Home Depot and Menards Not Bringing the Wood

[Dantilla]

Just silly, but to get technical-

Anybody remember "significant figures" from high school?

1.5 rounds up to 2.
3.5 round up to 4.

If the lumber was called a 2.0 x 4.0 there might be an issue. But there isn't.

[dad911]

We no longer have a legal system that makes sense.

[legion]

Originally Posted by dad911

We no longer have a legal system that makes sense.

That's because it is run by lawyers.

[javadog]

Given that these sizes have been regulated by the government for decades and that they have historical reasons to be this way, based on how lumber is processed, and is something that anybody in the industry knows and accepts, I am surprised that there is a liberal judge in this country stupid enough to allow this horse**** to happen.

What's next, plywood thicknesses?

Someone should whack the judge in the back of his head, first with a "real 2x4," then with one of these "cheater 2x4s" and see if he considers the difference in size to be meaningful.


JR

[Pazuzu]

Most of you didn't actually read the article, did you?

The lawsuit isn't that the wood is smaller than 2x4 inches.
The lawsuit is that *some* of the wood at the store is sold as (for example) "1x6 (3/4 x 5 1/2 inch nominal size)" while some is sold as "2x4".

The lawsuit is that there is an expectation that the wood without the nominal size clarification should then be sold at full size, not nominal size. The idea is that the normal person, seeing some wood listed with two sizes and some listed with one size would assume that there are two different sizing standards being applied. In fact, there is one sizing standard, and two sales standards applied.

It's still frivolous, but it doesn't involve a bunch of people thinking that 2x4 studs are actually 2 inches by 4 inches.

[Tobra]

Actually, that is exactly what it is about.

First paragraph of the article in the OP:

Two home improvements stores are accused of deceiving the buyers of four-by-four boards, the big brother to the ubiquitous two-by-four.

The alleged deception: Menards and Home Depot (HD) market and sell the hefty lumber as four-by-fours without specifying that the boards actually measure 3½ inches by 3½ inches.

What the law talking dude said

However, Turin and his clients dispute that the differences between nominal descriptions and actual dimensions are common knowledge.

“It’s difficult to say that for a reasonable consumer, when they walk into a store and they see a label that says four-by-four, that that’s simply — quote unquote — a trade name,” Turin said in an interview

Fact of the matter is, it has been the industry standard for my entire life.

[Pazuzu]

At least continue quoting the important parts.

Turin said his clients don’t argue that the retailers’ four-by-fours (and, in the Menards’ case, a one-by-six board as well) are not the correct size under the standards published by the U.S. Department of Commerce. The product labels, however, should disclose that those are “nominal” designations and not actual sizes, Turin said.

Therefore, lawsuit is not claiming that lumber is undersized.

With some of Menards’ lumber products, both the nominal and actual size are shown, a document Turin filed in the case against Menards says. But the lumber in question is labeled only with a nominal size — "4 x 4 — 10’," for example — that consists of numbers “arranged in a way to represent the dimensions of the products,” the document says. That leaves the “average consumer” to conclude that the pieces measure four inches by four inches, Turin said.

Lawsuit is that the stores are using two different sizing schemes, and therefore causing confusion. Just like I said.

[javadog]

It's only confusing to stupid people and stupid people should not be allowed to work on their houses in the first place. If you don't know what you're doing, don't do it. Hire somebody that is trained to do it.

That's why you don't find me down at the courthouse in the afternoon, trying a legal case, or at the hospital doing orthopedic surgery.

Given that we have billions of books and a sizable body of knowledge called the Internet, if you can't figure out how to do something as simple as buying lumber, I don't feel like society owes you a goddamn thing.

So how are these idiots harmed? Did they get cheated out of a little wood, or is this trying to fix pain and suffering caused by all of their mental confusion?

JR

[wayner]

Originally Posted by RKDinOKC

These lawyers would stop this crap is the companies would countersue for court costs at the least. But guess that's not in the best interests of the lawyers working for the companies.

But you guys kicked out the British along with those sorts of laws that Canada enjoys

[wayner]

Muzzling the repeat offenders:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vexatious_litigation

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2016/06/21/lawyer-held-liable-for-legal-costs-of-frivolous-action.html

and

also this which is in addition to Vexatious litigation
"Unlike in the United States, the general rule in Canada is that the successful party is entitled to be compensated for at least some of its legal costs (i.e. fees and disbursements) by the losing party"

Canadian & U.S. Litigation Differences | Practice Areas | Dickinson Wright

The U.S. is a scary place sometimes.

[cabmandone]

Originally Posted by Pazuzu

Lawsuit is that the stores are using two different sizing schemes, and therefore causing confusion. Just like I said.

What confusion? Anyone not knowing that a 2x4 doesn't actually measure 2x4 and needs it to be labeled as "nominal" has no business handling a 2x4 let alone the tools needed to install one.

[cabmandone]

I'm taking my car to a dyno tomorrow! Ford! You better lawyer up.

[wayner]

Subway got hit for their shorter than 6" subs, why not the 2x4 people :-)

[JJ 911SC]

Originally Posted by wayner

Subway got hit for their shorter than 6" subs, why not the 2x4 people :-)

So they should have... Back in 65, 6" was 6" SUBWAY® Timeline | SUBWAY.com - No Country Name (English)

I remember when you could get a franchise for $35K

[Porsche-poor]

They should buy pipe. Up thru 12" you get more than you paid for. A 6" pipe is actually 6-5/8".

[JJ 911SC]

Originally Posted by Porsche-poor

They should buy pipe. Up thru 12" you get more than you paid for. A 6" pipe is actually 6-5/8".

Outside dimension? 6" + 5/16" wall thickness

[drcoastline]

Originally Posted by javadog

Given that these sizes have been regulated by the government for decades and that they have historical reasons to be this way, based on how lumber is processed, and is something that anybody in the industry knows and accepts, I am surprised that there is a liberal judge in this country stupid enough to allow this horse**** to happen.

What's next, plywood thicknesses?

Someone should whack the judge in the back of his head, first with a "real 2x4," then with one of these "cheater 2x4s" and see if he considers the difference in size to be meaningful.


JR

Why is that I green?

[Dantilla]

At most professional lumberyards, You give them your order, and the yard guys gather everything up, and there ya go, out the door with whatever they gave you.

Home Depot is different-
The customer sees the product and price on the rack.
The customer picks up the product and puts it on the cart
The customer wheels the cart up to checkout, then puts the product in the vehicle.

To then claim "I didn't know what size it was" can only come from:
A) An idiot
2) someone looking for a payoff, no matter how low they must stoop.

[john70t]

"The court finds the customer was able to pick up and measure dimensions in the store prior to any purchase.
Customer declined to use a tape measure in store, twice, and failed to inspect the product.
Customer's own negligence is the fault of customer.

Customer was able to fully return product at no financial loss to himself.

Being grown adults and fully unaware of common industry standards of the last half century fully supports the argument that customer suffered no financial loss as a professional.

Furthering that, this customer does not qualify to represent the professional building industry in general and is unqualified to initiate a class action on it's behalf.

In conclusion, the judgement of this court is the lawsuit is of frivolous nature.
Defendant's costs will be born by the plaintiff, and the plaintiff's attorney will have punitive sanctions of the same amount and disbarred for six months."

[drops the gavel and walks away]

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by ossiblue

I think this last quote from the article says it all:

Asked whether it was coincidence that three different men found the same sort of issue with lumber first at Menards and then at Home Depot, and then all decided to go to McGuire Law, Turin said he couldn’t comment.

“It’s kind of attorney-client privilege in terms of how the clients were retained, and the circumstances of our retainer of them,” he said. “They did freely come to us.”

Ambulance chasers.

Makes you wonder if they waited for a complaint or were out of work, sitting around over drinks and decided that if they could find (hire) some guys to be "plaintiffs" they could get a nice payout. It would be hard to find 3 guys willing to act like they are idiots if they got paid well for it.
The whole thing reeks of scam.