‘89 Targa front wheel size

[Another911]

I’m a newbie to more complex auto mechanics, but decided it’s time to get really dirty with my recently acquired 89 Targa. This is my first post. I’ve had a few late night post readings regarding wheel sizes, set-backs and spacers. Most are related to rear wheels. I’m happy with my 16 x 8’s on back, but really don’t like the front “flat-faced” 6’s on the front. I bought Euromeister 7’s for front, and now realize they don’t fit within the wheel well. I’d estimate the tire wall is 3/8” outside fender. My understanding is that all 6 and 7’s have 23.3 setbacks. There doesn’t appear to be a spacer in place that I can remove to free up space for the 7’s. Is there a fix to this problem?

[75 911s]

Welcome! Let’s see a picture of that Targa. You did not mention tire size and that is probably the issue. A 205/50 will work on a standard 16x7 Fuchs or Fuchs style 23.3 ET in front and you can even get fairly low.

[Another911]

I have 205 Potenzas on the front. I was even wondering if 195s would work, but that would help only half the overhang problem.
I’m also in middle of Targa bar restoration. Just had the skin powder coated in satin. It looks really good, with enough texture to blend in with vinyl top. Next step is to cut and glue vinyl for targa bar trim.

[76FJ55]

The original 16x6 would have been 36mm offset. should be forged into the back side of the spokes if you want to look to confirm.

[Pigeye]

subscribed - I want to move my stock 16x7 Fuchs from front to rear and get some 16x8's for the back. had been worried about having to roll the front fender (don't want to do that) and if 205/50s work up there w/o hassle, then great!

Anyone have some period correct 16x8 Fuchs? 87 Carrera black spokes, brushed lips.

[darrin]

Another 911 -- believe that porsche 944s could also be provisioned with 16x7 fuchs and can't recall off hand whether there was an offset difference for that wheel. A porsche 911 offset 16x7 fuchs should fit properly up front and, as indicated below, should work fine after rolling the inner fender lips

Pigeye -- short answer on need to roll front fender lips with 16x7 fuchs and 205/50-16 tires is a definite "maybe"

My left front didn't rub when I switched to 16x7 continental extreme contact dw tires, but my right front did - rolling the lips on both helped somewhat, but still got some scraping on sidewall of my right front tire.

Wore out the continentals and now run michelin AS3+ tires, which seem to be a hair narrower than the continentals and do not rub at all for me.

Keep in mind that if you don't roll fender lip and the tires rub, they'll likely pull the fender lip further out in the process.

[Another911]

Just realized the pics didn’t go through on my first post. Here they are:

[Another911]

76FJ55 - you nailed it. Contrary to the Fuch charts posted, my 16 x 7’s are 36 sb. I guess I conclude that hub/caliber configuration will not take 7’s without rolling fenders. Does anyone have a pic of a 16 x 6’s with 23.3sb?

[darrin]

another911, sounds like you need to find a pair of 16x7 fuchs with the factory 23.3mm offset/setback --

[Bill Verburg]

All 7x16 Porsche Fuchs have the same ET, 23.3 Doesn't matter if they were 911 or 944 versions.

If you 7 had ET 36 it would sit inboard much further than ET23.3

They do usually fit w/ 205/55 or 205/50 tires, but it is close and the lower the car the more likely that some work will be needed on the lips.

That said 911s they are not all exactly the same. Yours does appear to poke out a bit more than usual for some reason. Are you sure its a 7? 944 8s will look like that.

[RedCoupe]

Bill's comment that not all 911s are the same is right on! My 86 Targa has 16x7 Euromeisters on the front with 205 Continentals on it with no problem whatsoever. The car is even lowered a fair amount.

[Another911]

So guys, I screwed up in my last post. My old 6’s are 39 sb. They fit perfectly, so going going to 7’s with 23 sb is where the problem lies. 🤔

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by Another911

So guys, I screwed up in my last post. My old 6’s are 39 sb. They fit perfectly, so going going to 7’s with 23 sb is where the problem lies. 🤔

maybe, but you are still off wrt some details

Facts for Fuchs
all 6 have ET36
all 7 have ET23.3

yes, the outer lip of the 7 sits 74.5mm more outboard than for the 6, but again this is usually fine

7x15 ET23.3 has been an oe fit in front for some 911 models

[darrin]

bill -- since it now sounds like the OP purchased the right size/offset rims, any thoughts on why the OP's front wheels look so far off (his last foto shows the 205/55-16 front tire mounted on the 7x16 fuchs replica sitting outside of the fender lip)? could this be something out of spec that can be addressed/rectified by a 911-knowledgeable alignment shop?

another911 -- do you have the same issue/problem on both sides, or is one more pronounced/extreme than the other?

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by darrin

bill -- since it now sounds like the OP purchased the right size/offset rims, any thoughts on why the OP's front wheels look so far off (his last foto shows the 205/55-16 front tire mounted on the 7x16 fuchs replica sitting outside of the fender lip)? could this be something out of spec that can be addressed/rectified by a 911-knowledgeable alignment shop?

another911 -- do you have the same issue/problem on both sides, or is one more pronounced/extreme than the other?

I have no idea

Some possibilities
if it's a replica wheel it may have a different o/s
there could be chassis damage
it could be just off from the production line
it may not even be a 7

here's a pic of my C3 which came oe w/ 7ET23.3 205/50x15 fronts it now has 8Et25 225/45 x17, the reason I show this is that these wheels stick out 11mm further than the 7ET23.3, and yes they fit fine w/o any interference

[darrin]

thx bill - something indeed sounds "off" here -- wonder what the OP would find if he mounted one of his original 16x8 rear wheels up front for testing purposes -- i.e. would it stick out even further (as one would expect if conducting this test with "real"/known 16x7 and 16x8 911 offset fuchs) or ???? (which could shed light on the issue he's having with his euromeisters)

[Another911]

Thx Bill and Darrin for your contributions! Both left and right wheels have same problem. Coincidentally, while I was in process of swapping wheels, I did have the 8’s on the front and the problem was worse as you would expect. The math explains it: the center line moves out 22.7mm going from 6s to 7s, plus 16 mm going from 39 to 23. Total 39mm is 3/4 of an inch. This wouldn’t be a problem if the 6’s were combined with spacers that could be removed for the 7’s. Could you guys look at the hub pic again. It looks long to me, but is needed to cover the caliper.

[RedCoupe]

Another911,
Just got home and shot a couple of pictures of my 86 Targa with its 7x16 Euros shod with 205/50s. Its definitely more in the fender than yours.

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by Another911

Thx Bill and Darrin for your contributions! Both left and right wheels have same problem. Coincidentally, while I was in process of swapping wheels, I did have the 8’s on the front and the problem was worse as you would expect. The math explains it: the center line moves out 22.7mm going from 6s to 7s, plus 16 mm going from 39 to 23. Total 39mm is 3/4 of an inch. This wouldn’t be a problem if the 6’s were combined with spacers that could be removed for the 7’s. Could you guys look at the hub pic again. It looks long to me, but is needed to cover the caliper.

That's a stock late 9111 front hub

911 8s have ET10.6
944 8s have ET23.3, these are the ones that people sometimes squeeze on to the front. It's not a happy fit but it can be done.

the 911 8s w/ ET10.6 project out board 12.7mm more than the 911 8s

just for comparison here are the front spaces of the various factory Fuchs
6 ET36 49.1mm
7ET23.3 74.5mm
8ET23.3 87.2mm
8ET30 82.5mm these are the usual front 911 fit +/- a few mm on the ET and right around the max
8ET10.6 99.9mm these are a no go on a regular 911

[Pigeye]

Originally Posted by darrin

Another 911 -- believe that porsche 944s could also be provisioned with 16x7 fuchs and can't recall off hand whether there was an offset difference for that wheel. A porsche 911 offset 16x7 fuchs should fit properly up front and, as indicated below, should work fine after rolling the inner fender lips

Pigeye -- short answer on need to roll front fender lips with 16x7 fuchs and 205/50-16 tires is a definite "maybe"

My left front didn't rub when I switched to 16x7 continental extreme contact dw tires, but my right front did - rolling the lips on both helped somewhat, but still got some scraping on sidewall of my right front tire.

Wore out the continentals and now run michelin AS3+ tires, which seem to be a hair narrower than the continentals and do not rub at all for me.

Keep in mind that if you don't roll fender lip and the tires rub, they'll likely pull the fender lip further out in the process.

I'm running 205/55's on the stock 16x6 now - zero issues. So bring the 16x7 from rear and going 205/50 would/could require rolling fender?