-cooled 911s that I'd driven.

So yes: there is something magical about the air-cooled 911. I hope to own one some day. I'm not sure if I'd want to trade in my Cayman S for one -- they scratch slightly different itches. But driving the Boxster S and being reminded of the earlier 911s reminded me that even though the new cars are softer and more user-friendly to the car-buying masses, there is an essence of Porsche hiding at the core of every P-car; sometimes it just takes a little tuning, or weight-reduction, or a slightly sportier exhaust, to reveal it.

FWIW: My mother-in-law's 986 Boxster S, my 987 Cayman S, and a friend's 981 Cayman GT4. I rather like how the early Boxster has aged...http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1464701163.jpg

The original concept was pictured as about the size of an updated 550 Spyrder. The actual production was an oversized pig.

I was hot for the concept.

Pictures please.......


I had a 1999 that I sold to a member here..... great car; just too small for an appropriate DD for my business needed to seat four.....

Not the best pics but you'll get the general idea. I have Litronic headlights to install and hope to add a small ducktail spoiler in the future. And maybe some ghost stripes.


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So I have a question for the Boxster/ Cayman guys. My left rear intake duct appears to be a dummy as it looks to be blocked from the inside. The airbox is just inside the dummy duct. Do you guys ever open that up, or would it mess up the cooling air flow coming in from the right side duct, which has a fan to force air into the engine compartment? Also, the center front duct is a dummy. I understand that there is an oil cooler option that can be installed there. Has anyone tried that? Is it necessary if you live in hot climates?

I don't know what year yours is, but on my old 98 the left duct wasn't a dummy. There was a 'snorkel' of sorts in there whose purpose was to prevent water intrusion into the intake. Many would just pull that sucker out and free up the airway. I pulled mine and never had water intrusion, but then I never encountered water living in CA. Oh and no snorkel was good for +15 hp ;)

The driver's side duct is an intake, the passenger side is a cooling fan.

Many 987 owners remove the restrictive snorkel in order to allow more air into the engine, especially if they have also upgraded the intake (EVO, etc.) or throttle body/plenum. Apparently, the main reason for the snorkel was not to keep water out, but rather to safeguard against discarded cigarettes getting sucked into the intake. Seriously: in early Boxsters, there were a few cases of discarded cigarettes getting sucked into the intake and igniting the engine.

In order to safeguard against this unlikely eventuality, many owners (myself included) install a layer of protective mesh or screen where the restrictive snorkel used to go.

Interesting. I would have never guessed.

The irony here made me chuckle...

So a Porsche 911 is supposed to make you feel like your 2 inches is 8 inches of real meat...so if you have TWO 911's does that make you feel like you got 16 inches of Salami to swing around? But what does it matter if you are around HRC it still is just Mr Floppy.

Me too.
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Blackout the windshield frame, add some 993 mirrors and bronze speedlines, squint a little and your close.

Two friends of mine bought Boxsters in the last year or two... an '01 S and an '02 S (This car). Both came with the IMS bearings already replaced, and were by all appearances well maintained.

On the '01 the replacement IMS bearing failed. Owner still weighing options.

On the '02 one of the heads cracked, sending oil into the coolant. Owner replaced engine with previously rebuilt engine, and just a few weeks later it's having cam timing issues (to be fair, probably a wiring problem and not rebuilder's fault.) Regardless, a nightmare.

So I have trouble believing anyone that says these motors can be reliable for the long term.

The Boxster gets a warm reception for the same reason as the miata, the stigma. I'm not sure why either one has the stigma, maybe because they are "cute" so women think they are attractive (ie not macho enough looking). And for the Boxster, it's exacerbated by the fact that it's got a big brother that's the big guy on campus, so no matter how good the boxster is, it'll always be the 911s little brother.

I am sadly reading GTC's comments on the engine while looking at this concept, and thinking-

"If only that concept had a 3.6 air cooled engine. It would be the coolest thing ever"

...and then there is the new GTS!

Last of the 6 cylinders. I played with one all weekend WOW!!

Do not underestimate this car.
918 steering wheel was cool, in fact I;d say the entire car is a 918 influenced car.

So much so that I would not call it a boxster at all. That name carries a different connotation than what this thing is. I finally get why they are starting to call them a 718!
(Although the 718 name I think is just the new4 cylinder ones, not this beast)

It is so seriously good with its Jekyl and Hyde magic button, that I could easily be persuaded to move on from my 73 RSR replica to one of these!

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1464829837.jpg

Fuchs for one thing
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1464832326.jpg

Hell yeah, I need a set of those for mine. Not that I dislike the wheels that it's got, but that's pretty darn cool. What size are they, 17", 18" or 19". I've currently got 19", and I'd like to stick the stock wheels in storage and go to 18". What can you tell me about them? (not that I am ready to spend a bundle on wheels, but one can dream)



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Not sure I follow. Are you saying that it's ironic that I'm talking about "brand snobbishness" w/r/t a brand that's inherently snobbish? I guess I should have worded it slightly differently: "intra-brand snobbishness"? :p

On the other hand my hard driven much abused '97 Box has 219K miles on it now with the original IMS bearing as far as I know.

My SC with 125K miles has a broken head stud.




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219K miles!! Are you sure there's not a Volvo engine in there?!

I must have the outlier. Apparently all other Boxsters have a POS engine.


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That would have been more accurate...:)

This seems like a heck of a lot of car for the money ....

craigslist:

PORSCHE BOXSTER '99 - Blue - $6700 (Carlsbad/La Costa)

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This 1999 Boxster features:
* 75K miles
* Dark blue w/ blue/gray interior
* Dark blue automatic convertible top
* 5 speed manual transmission
* New tires!
* AM/FM/CD player radio
* car seat+booster (turns off passenger airbag)
* service records for the last 20K miles/5 years
* IMS bearing replaced with high quality LN Engineering ceramic bearing
* just passed smog and is ready to be yours

More detail about this car:
My father is a Porsche fanatic. His website is: JM Engineering | Motorsports Engine Development. At 53,000 miles he serviced the car as follows: "the engine was rebuilt with new bearings and piston rings. Installed a deep sump and stainless headers. All filters were new at that time. Oil air and fuel filters. It received new brake pads and maybe new front brake rotors. A new vacuum pump was installed. The intermediate bearing that is the most prevalent failure was replaced with a ceramic bearing with 4x load capacity. The clutch was replaced with new everything (pressure plate, disk, release bearing). The flywheel and p plate were balanced. Some other minor hoses were replaced. The water pump was replaced. Some plastic under covers were replaced. Probably more but these are the highlights."

Also of note, the convertible top was replaced by the previous owner at 45K miles.

Runs great, really fun car!

PORSCHE BOXSTER '99 - Blue

Or maybe a $2k body kit ...


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There ya go...run it until it blows

Has there ever been a consensus reached about what percentage of 986s and 996s ended up with an IMS failure? I had heard something like 7-10% (and about 1% of M97 engines), but I wonder if that number has been revised since the dust has settled.

The lawsuit was for 2000+ model years, and I think it was 911 only and referenced something like 6%. The Boxsters seem to have a much lower failure rate, which is typically attributed to the fact that it is the same block as the 996 but with less power, so the entire thing is less stressed.

Ideas...ideas ...

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PCA Spotlight: An in-depth look at the 718 Boxster S

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I would drive the piss out of that and not give one damn about what anyone thought about it.

There was a thread about the sound of the new 4 cyl boxster recently. I talked to a guy that has heard them and his description was not a positive. He said that it "has a lot of mechanical pinging" he then tilted his head and squinted while saying "kinda like an old VW Beetle" He hasn't driven one out of the transport mode so he couldn't give me any tales of smokey burnouts.
They should hit the shelves in mid June.

If you buy a Boxster, you can pay $1500 to $3000 to quash the IMS/RMS once and for all, and get a new clutch as a bonus.

I bought my son's '03 Boxster S as a daily driver, and when it became apparent my '72 911 hot rod was going to be down for some time undergoing major rust repair. I figured I would drive it for a year or two and start looking for something else.

Well, I'm here to tell you, that Boxster ain't goin' nowhere. Yes, it is an entirely different Porsche than what I am used to, but it is an incredible car in its own right. I absolutely love the thing.

I finally really got to know it on a recent 3,000 mile road trip to Palm Springs and back for our annual R Gruppe get-together, our little "Treffen". Yes, I showed up at an R Gruppe event in a Boxster (gasp...). Guess what? It was not just well received, but it turns out the Boxster may very well be the semi-official R Gruppe "other Porsche". I was amazed at just how many of my brothers have one.

While our early cars have taken off into the stratosphere in value, they certainly were not always that way. As a matter of fact, the real core of the club, the old farts who first started buying and hot-rodding the early cars, did so for one simple reason: they were the only Porsches we could afford. Nobody wanted them. SC's, Carreras, 993's, etc. were completely out of our reach - so we settled for the early cars and made the most of it. Most of us still can't believe where they have gone...

So, the Boxster (at least to me) represents where the early 911 was 20 years ago. People "settle" for them, and secretly wind up with a pretty damn good car, and one they have so little into that they are not afraid to "molest" them, mechanically with aftermarket hop-ups, or in driving them like they stole 'em.

Maybe someday there will be a Boxster gruppe of some kind, having a ball with these cars, not caring what anyone else thinks, hated by one and all who are not sharing in the fun. Wouldn't that be something...

Jeff,

I just bought a 2001 today. It's getting a 2.9 by Marco from TLG. Emory just bought one 2 months ago. You're right, it's a car we can afford to buy and play with. Both Emory and I have "ideas" for our Gruppesters.

Eric

I'm not sure that the IMS fixes are 100% permanent fixes. There was a really great thread on Rennlist about this. The consensus is that the 2007- redesign was the real fix.

I think it all boils down to a strategy. When I had my 944, I replaced my timing $7 belt yearly. When I had my 951, I replaced my $7 timing belt yearly. Now that I have my sc, I will probably need to pull my engine and replace the engine studs at some point. I will (of course) put in new seals and some new cams just because! :D (they havent broke yet....) Am I going to split the case? NO. Will I post pics of me and a blowtorch heating the broken stud? NO. Why? those are just inconveniences. I will instead look onwards to the next "top gear" fracas( i hate that word btw)
I am not too concerned because with the help of pelican and my dad's *****en set of tools, I can handle it.

It's all about a strategy.There have been some awesome boxster pics here. As long you have a strategy- It is all good.

Ha ha, I love it - Marco and I had a wonderful conversation about Boxsters at Treffen this year. He is an owner and as big of a fan as I am.

I guess the only thing to worry about now is the "secret" getting out, and the same thing happening with Boxsters as happened with our beloved early 911's (and 356's for that matter).

I can't wait to see what you and Gary come up with for your outlaw "Gruppesters"...

Excellent post, Higgins.

The Boxster S has 250HP, is the same 2800 lbs, and is center engined. The quantifiable metrics simply can not be denied.
I am sold on Boxster, and am actively searching for a 2nd weekend car.
It's also a joy to shop for this car. There are tons for sale, most are in excellent condition, and offer a ridiculous value compared to a 911.

I agree that Boxster isn't going anywhere, and it's the next hotrod track platform, if it isn't already.
I bet for every one aircooled car being track prepped, there are 20 Boxsters.
As air cooled gets too expensive to mod, and maybe even drive, and transition to full-time trophies, the future seems increasingly Boxster.
While the internet engages in hairdresser wars, I will be driving the snot out of mine, with zero guilt.

Boxster's have oiling problems when raced hard. Correctable. (Don't know the year range and may have been mentioned previously)

Their engines are not the same as your 911. Oddball steps and tools are required to take apart and put back together. But, hey, my 81 requires a 37MM crows-foot wrench to get into, a 67 Chevy does not.

I drove one 98 Boxster in a little bit of anger. Every bit as fun as my 81. I would love to drive an early 2000's Boxster S. Betting a big step change.

Beyond that I have coin limitations.