a fear we all (should) have
 

I'll start by saying that for nearly five years my old 912E has been a dead reliable car. The only problems I have had with it have been the result of hurdles encountered during upgrades and unnecessary projects. Through rain, snow, autocrosses, summer heat, traffic, etc., it has been a great car.

But it caught fire today.

At first I noticed the tach and temp gauges flickering wildly. Then I smelled the smoke. Fortunately, I was on my way home and no more than 1/8 mile from my house when I realized what was likely to be going on--fire.

Amidst a cloud of stinky smoke, I pulled into my driveway, popped open the engine cover and saw flames near the firewall on the passenger side... right by Weber carb which was of course full of gas and fed by a rubber fuel line.......

I ran to the garage and grabbed the nearest fire extinguisher... but it didn't work. Dead.

To the kitchen.

Grabbed the fire extinguisher on the kitchen counter and ran outside where my car was still burning. I pulled the trigger and filled my engine bay with powdery yellow fire extinguisher discharge. No Halon system in the 912E, you see.

I called my insurance company first (after I concluded the fire was truly out and there was no need to call the local firemen). They said I'm covered for such a fire. Sigh of relief.

Then I started to look around. It looks like the wiring harness itself was on fire. It is a melted mess on the inside of the engine bay as well as below it where it leads to my alternator (remember, 912E has a T4 motor and the alternator is below the engine tin).

Now my engine bay is a serious mess. I don't know if/how to clean it all out properly without taking everything out of the bay. I don't exactly know what is in a fire extinguisher and what effect it would have on an internal combustion engine since the dust will likely be in there for awhile unless I gut the sucker and power wash it.

Here's the kicker; I'm going to Watkins Glen for the R Gruppe meet and vintage races tomorrow. My roommate and I were planning on a little caravan (my 912 and his 72 911). I'm glad it happened in my driveway and not on the road somewhere!

What have I already learned? We all should have a small fire extinguisher in the car. At times, I have carried one. But not today. And, if this had occurred anywhere but where it did my car could have been a charred mess. More importantly, it could have lead to serious damage to the property of others. Fortunately it did not. But it sure isn't hard to carry an extinguisher.

And, I have a question for those of you who have been down this road. What's the strategy with the insurance company? Should I be concerned that the car is not stock? After all, I have Webers as well as more than a few other mods. I'm just wondering if this will be grounds for State Farm to try to get out of coverage.

Anyone with experience in this kind of situation?

Thanks guys!

I'd stay quiet about the webbers and any other mods. If they are so informed about Porsches to know the Webbers etc arn't standard say to them the origional parts are no longer available and these were the parts recommended by the supplier.

Sorry to hear about the fire!

Wow Dave. Sorry about the fire...good thing you could put it out. I have three fire extinguishers in the garage...one in the 911. Too many close calls in the past with other cars.

Maybe it's an opportunity for a motor upgrade. Good luck with the insurance comp.

Hum...

I'm actually working for State Farm. Thanks for the hints. I'll look for your reclamation.

Ciao,

Alain

What is that supposed to mean?

Well, if he does work for SF..he knows the value of the car right?

What do you guess?

Not to mention the fact that the reason for the Webers and the non-stock exhaust is exactly for the reason mentioned by Bill... that 912E-specific parts are hard if not impossible to locate. When I bought the car it already had a Weber carb conversion and aftermarket exhaust. I'd tend to think the original thermal reactors were more of a fire hazard anyway!

I'm not into guessing games and State Farm shouldn't be either. My car has been available for inspection since the day I bought it. Premiums are paid, car is legally registered, it passes state inspection and emissions without fail each year and so on.

I'm not looking to get away with anything, it's not worth it. I'm simply preparing myself for the eventual ream job that people in the insurance industry seem to enjoy. Guess we've got a reamer here on the BBS too.

sleeper..your profile says EE. The man needs sympathy at a time like this...not aggrevation.

Souk: didn't you know that State Farm employs EEs for investigating car fires?

"sleeper..your profile says EE. The man needs sympathy at a time
like this...not aggrevation."

Not to mention the fact that the reason I posted was also to encourage others to buy themselves a fire extinguisher!

Thanks Souk.

Perfect. Then you can come and confirm what caused mine and then write me a check to replace the wiring harness on a 912E. That should be fun.

Ok, Ok,... sympathy is needed.

I am NOT working for State Farm.

Dave: I sincerely apologize for this... this is a hard time for you and I shouldn't have done what I did.

I appreciate your initial post. In fact, I just bought an extinguisher today for my Targa.

Best of luck,

Alain

Dave sorry to hear about the incident. You are actually fortunate, it sounds like the fire was small and contained.

Your experience should be a wake up call to all of us. We need to keep on top of the fuel hoses. Some of these are 30+ year old, dry, brittle, waiting to leak fuel. If your fuel hoses haven't been replaced, do it now. Replace all of them, any rubber all the way back to the tank.

I've been amazed at how lax some people are about minor fuel leaks around hoses and clamps. This is a disaster waiting to happen. When I was shopping for my '73 I had to fix some leaks before I was willing to take it for a test drive! Then there was the battery with no tie down strap, waiting to short out the positive terminal. But that's another story.

Edit: Alain, you beat me to it with your post, but I still want this on record for those agents lurking:

That's fine sleeper, but I don't know too many EE's that can fully trouble shoot an entire system of electro-mechanical-pnuematic sub-systems, let a lone diagnose the failure of such systems. Perhaps you can, but for every expert opinion, there is always another.

I don't think Dave or Bill were trying to put one over on a claim agent as you might have taken a personal offense to.

Consider this: If a 911 owner was to fully document his/her restoration and customization of a car, would you still write that claimant a check for a Blue Book value or what every bench mark you use?

When folks pay their premium on time and at what insurance companies ask for (usually too much), why is it that when the worst happens and the policy owner is feeling their worst, that you and those in the insurance industry seem to have left your heart at the house?

Lets face it, insurance is an industry based on fear...and nothing else. We pay and are required to pay by our law makers (makes the insurance comps very happy). Your company is happy we pay, and they get rich off of it. Why continue the ill feelings toward the industry when you have an opportunity to help a fellow enthusiast..or just offer kind words?

Dave...past the bar and stick it to them..

Sorry sleeper, but I have paid more than my car is worth over the years for insurance, and I hope that if I were in Dave's situation, my agent and claim agent have more humanity than some that I have run into.

Dave,

Sorry for your loss. :( I do hope you will be made whole again.

What you had happen to you is one my larger fears. I have always carried fire extingushers in all of my cars for jus tthis reason.

As far as insurance, I have been with SF for ages and I have always felt they gave me a fair shake. If you haven't already, contact your agent, let him know what happened and what you need. Have him tell you what they will do next.

When my '67 912 was rear ended, one of the things I learned was that the adjustors do not have very good data on the costs of these older cars. You might want to do some research to establish a price for your car from national ads. When the adjuster comes, give him your data with a firm statement of what you want from him (repair, replacement, cash etc). If you are asking for something reasonable, the adjuster wil most likely help you get this closed out to your satifaction as you have already done alot of his job for him. It worked for me. :)

Good luck. Hope it turns out ok for you.

SmileWavy

Thanks Chuck,

I agree with you 100% and I am usually careful. My fire was, I believe, electrical and not due to leaking fuel lines. I'm still not sure exactly how it started but fuel wasn't on fire in the car by the time I managed to contain it.

All of my fuel lines are new within the last year. The fittings and clamps are all new too. I check them religously for any seepage. I disassemble and clean out the carbs, check that the float action and needle valves work well quite often, especially during the summer for performance as well as safety reasons.

Thanks Harry. Good advice. I'll keep you all posted.

Dave,

Sorry about your fire. Having first hand experience with engine compartment fires, I can sympathize:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads/rearshot.jpg

Don't back down with your insurance company. Make sure you get what you need before you settle. It may take a little while.