Found a 'New Edge' Mustang I like, any input?
 

Last year, I bought a flogged 2002 GT Mustang as an experiment. Dirt cheap. I liked it, but it was to far gone to fix up. So I've been kicking around the idea of getting another one, the key being that I want one with a supercharger already on it. I think I might have found the car.

Not perfect, but lots of good stuff, and the price is right. 2002 GT, vortech (no intercooler) supercharged. Looks like it was done right. Zero rust, undercarriage looks good, guy said its a summer only car, and I believe him. Metallic paint job is starting to fade, but its even across the car. Everything looks straight. Door gaps are off, but that's not uncommon. I haven't run the VIN yet, but as long as the title isn't tagged, I don't care if it's taken a hit.. It tracks straight.

109k on the engine, no smoke or scary noises. Pulls like a train on the throttle, but has a light stumble off throttle. Could use a tune. Easily broke the wheels loose in 2nd gear, my 'ass dyno' tells me it's making about 350hp. Off road X pipe and Borla Atak 'mufflers'....holy hell, it is obnoxiously loud. Those will need go. Shifts perfectly, clutch feels right.

Interior looks very good in person. I was pleasantly surprised. Highend stereo install that I could care less about, big bass box in the trunk.

By my count, it needs tires, a tune, oil leak on engine fixed (might need an intake manifold), and the exhaust from the cats back changed. Good 10 footer but could use a respray at some point.

He's asking $8500. I was thinking of offering him $6500 in cash and see if he bites. Seems like a lot of barrel full of monkeys fun for not much $. I might even grow a mullet! :D

Link: 2002 Mustang GT Supercharged

Oh yeah, it will need LOWERING SPRINGS. Holy wheel gap Batman!

http://images.craigslist.org/00v0v_4...y_1200x900.jpg

Back in March, I picked up a 2004 triple black Mustang GT convertible for next to nothing. The P.O had 4 kids under 8 years old, and traded me for my 1995 Saturn SL2 and $1000 because it had 4 doors, and gets better mileage.

This car has 149,000 miles and runs real well (14.8 @ 93 MPH at Norwalk dragstrip)
even with it's automatic trans. Everything works, and it is a pleasure to drive when it's sunny and the top is down. Mine is not supercharged, and I really don't want to do so, but a few bolt on mods are in the future (Ported plenum with larger TB, underdrive pulleys, 3.73 gears, Magnaflow full exhaust with X-pipe).

Show him 65 $100 bills. I bet he takes it.

Needs lowering, yes. Bigger tires?

Have you taken up pool?

Hah!

Just discovered a sizable negative. The color of the car (E9, Laser Red Metallic) is a three stage paint with the tint in the first coat of clear, so you can't simply respray the car.

Vinyl wrap it.

Maaco can do it!

Well, they could spray it something kind of close, if you don't mind a bit of overspray on the chrome trim, wheel wells, mirrors, glass, tires, antenna, grille, lenses, yada yada....

This!

Okay, I gotta ask, what is a "new edge" mustang? I thought I was pretty knowledgeable about cars but don't remember hearing that one.

99-2004 Mustangs. Ford introduced new 'edge' styling to the car over the more rounded look of the previous model. Mainly a cosmetic upgrade. All of the Mustangs from 94-2004 were built on the same SN95 chassis.

(sorry tangent- That asphalt looks sanded and waxed or some type of sealer. Skim coat on concrete?)

Lowering springs alone won't cut it. You will need shock tower plates in order to get camber right in the front. The pinion angle will need to be adjusted or u joints will go.
You'll find that the rear axle will shift to the left with the shorter springs, so an adjustable panhard bar is needed. Probably will need adjustable rear lower control arms as well.

Yeah, I researched this for my S197 'stang. Decided to stay stock since I don't autocross or do club things these days. In stock trim it serves me well as a way to get to my favorite pool hall and back home.

(edit) Read more here: I'm sure this place could design a good street setup for an SV95...

http://www.vorshlag.com/product_info.php?cPath=141_142_179&products_id=559

Doesn't look good to me at all. Retail blue book is under $6K and stuff like a supercharger doesn't help. Carfax is clean, but doesn't show much service history (which just means it doesn't show). Not keen on the idea of a 100K motor with a supercharger and no intercooler on it. Needs too much work- tires, mufflers, engine problem, and you'll still have crummy paint. Take all the money you'll be in it and buy a nicer original one with good service records and put a supercharger on it.

^^^^this too

AFAIK, cars with superchargers don't normally need/use intercoolers. The S/C is belt-driven.

Cars with turbochargers do... because exhaust gases are used to spin the vanes in the turbo.

If you don't mind travelling a bit, here's the Bullitt board used car lot. Bullitts were made only in '01 or '08-'09. Makes them $pendier than the GT's of the same year, but they do have a few goodies the GT's don't. Note the first one listed is a 45K miles original asking $9K....

Steve's Car Lot - IMBOC

(edit) FWIW, many mustangs with blowers do run intercoolers...

Belt or exhaust driven, compressing the air heats it...you are better off with an intercooler. It is not absolutely necessary.

Turbos build boost exponentially. Superchargers tend to have more linear boost, but less ability to run amok at the higher RPMS. On older cars with lower compression ratios, they often don't effect engine lifespan to any appreciable degree. On other cars, the sizing of the unit and the drive pulleys is what makes a reliable system.

Generally speaking, intercoolers allow you to run more advance on the ignition, or more boost. Sometimes they prevent a loss of HP in warm weather. A modest system on a V8 should make a significant increase in HP without any loss in reliability.

What about running a water or methanol injection system in lieu of an intercooler? Ideally it would be better to run both, but it wouldn't hurt.

I was using a Kokeln intercooler on my 930 and after a dyno run, it was so hot I couldn't keep my hand on it after the run. My next step was the water or methanol injection system to coll the air.

Sadly, I agree. I slept on it and came to the same conclusion. I would take it on for a lot less money, but the guy already told me that he's turned down $5k. The lack of any sort of service records, and zero info on the build itself is too unnerving.

compression test it, listen for funny noises, check for any signs of water / oil mixing.

Lowball him and drive it...

Ya see, this is how I get into the dog house with my wife. I bring home strays, and spend all kinds of $ fiddling around with them.

They are pretty simple, and compared to other things of similar size and stature, they cost peanuts to play with. As long as it hasn't been beaten to an inch of it's life and it's not acting weird, it's cool.

What's a good used bottom end for one of those cars? $199.95 at bubba's wrecking?

LOL ain't no German car..

I recently saw new (dealer overstock) cop car 4.6's advertised for $3,000. Only 2 valve engines, but new...

Yep, Mustangs are cheap to run compared to Porsches. I don't even bother to change oil on mine...why bother when the dealership charges me $23.45 to change oil & filter and rotate tires? (I bring my 6 qts. of mobil one)

10 K will buy you a really nice built car. You would have your pick at that price.

I think about selling the 928 and getting something less dear. It's such a great car though.

At this stage of my life, my '09 S197 Bullitt Mustang has been a good car for me. Fun & easy to drive, no problems, and no status inexpensive. Definitely not a Porsche. Kind of like A Seiko watch not being a Rolex.

Performance? 0-60 in around 5, quarter mile in around 14. Cruises comfortably at 80-85 mph still delivering over 20 mpg. Good steering feel, hangs okay in the corners for street and highway while still under it's limits.

Not a car for everybody but it works for me...

Paul- did Ford make a Mustang in Dark Highland Green that wasn't a Bullitt? I really like that color on them, but I'm not crazy about being a Bullitt wanna be.

Dark Highland Green came only on Bullitt models. In '01 they came in green, black, or blue. In '08-'09 Green and black only.

(edit) Well..correction. They did make Mustangs in Dark Highland Green back in '68. ;)

My 944 is currently going to be up for sale by the end of the week. My 04 Mustang GT conv just runs too well with almost twice the HP, much cheaper to fix and build, doesn't attract idiots in parking lots/roads, and doesn't have a drop top. At 51 Y.O. I have lost the passion of stirring a 5 speed in stop and go traffic on my DD.

Boy, know what you mean about 5 speed and traffic. Alas, every Bullitt made comes with a tremec 5 speed. I only regret it when in city traffic...especially in the stop & go through Salem, OR on my way to this place:


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1468280536.jpg

Actually, there is one Bullitt with an automatic. A guy on the Bullitt board converted his to some sort of drag racing auto...but he's gone crazy on mods.
a built 5.0 with both blower and nitrous...Has Porsche GT3 money into the car.

I assume any car with a supercharger was owned (and "maintained") by an idiot. But, that's just me. I agree with buying an original survivor. Do you really need a supercharger? What sort of driving do you do?

Whatever floats your boat. The guy on the Bullitt board has the means to do what he likes, so he does. A highly modded Mustang with 10.3 second drag strip slips, yet also a decent highway driver. It's definitely more than I'd care to spend, but I sure wouldn't call him an idiot. Actually having a blower on a Mustang is a pretty common modification. Some even come from the factory with a blower attached. Is Ford an idiot for putting this in Mustangs? Hmmm..maybe so, but they sold 'em.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1468284365.jpg

Increasing pressure creates heat no matter the compressor type or compressor drive. Also, a turbocharger is a specific drive type of supercharger.

Huh? Why does having a supercharger make him an idiot? Superchargers are a common bolt on mod in the muscle car world, and you find them on all sorts of cars. For lower compression engines, it's a lot of horsepower for the $.

You also find superchargers in the production car world, although not nearly a commonly as turbochargers. Because turbine of a supercharger is being driven off the crank, there is parasitic power loss as compare to a turbo that is being driven off the exhaust gasses after they have already left the engine. Translation? You get worse mileage with a supercharger. So what's the upside? They're easier to install and tune. An SC system is going to increase pressure in linear way based on engine speed, so figuring out the tuning is easier when compared to a turbo.

From the factory, the standard GTs of this era only made about 260 hp. A well setup and documented SC system would be desirable, because it gets you at least an extra 60-70 HP. The stock bottom end on these GTs can be safely taken up to about 400hp. Some say the number is 450hp.

The guys not an idiot. But he doesn't have any records of the build, and no service records. Who knows. I'm still talking to him......

Idiot might be a bit harsh but I agree. Maybe hooligan instead, you dont install a SC on a rustang because you want better mpg or like to drive slow. I would be worried about abuse, either trans or diff issues, subframe mounts... but I'm cautious. I'm sure many dont but I know some do beat mustangs like a rented mule, a SC just adds to it.

Yep...hoondogs like Mustangs. So do guys who drive carefully. The newest SN95 'stangs are 2004 models, so age is indeed creeping in. That said, both the Tremec trans and the 8 3/4" Ford rear end are quite robust. So strong that Ford deemed both strong enough for the 662 horsepower GT500.

Perhaps the point is the emphasis on 'maintained'. As in the safe assumption (as with any used car) is that it should be thoroughly inspected and serviced based on an assumption of neglect by the previous owner.

It would also be logical to assume the car had been driven hard, why else would you add a supercharger?

I did not read the comment, as some have, as inferring 'only an idiot buys/installsor drives a car with a supercharger'.

Hoondogs do like Mustangs...matter of fact, a group calling themselves Hoondogs just had their nationals in Savanna Ga. I tip my hat to Paul Rocha for buying a new GT350 and driving it...on the track. A 500 miles old car with tires already nearly gone and a cracked windshield...his 350GTR gets used in the manner it was built for. Pics and videos of the event here...

2016 Hoondog Nationals Pictures and Video Thread - IMBOC

Isn't it nice to have a car that can be built / modified / repaired with pocket change?

Compared to a Porsche, Mustang is child's play. I could've fully built 2-3 of these New Edge cars WITH SUPERCHARGERS for the $$$$ I sunk into my 911.

Although I still own domestics, I now have a new hoon mobile- the Subaru STI- Instead of a drunk redneck (Camaro / Stang) , cops think I'm a Chinese teenager when I drive by...

rjp

Yep! Sure is!

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/support/smileys/wat.gif