Appliance-car replacement, V2: MkV/VI Jetta 2.5?

Otter74 · 01:30 AM

I did post something on this subject a year or so ago, but it seemed better to start a new thread. For the last couple of years or so I've been wanting to replace my boring appliance car (2003 Honda Accord, I4/5AT, ~50k miles) with something less boring with a manual transmission and a liftgate. (I haven't yet because I keep reminding myself that it's nice to have one car that I can ignore) I would be happy with the boringness if it was a wagon with a stick, or just a wagon, but the combination of boringness and lack of utility (if I had a wagon I wouldn't have had to borrow a pickup to move an engine the other weekend, for instance) is what makes me want to replace it.

I know that, approached purely from a utilitarian standpoint, there is little case for replacing it. It is in great shape except for the damn headliner and will run until Jesus comes with very little maintenance at low cost.

Dreamed-of replacements cover the full spectrum of Bad Idea (Alfa Milano, E30 Touring, E34 Touring, E46 Touring, E39 Touring - notice a pattern here? - B5/6 Avant, Saab 9-5 wagon, Peugeot 505 turbo wagon, etc.) to Good Idea (Mazda 3 hatch, Mazda 5, Mazda 6 hatch/wagon, Subaru wagons) and in between.

Ideally I'd get something of about the same vintage, with about the same mileage. I don't daily this (I use bicycles for that) and probably don't drive it more than 5k miles per year, mostly road trips. I can go a month without driving at all unless I'm taking the 911 for a drive. Sometimes I have to carry **** and people, and I want to be entertained at least a little bit while doing it.

Two of my recent short-list cars are the Mazda 5 and the 2009-up Jetta wagon. The 5 is a pretty known quantity - hard to go wrong if I could find one with low miles, a 5MT and a sunroof (I really, really want a sunroof on a wagon-type car) Fuel consumption is only OK, but not worse than the Accord.

The Jetta I know less about. I found a 2010 Jetta wagon for sale with the 2.5L five, base trim, low miles, manual, and sunroof. A bit over budget, but workable (I'd like to keep it under $8k). What is the reliability of these cars like? The engine may be 'meh' but it is good enough and is probably the most reliable engine VW has made in recent years. Are these things likely to be durable and reliable? Remember I don't put more than about 5k/year on this car. The 2010 Jetta wagon seems to be a Mk V body shell with a Mk VI front end, IP and electrical architecture.

nota · 08-08-2016, 07:08 PM

is not the 2.5 a 5 cyl 20valve audi motor ?

nota · 08-08-2016, 08:02 PM

and not a 4

Jrboulder · 08-09-2016, 12:53 AM

I had a 2007 Jetta 2.5 5MT. Probably the best, least expensive (per mile) car I've ever had. I bought it at 102k and I sold it at 172k.

Things other than scheduled mx and tires:
2 sets of rear brake pads ($40)
refrigerant control valve ($60)
radiator fan assembly ($60)
1 ignition coil ($20)
coolant expansion tank ($20)

I doubt the 2.5 is as reliable as the I4 8-valve 2.0. The 2.5 has lots of known issues that never really got ironed out and is a pretty complicated motor. The old 2.0 plainly doesn't have junk like camshaft adjusters, oil fed vacuum pumps and timing chains,

Otter74 · 08-09-2016, 02:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jrboulder

I had a 2007 Jetta 2.5 5MT. Probably the best, least expensive (per mile) car I've ever had. I bought it at 102k and I sold it at 172k.

Things other than scheduled mx and tires:
2 sets of rear brake pads ($40)
refrigerant control valve ($60)
radiator fan assembly ($60)
1 ignition coil ($20)
coolant expansion tank ($20)

I doubt the 2.5 is as reliable as the I4 8-valve 2.0. The 2.5 has lots of known issues that never really got ironed out and is a pretty complicated motor. The old 2.0 plainly doesn't have junk like camshaft adjusters, oil fed vacuum pumps and timing chains,

How good of a drive is it with the next non-GTI/GLI suspension tuning? I know it's not going to be an E46, but if it's as good as my Accord (which is pretty decent) it's good enough.

I suppose the 2.0 is simpler, but I don't miss it. My girlfriend has an '04 Golf and between the engine and suspension and general Mark IV-ness it feels like a German Corolla, but without the reliability.

74-911 · 08-09-2016, 03:34 AM

Wife has a 2006 Mark V Jetta with the 2.5L 5 banger. 135000 on the clock and car has been absolutely bulletproof. The only thing done outside of normal maintenance ( which I do ) is a front brake job and a 4 wheel alignment. Absolutely no issues with engine, tranny, A/C of course as we all well know, YMMV.

Did have to replace the headliner however (a common problem at one point).

It is my understanding that the build quality, reliability, handling and performance etc. of Jettas really went down with the Mark VI but I have no personal experience with them.

1990C4S · 08-09-2016, 03:56 AM

I find a small trailer generally more useful and versatile than my old Volvo wagon. Easier to load a motor onto, easier to load garbage into, better for transporting bikes.

Maybe you just need a hitch a cheap trailer.

oldE · 08-09-2016, 04:03 AM

My MIL has an '06 2.5 with the 5 speed. I find it to be non inspiring. Last month I drove another with the DSG and it seemed far more eager to get up and boogie. I think it was because the transmission was so willing to drop two or three gears with a push of the throttle. I found I liked the 2.5 much more with the DSG than with the 5 speed.

Best
Les

1990C4S · 08-09-2016, 04:13 AM

The DSG is expensive to maintain at the dealer, and that cost diminishes to 'somewhat excessive' if you DIY.

Otter74 · 08-09-2016, 05:28 AM

Good suggestion on the trailer, but I'm not sure it's the best option for me. My garage space is tight and I really have no place to put a trailer. Besides that, I usually want to open a liftgate and toss stuff in, or put two bikes inside without using a roof rack, etc. When I took a big camping road trip in the Accord a couple of years ago, I would have slept in the car sometimes if I'd had a wagon.

Even if the base Jetta isn't any more inspiring than the Accord, there's plenty more choice for OE upgrade parts (from the GTI, etc.) if I were ever so inclined. There's stuff like short-runner intakes for the engine to help with power, though honestly I care more about highway fuel economy for a car like this than power. I have no interest in a DSG, and didn't the 2.5 come with a Tiptronic for years anyway? I like the DSG on my friend's Mk VI GTI, but I have no interest in the maintenance costs. I'm glad to hear the cars seem to be reliable, though.

bleucamaro · 08-09-2016, 06:25 AM

For the most part I love my 2013 Jetta wagon (TDI). I like that it uses the golf suspension instead of the jetta sedan suspension. I love the way it drives, I've put 120k miles on it. The steering has good feel, shifter has good feel, clutch is really easy to drive.

I do have some gripes:
The giant sunroof has creaked and groaned since day one.
The AC sucks and is getting worse (last time in for service they checked the pressures and it tested fine). It uses a swashplate design in the compressor instead of an oldschool clutch setup, and I think its faults are caused by a sensor.
I run moderately aggressive tires, and it has a lot of road/wind noise. Combining this with a not great mic for the bluetooth setup makes in car phone calls annoying.

I'll be selling mine back to VW. If you get one and want a set of H&R coilovers and VMR v710 wheels, let me know.

1990C4S · 08-09-2016, 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Otter74

Good suggestion on the trailer, but I'm not sure it's the best option for me. My garage space is tight and I really have no place to put a trailer.

For once a month or so renting a trailer is the cheapest option. Not the most convenient, but cheapest.

The best plan is to split one with a buddy who has space to park it.

scottmandue · 08-09-2016, 09:18 AM

If by Mazda5 you mean the mini van we have one and I love it. Same bullet proof drive train as the Mazda3. We are getting around 20mpg real world (city/highway) driving.

You can stack 6 foot 2x4's between the seats and still shut the rear hatch (don't tell my wife).

As with most things it is a compromise, good handling for a mini van but not as nice as a sedan.

but super roomy... I would like to try camping/sleeping in the back of it but haven't got around to doing that yet (I'm 5'10" and pretty sure I could lay out with a sleeping bag and the seats down).

Otter74 · 08-09-2016, 11:05 AM

Scott, what kind of mileage do you get on trips? I like the size, reliability and reported driving dynamics of them, but Mazda powertrains got only OK fuel economy until the current generation of engines came out a few years ago. I miss the effortless 33-35mpg of my Infiniti G20; I'd be OK with pushing-30, which is all my Accord can manage.

scottmandue · 08-09-2016, 11:45 AM

Ours is a 2013 and my wife's DD.
We took it on a road trip to Cambria (about 250 miles one way) I didn't write down the numbers but the car computer was showing around 25mpg (note there is a elevation change of around 350 to get over the hill to Buellton).

For caparison my DD is a 2015 Nissan Versa with a massive 1600cc engine that is hauling me to work and back @ 30mpg (could do better if I didn't have a lead foot).

Otter74 · 08-09-2016, 02:00 PM

My head says 'Japanese car' or 'something newish' and then my heart goes to stuff like this:

http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/cto/5723257333.html

What could possibly go wrong??

1990C4S · 08-10-2016, 04:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Otter74

My head says 'Japanese car' or 'something newish' and then my heart goes to stuff like this:

2002 Saab 9-5 Aero Wagon

What could possibly go wrong??

That looks awesome...

Otter74 · 08-10-2016, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1990C4S

That looks awesome...

If I had any space left in the garage (I don't) and the time to take off for a road trip (maybe) I would buy it just for fun and take a few months to decide what to keep and what to sell.