Yep, I agree, but not sure if he's going to recoup that money in 5 years when he sells?

NOOOOOOOO (using all my lung capacity)

This is pretty common, and people have been doing it for at least 20 years.

It is literally true that the pink foam sheets are not capable of absorbing water and has a life span of at least 50 years.

Some roofers and people who do energy retrofits to existing houses use this method . Of course you want someone to do it who knows the technology.

I bet that an array of solar panels would shade that roof pretty well.

Should add value to the home as well.

One way to fight high A/C bills, kind of backwards but conventional solutions have already been addressed in this thread.

Ok, I give up...

I gave you guys a solution that's used in the Midwest on commercial buildings... I have had the roofs on my office buildings done this way...

Works great, affordable, and provides a decent R-rating. The pink stuff is strong enough to walk on (they use it as underlayment for highway), its cheap, and works.

The taping of the seams isn't meant to be waterproof... the rubber membrane roof that goes over it, is the water barrier. The pink stuff works as insulation... I said the tape add ADDITIONAL water proof barrier...

We have renovated multiple commercial properties, and multitudes of homes. I speak from experience.

If you guys wish to find other alternatives that are way more costly, like redoing/reframing/repitching the entire roof or insulating from the inside, go for it.

I can give good advice, I cant make you take it.

Bo

Well, it is true that commercial roofs often use foam under a membrane. I disagree about the longevity claims. I've never seen a foam that lasts 50 years, but then again your membrane won't last that long, either. If you rely on the tape as adiitional waterproofing, you're using the wrong membrane. If water penetrates the membrane layer, your're ****ed.

As for the "good" advice, look at the bigger picture. Nobody (WITH A BRAIN) builds a house that has a tiled gable roof butted up next to a flat, commercial roof. The flat roof is an eyesore, no matter how you cover it.

Adding a pitched roof may cost more money but it will increase the value of the house. Enough to get his money back? Who knows? if I were a potential buyer, that roof he has now would make me walk away; I wouldn't even consider that house, I'd go to the next one.

He doesn't have a roof leak problem (yet), he has too much heat. If he wants to fix that with the least cost, adding more A/C would do that cheaper than a new roof. Yes, it's an additional bandaid that does nothing to improve the saleability of the house (thinking of a small, add-on A/C unit here...) but, if low cost is the goal...

You don't fix a mistake by making another mistake...

JR

It's more involved. The new ridge will want to go all the way to the existing pitched roof, (2 gable ends as you've shown would look funky and be hard to make waterproof) and check out what's involved with that existing roof: A skylight and a second ridge that's probably left over from the addition that was improperly solved and needs to be addressed. If I was only going to live there five years, I'd install membrane outside, insulate from the inside, install a new lid inside on and add a mini split.

You're interpreting my drawing incorrectly. What I was attempting to show is exactly what you suggest. The new ridgeline goes all the way back to the exiting ridgeline. What you are seeing as another gable on the back side is actually the line of the valley between the two roofs, not the edge of a gable on the other side. It just happens that the perspective in the photo makes it looks like what you mistook it for, not what I intended.

There's definitely some work involved,as the existing gabled roof is overly complicated, which is why I suggested having an architect design it.

I also have a house that was built in the 70's and ****ed up by previous owners. I spent a bunch of money to undo all of the mistakes and turn it into something I could live with. I'll never get all my money back, nor do I care. I chose not to live in a lipsticked pig and I'm happy with that decision every day.

JR

Thanks for all the great information. If folks are interested I will post 2-3 more pictures tomorrow to give a better understanding of current situation. The two tiled ridge lines in the picture are the garage (left) and home (right). I don't agree that this was DIY and thus 'poorly done'. I have seen my share of crummy sun room additions and this looks nothing like those. From inside the home the transition is pretty seamless and carries out the exposed beam to match other rooms in the house. The addition is fully integrated into an extensive backyard remodel so I'm guessing it was done at/near the same time. This work was done by the original home owner (according to neighbors a Marine who was OC) not the PO that I purchased from. Those folks were indeed a cheap DIY crowd and I have spent tens of thousands of dollars reversing their crazy work. Total rework of the electrical was needed - lucky the house did not burn to the ground before I got that done. :eek:

Edit - I went back in time with Google Earth and there are some early pictures that indicate this roof had tile at some point. I am guessing that the PO had a leak at some point and cheeped out on the fix declining to put tile back up there.

I agree with javadog that aesthetically it's an eye sore. But from ground level (that shot was taken standing on backyard slope) you cannot see the roof. Thus my thinking of adding tile but only if it could be done to reduce radiant heat. Solar panels I am guessing are going to blow my budget. I would have to buy them rather than lease if we are selling the home in ~ 5 years. They would reduce my AC bill though - last month $475 - normal no AC my elec bill is $175-200 (I have a pool). If I were going to stay here to retirement I would definitely pull the trigger on a new roof that integrated with the existing. I like things done right. I'm waffling on the paint - appreciate the suggestion but I'm back to appearance with a nod to cost.

Edit #2 - the roof is not flat. It is sloped away (down) from the home to the rain gutter just visible. The rain gutter drains into lines that go under the concrete patio and pool area.

NO!

It does not. None!

But it sure makes it harder to find leaks.

Explain to me how laying 4x8 sheets of 4 inch foam edge to edge, sealed with DuPont waterproof tape, does add additional water protection...

Usual construction:

OSB...

Then +/- tar paper...

Then 4 inch of foam rigid insulation...

Then (optional) seal joints

Then 1/2-3/4 fire barrier insulation...

Then rubber roof membrane/torch sealed...

Then white elastomeric paint...

I don't mean to offend. Here's where I am coming from, with the experience of 40 years in the construction business.

No good architect would have designed an addition like that.

The "flat" roof doesn't have near enough slope for a tile roof. Again, that's not a design a pro would have done.

The existing roof material is about as lousy as a roof material gets. As small as that roof is, there were a number of better choices.

Insulation is not a new thing. Even in your climate, it's needed. A flat roof can be properly insulated. Yours wasn't.

The lack of A/C speaks volumes about the original design.

All I'm trying to do is direct you away from the sort of thinking that got you in the predicament you are in. Given the stupendous cost of real estate where you are, fixing this would be a drop in the bucket in comparison. The framing doesn't have to accomodate any huge loads, the new roof could be framed and decked in a day and tiled in a second day. Not a huge deal, really.

JR

Why would you want to put elastomeric paint over a roof membrane? That's nuts.

JR

Perhaps its something else? Its that reflective white paint they use...?

Bo

Elastomeric paint is usually applied over a hard surface.

Rubber membranes are laid over foam insualtion. They can be loose, they can be bonded to the substrate, but they are usually glued at the overlapping joints and you don't paint over the top of them. They come in white, anyway, as well as other colors.

JR

Are we talking about rigid foam insulation under roofing? that we do to flat roofs all day long out here

Summertime Update
 

My summertime 2018 update!

I have decided to tackle this from both sides. I am going with the white elastomeric coating on the outside and rigid foam between the beams on the inside.

Jeff, is the spray foam a DIY item? Where do I source the materials and spray equipment...it sounds messy. I am leaning to a 2" thick rigid foam install - local Lowes sells it in 4'x8' sheets for ~ $25. A simple utility knife to cut and wedge between the beams. I plan to cover the insulation with pre refinished white ship lap (or similar T&G product) that is also sold at Lowes.

I am thinking R-Tech or this Kingspan: Lowes Kingspan 2" 4x8

So my plan is to finish nail 1/4 round ~ 3" from the ceiling on each inside beam - painted to match. Beam spacing is ~ 17-18" ... have not measured yet. Then cut and slide the insulation (metallic side facing up) into place lengthwise. I then wrap up the install by cutting and fitting cross wise T&G boards into place supported by the 1/4 round. I will make temporary panels of insulation and finish boards to fit into the skylights that we can remove once the summer heat is done. No nails or adhesives on ceiling or products other than the 1/4 round with finish nailer into the beams.

Does that sound reasonable? Any suggestions? I will sill have ~ 3" of exposed beams to look at which we can live with if we knock down some of the heat.

Again, if we were planning to retire here I would spring for a new roof and a modern mini-split AC unit. Yes the exterior view of the roof from elevated part of the yard is an eyesore but not something I can address without big $$$ to plans, permits, and labor.

Thanks,
David

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1532371803.JPG
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1532371803.JPG

David. I'm wondering if you can get a higher insulation value using regular fiberglass batting. The foam sheets only have a rating of R-10. I know I have six inch studs with R-19 insulation between them. Just a thought. I'd imagine you might be OK with less than 3" of the beams exposed, since it's just a visual to break up the ceiling expanse.

Some good advice.
We have a lot of additions like this in Florida and most are done with poorer construction, the “Florida Room”.
I agree flat roofs are crap, make no sense. If they leak you usually don’t figure it out till there is substantial damage. If you keep an eye on them and stay ahead on maintenance then not so bad. The idea of foam and rubber membrane is not so bad. The white reflective paint is used a lot in Florida and does help significantly bring down on your AC bill.
Adding a sloped roof will not be cheap. I would get a price and then make a decision. You’ve got at least three options so far.

I would try 3" to get a lil' more R value in there. It will help a lot. The spray foam is DIY but messy. Rigid foam can be cut with a knife, but we use a table saw. If you don't have one, use a fine tooth hand saw. It cuts easily. Are you painting the ship-lap or tongue and groove to match the beam? You have T-111 plywood on top of those beams now, why not save yourself a lot of work and install T-111 on there, paint to match it white or what ever color you (I should say your wife) like and be done with it. Yea hold it with 1/4 round. If you want to go with 3" foam, then you can extend the beam and fake it by making a U shape piece and nail it on the side of the beam and eliminate the 1/4 round all together. Its all DIY and requires a table saw, glue and some nails. Paint to match. You know how to get hold of me. I am always available