A Porsche 911 Newbie with some questions

[Corgwn]

Hello to all members of this forum,

I've heard so many good things about this place I thought I would send out a shot. A close family friend has given me his '74 911 Targa as a wedding gift. I still haven't picked it up. It has been garage kept since 1978 when he purchased it. It hasn't been started since 1993 (10 years).

He told me it was running well until then. I don't have many specifics yet, including mileage. It is green and I do know that the body is in excellent condition. He told me that the car was running well up until the time it went into storage.

My questions to the members here are these; What needs to be done before I install the battery and turn her over? I imagine it will need new tires, new belts, rubber hoses, and fluid changes, but is there something else I'm missing. What will need to be checked out after I've got here started and moving?

I remember driving in this car as a child and thinking it was the coolest thing on 4 wheels.

Any help or tips would be helpful. Also if there are any things in particular I need to check on this "midyear" 911.

I currently own a C5 Corvette, but have ALWAYS lusted after 911's. It's a different world though, especially when the car is nearly 30 years old.

Thanks,



Mike

[BGCarrera32]

As for specifics before startup, others will most likely have better tips than I. But I will tell you to buy a copy of "101 Projects for Your Porsche 911" (available from Pelican Parts) for valuable maintenance info. You'll most likely want to do the things you've mentioned, plus a valve adjustment and transmission oil change.

Even though you aren't buying the car but getting it as a gift, you might consider a pre-purchase inspection from a shop that knows 911's. Avoid the "German car expert" or the dealer, and find a shop that really knows older 911s. They'll be much better at seeing trouble spots, looking at the suspension, checking cylinder head studs, etc. You might look for a contact at your local Porsche club chapter, and ask a few people for a shop that really knows their stuff. After the PPI you'll know what is good and what might need your attention sooner rather than later.

Good luck and have fun!
-BG

[john_colasante]

They say never look a gift-horse in the mouth - but there is an exception. If that horse happens to be a mid-year 911 that has not been started in 10 years. You may be in for a fistful of bills. Not to say your friend isn't extremely generous, just proceed with caution...

[McDaniel]

And I am finishing up a 'ground up' restoration.
First of all, drain and dispose of any fuel left in the tank.
You will find that if fuel was left in the car, the lines, pump,
fuel distribution head, injectors, WUR and all parts will have a
monster coating of varnish. You will need to dissasamble all
and clean.
Drain the oil from the tank and case. Install new oil filter, fill
partially with clean oil, maybe 2 or 2 1/2 gallons before you
ever turn the engine over.
New spark plugs...
And good luck.
Lots of guys put the knock on the '74 2.7 but I have owned
this one for 20+ years and if a tree hadn't fallen on it...
it wouldn't have been out of service for 9 years.
Please feel free to mail me if you have any specific questions
I can help with...

[jabb]

if the car was stored with an empty gas tank or near empty tank there is probably lots of rust built up in the tank. Take a look inside with a flash light if this is the case you will want to pull the tank and have it relined. Running with a rusty tank will give you lots of driveability issues. Another thing to watch out for is on the top of the engine behind the Alternator this is where little critters like to build nests... You will want to remove the Alternator an have a look around in there for any nests and remove them.... this can lead to overheating the cylinders and engine damage. The 101 projects book as mentioned before would be very helpful with Alternator removal. Also there is a Tech article on this site that describes the Alternator R&R procedure..... Good Luck.
Oh and BTW Welcome...

[Corgwn]

Thanks for the tips guys! It looks as though I'll have my hands full. I'm looking at it as a long term project, but I hope it won't be too overly involved or expensive.

I'm going to order the 101 Projects for your Porsche 911 booklet today. You're tips are very helpful and I'll keep you updated. Hopefully, I can get a good picture up soon.

Regards,



Mike

[juanbenae]

hopefully this new wife of yours is an understanding sort.....

[mchang]

I was kind of a newbie. I left my '74 for 8 years once. Instead of risking anything, I flatbedded it to a knowledgable shop and told them the situation. They went through it - draining gas, changing oil, flushing this and oiling that BEFORE installing a battery and turning it over. I think they even got oil pressure before firing it. I think it was $300 well spent, especially considering some things I never thought of, like checking and topping off the tranny fluid (hmmm), freeing up the clutch (Double hmmm) and oiling and working the throttle and other cables to make sure it didn't stick WFO on first fire (triple hmmmmm!).

Just another option...

[Jim Richards]

Another thing to watch out for is on the top of the engine behind the Alternator this is where little critters like to build nests...

I'm surprised cleaning out the nest never made into Wayne's 101 Project book.

[Porschephanatic]

mmmmmmmmm........fried mice!

[jazzbass]

Wow.... on one hand - cool! free Porsche! on the other hand... its '74 2.7 that's sat for 10 years. The very first thing you need to do is taste the oil - that should let you know what kind of condition the is in.

What I would do is this - have it towed to a reputable Porsche mechanic for a PGI (post-gift inspection) - just like a PPI you'd get if you were buying. Find out, day 1, what you're in for. 74s weren't galvanized, so it could be rusty as hell. Sitting for 10 years does lots of bad things to a car - including ruining the MFI, gas tank, tires and all rubber on the car, brakes, and so on. You could be looking at a minor repair to get it running, or > $10,000. Unless you're an old salt Porsche mechanic, you won't know just by looking.

Unless the car has amazing sentimental value (it was your Dad's) or you love to restore old, big-bumpered ungalvanized Porsches for some masochistic reason, you might be better off selling the car (or parting it out) and using the money towards buying a later model SC or Carrera - that is, if the car has a lot of problems (and cars that sit usually do). Prices on these cars are really dropping these days, with many good cars in the $10k-$15k range. In the end, you might be a lot better off - the last thing you want to do is fall down the slippery slope of throwing good moeny after bad in hope fixing up a car that, in good condition, is probably worth less than $10k.

[Porschephanatic]

I'd have to agree w/ Chris. My car sat 8-9 yrs before I bought it, but I paid a reputable mechanic to evaluate it so I knew what I was in for. I've got $20k+(and still going) in a car worth $15k, but I plan on keeping it for a very long time, and I have no regrets.

[mchang]

Oh, yeah. The mouse-nest thing. I forgot. Before I had the flat-bed show up, I spent a relatively enjoyable afternoon going through every nook and cranny with the shop vac. Found, uhm, a dozen (?) mouse nests and several caches of seeds. One nest the size of a basketball in the front well, since I had so conveniently left a towel in the (front) trunk for nest material. Astonishing nest. Anyway, I cleaned it up so the mechanics wouldn't spend time (at $90/hr) doing the stuff I could do and they could get at everything relatively easily. Still, when they fired it up, it shot birdseed out of the muffler so hard, one guy two bays away had a piece of it lodge in his neck. Now they all take cover when a garage hermit is about to be relit. Anti-mousing is still a three day activity every fall here in the heartland.

Also, when you drag it to the Porsche shop, ask for three prices. One, the bare minimum to get it road worthy and licensable. Two, to get it reliable and running well. Three, to get it right. In my case (like you, with the dreaded 2.7), #1 was about $500 (re-awakening, new plugs and such, oil change, tranny fluid change, CIS/general tune-up). #2 was triple that, and #3 was, well, it included a new engine, so it can get a little hairy. I chose #1, and then did most of the other stuff myself. You have to BOND with your ride, get to know her, massage her, etc. Reawakening her and then working with her is the best way i can think of. Then, someday soon, you'll be whispering "Ich liebe dich" to her late at night.

[Corgwn]

MChang,

Thanks for the advice. Yeah, the dreaded midyear 2.7. Well we'll see. I don't think the birdnest situation should be as bad since it's been in a pretty nice garage connected to home, but you never know. I will also take your advice on getting 3 quotes. I was willing to go as high as $2000 or so to get her roadworthy. We'll see.

Since this has always been a nice weather North Carolina car I'm hoping the body is as clean as I remember.

I'll keep you posted and hopefully have some pictures up soon.

Thanks,



Mike

[Calspeed]

Hello and congratulations to you and yours...

Anytime a car sits for that long you will need to go through it fairly thoroughly. There are many things to check and to be aware of. The fuel tank issue is certainly a big one. If it isnt rusted out in the tank you may just have some "stinky" stale fuel. Do not fire it up with this fuel. It needs to be drained and disposed of properly. And do not drain it in the garage. Only outside in a well vented area. There is also fuel in the lines and in the carbs. More likely then not the fuel has varnished over and the carbs will need a thorough going over. The fuel loines may need to be cleaned out too. But maybe not. But do not blow out these fuel parts with compressed air as there is still a chance of explosion.

The brakes may be locked up too. And if they are not and the car rolls be prepared to have leaky gaskets. Most of the rubber parts will be worn and dried up and will probably need replacing soon.

I think it is a good idea to have it towed to a shop for the check up. But if you are like me or most of the folks on The Forum you will want to try and fire it up yourself. Well, if you really have to...

Drain fuel and replace. Clean the carbs out with carb cleaner. Drain and refill the oil. Also replace the filter. Prime the new filter with alittle oil too. You will need to have at least 9-10 quarts on board before you fire it up. Pull the plugs and replace. Also have a fresh battery ready. Change the points, condensor, distributor cap and rotor. Plug wires may be okay but if you are going to change them you might as well do that now also. How about a new coil? Spend a buck for crying out loud!

Before you replace the plugs you can also place about a tablespoon of oil in each of the cylinders. I was told that this would give alittle coating for the initial firing. I used the "Marvels Mystery Oil" which was also recommended to me. Let this oil work its way for several hours. You can get the rest of the stuff done during this time.

Okay... When you turn it over for the first time make sure the coil lead is disconnected. You will want to turn the motor over gently. I prefer to do it manually. It seems much more gentle. You can do this by pushing it in while in fifth gear. Make sure you have someone ready to apply the brakes before it rolls away from you.

A few safety things to consider is that the throttle cable and linkage work well and will not lock up at full throttle. Always be prepared to turn the key off for any such emergency.

If you have a battery charger with a 60A booster you can also hook that up so you dont kill you battery too soon. Okay... place the key in the ignition... get your video camera ready... place your digital camera on video mode... and FIRE AWAY!

My guess that with these durable Porsche motors you will be able to get it to fire. It may run horrible and stink terribly. It may even smoke alittle. This was the procedure that I used to fire up an old Ford Bronco that sat for over 12 years in a carport in the City. It cranked over for awhile and then fire up and sounded sick. Now the Bronco is a daily driver with no problems. Didnt need a rebuild. Just brake work.

Good luck and please keep us informed. We are excited for you!

Michael "Calspeed" Carion

ps: now that you got it started the real work begins. Be prepared to visit the Forum often for more information.

ps again... Dont forget to check the coolant level.

[gr8fl4porsche]

Originally posted by Corgwn
I hope it won't be too overly involved or expensive.

I believe everyone on this board can agree on two things,

1. We all love our 911's
2. Most projects get overly involved and very expensive!

[Corgwn]

Michael,

Thanks for the tips! You should be a writer! Everyone on this board has been so helpful, I feel like I'm on my way. I'm planning on having it towed directly to a Porsche specialist to check it out, but your tips are great.

Thanks,


Mike

[weber92037]

I got a Cessna Skylane that had not been run for almost 20 years. Put oil in under pressure until it started and it has run (flown) just fine for the last five years.