It already has.

I've used Macs since 1985.

For the last year, I mutter to myself, "exactly when did Microsoft buy Apple."

While I don't think Apple will go the way of Lotus 123 or Netscape, Tim Cook has a fraction of the vision Steve Jobs had and none of his passion for perfection. He's just a normal C-level exec.

Apple was Steves baby, for Tim it's just a job. You can never get that kind of passion for just a job...

Yes, without Jobs the Apple we all love is slowly rotting.

Yes the integration is great but I will argue the hardware in many, not all, cases is better.

The 3,1 / 4,1 and 5,1 MacPros are undoubtedly the pinnacle of desktop hardware.

There's a reason that 5-8 year old machines are in demand on the secondary market and still command higher prices than most PC's you'll find at retail.

My 08' MacPro is a dual quad core Xenon with 32 GB's of RAM, 7 TB internal, 16 TB external SATA RAID 5, dual 2 GB GPU's running 5 displays on the latest up to date OS.

It's a beast that has been running 24/7 since new except for the odd downtime to swap a component or move its location.

It really is a spectacular bit of design and engineering.

http://www.everymac.com/images/other...-open-2008.jpg

What model/year of used Mac Pro would you recommend, if one
were looking for a desktop?

Tough one.

The dual quad core CPU boxes, 08' 3,1 are really good boxes and are the best value. I would only get the dual CPU 3,1, not the single or anything older.

If budget is less of a concern then a 10' or newer 5,1. They are not cheap but you'll get your money out of them in the long run.

You have

08's are the 3,1's

09's are the 4,1's

10'-13' are the 5,1'

The secondary market price point basically increases $500 per model.

Also depends where you buy, fleabay will be cheaper than a trusted reseller.

Good place to start, these are 8 core boxes. Buy Refurbished Used Apple Mac Pros | mac of all trades

All boxes / configs, Buy Refurbished Used Apple Mac Pros | mac of all trades

I would pick up the newest one that fits your budget.

Don't worry so much about graphics cards, they are easily upgraded.

They will all run pretty much every off the shelf PCI card available today.

If there is a Mac version of a particular card, like the GTX 680's get the Mac version.

It will have EFI on the rom which is the only difference.

EFI does two things, gets you the boot screen and registers the card correctly in system profiler.

Non EFI cards work just fine, you just get a blank screen until it boots to desktop.

Lack of boot screen is really only an annoyance if you have bootcamp or want to access startup disc options without a restart.

Leaving in the stock card or one with EFI (how mine are set up) on it as a "helper" card solves that issue.

RAM is similar, one of my 3,1's runs 667 mhz ram when it calls for 800 mhz. Works just fine as long as all slots are populated with the same spec chips.

667 is half the price of 800, the trade off in amount of ram you can install outweighs the slight performance hit of the slower chip.

I would disagree that the hardware is any better, but there are tighter controls on integration and drivers. The components in that computer of yours aren't what most people would need in a desktop but would use in a server. Those components in a Mac are certified for use in a Mac where a windows unit you can gram a RAID controller from some guy in a white van on the street and Microsoft wont care with the OS where the Mac OS will tell you to get rid of that piece of crap. And it will be a piece of crap and the server will mostly run but give a BSoD now and then and people will complain it has bad RAM or who knows what.

I haven't looked for a while, but the last time I priced a Mac desktop unit it was more difficult to put the latest generation video card in it. That may have changed from 2009 /2010.

Do you or have you owned one of those boxes?

You can use the case as jack stands for your truck.

Every piece is machined to the tightest tolerances.

There is not one edge anywhere in the box where you are in danger of cutting your hands while reaching inside.

No bundles of wires all over the inside that get in the way of swapping components or rubbing against case / GPU fans and act as traps for collecting balls of airborne matter.

No tools required to swap PCI cards, RAM, hard drives.

1,000 watt power supplies that I have yet to ever have one die.

Whisper quiet ventilation that is designed as part of the case rather than just slapping a fan over a hole in the back. In fact the PC's that I have running in the same environment accumulate considerably more dust and particulate compared to the tighter sealed MacPro case. Dust and particulate accumulation contributes to higher operating temperatures which contributes to component failure.

And yes, you have not looked in a long time then. Virtually every off the shelf PCI card works and has for years.

And yes, my rigs most certainly are built out to a higher specification than the average consumer requires but it does not matter. The consumer and prosumer all get the same quality box to start with, what they do with it afterwards is up to them.

While many of the internals that are found in one, CPU's, BT and WIFI cards are certainly identical to the ones used by other manufacturers to argue that how they are combined does not affect the overall performance, functionality, and longevity of the box is simply not true.

I would never recommend someone buy an $2,000 computer, Mac or PC, when they would be just as well serviced by a $500 machine but sometimes you do get what you pay for, you just have to decide if you need it.

I'm looking on eBay, and am often seeing this statement in the descriptions: "OSX Lion is the highest version this Mac Pro can run". Why is that - shouldn't a Mac Pro be able to run any version of OS X?

They don't know what they are talking about.

https://support.apple.com/kb/SP728?locale=en_US

Went thru a similar ordeal few years back. Had an HP that I really liked (2nd gen touchsmart / flip screen / DVD / Win 7 ultimate) but fried three times and after near exact 3 years of usage. Purchased new heavily discounted in OEM sealed box. Covered under warranty Best Buy offered me a full replacement from original price and select or apply difference to anything I wanted.

Caught an online Best Buy deep discounted loaded 17" Asus including a rarely found Bluray drive, a separate Nvidia graphics board, etc.. Last version of the OEM installed Win 7. Best part was the FACTORY Asus warranty of 24 months. Plus right after I registered it with Asus, they gave some bonus extras. Weird though as it was a hassle placing the order online with Best Buy and apparently they had a price discrepancy. Fortunately, I called a store, directed them to the link and they honored it. In two days it was at my door. Considering my initial cost from years back on the 1st laptop from B.Buy, I'm very pleased with the deal and mostly the Asus product.

Definitely next time around will acquire another Asus.

EDIT: Should have added, after two years the only minor complaint is the battery has petered out. But... the factory replacement is only $18 on Amozone. Crazy cheap compared to other name brands.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1447880190.jpg

What machines are dependable currently? Go to the dude in the repair dept and ask him what he has to repair the most and/or what he dreads seeing come in the door. Avoid those. I bought an ASUS desktop about a year ago and love it. Dell quality is the WORST and customer service/satisfaction is run by Satan himself. I've had desktop machines since my Commodore 64 and I'll use an abacus before I will buy another Dell.