Trends in the air cooled world over the last 5-10 years?

[sugarwood]

I got my 911 about 10 years ago.
The first 5 years, I did some basic maintenance DIY, joined a few PCA treks, went to some car shows like C&C in CT,
befriended some local 911 guys, and did a few DE events each summer.
911 was a positive addition to my life that I am grateful for.

Over the next few years, around 2014-2018, air cooled cars became more popular.
Was there change in the air?
Magnus got some attention.
Younger buyers entered the game.
Youtube car channels jumped on the train.
Veterans lamented diaper polishers, focus on originality, BAT auctions with high prices.
Repairs supposedly got more costly.

In the last 5 years, I haven't done much with my 911.
Don't drive it as much, no DE or car shows.
Not really active on Pelican.
911 has not been a big factor in my life.

I've been out of the loop, and am curious, what has the culture been like since around 2018?
What technical and maintenance trends have you noticed?
What is the repair and maintenance scene like?

Cultural changes? Demographics?
Are air cooled still as desired as they were in 2014-2018?
Water cooled car got more respect in the last 10 years, for sure.
Is DE more or less popular than it was 5 years ago?
What is the marketplace like? Were prices still rising from 2018 to March 2020?

Any changes you've noticed since around 2018?

[MrBonus]

Everyone wants an air cooled car and everything is more expensive. It's hard to get into qualified shops and major maintenance/repair/rebuild items are eye-wateringly expensive.

[silverc4s]

Originally Posted by MrBonus

Everyone wants an air cooled car and everything is more expensive. It's hard to get into qualified shops and major maintenance/repair/rebuild items are eye-wateringly expensive.

AND: more marginally salvageable early cars are being resurrected and sold on a place called BAT for truly crazy dollars in many cases.

[PeteKz]

Go to BaT and see what recent sales have been. Keep your air cooled 911. Given recent inflation, it's better than money in the bank.

[Hnichols]

Like you I got my 911 about a decade ago -- actually it's more like 13 years -- yikes! Anyway, my impression is that the increased values of our cars as changed the culture, from the DIY enthusiast spirit to the investor/collector mentality. It's typified by the whole BAT phenomenon (which I dislike). I never see air-cooled 911's on the road any more. I know they're out there, but it seems that people aren't driving them.

[jrwilson]

One important difference is that both original cars and highly modified ones are bringing similar dollars, which is very different from a lot of other European cars where originality trumps all. I've seen multiple g-body backdates go for $200K plus on BaT now, which tells me it's more about the mystique and drivability than having a dusty garage trophy.

As for never seeing them on the road, given that they're all 30+ years old or more at this point, and they were never mass-produced (they made 2,436 of my car total for example), it's really not much of a surprise you don't see them. I remember a time in the 80's / 90's when I would see Firebirds and Camaros *everywhere* since they made hundreds of thousands of those and I never see them either!

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by MrBonus

Everyone wants an air cooled car and everything is more expensive. It's hard to get into qualified shops and major maintenance/repair/rebuild items are eye-wateringly expensive.

+1

In addition the good shops are hamstrung by parts and technician availability, they all seem to have a death row of often late model let alone a/c cars waiting for parts

[ADDvanced]

I bought mine in 2013 for under 5k..... thing was sort of a pile, but it was complete/ran and drove. Today that same car is now probably 20-25k+, which is just stupid. It used to be "All 911s were 25k cars, you just can buy one at 25k or get a cheap one and spend 25k" but now it seems like that number is getting closer to 40k.

In terms of trends, I think the godawful RWB trend is dying out a bit, thank god. Such hack jobs. I like my car, but the price of them doesn't make sense anymore and I don't know if I'd ever suggest ownership to another person unless they had a LOT of money.

[jrwilson]

2013 was ten years ago! A lot has happened since then.

[tdskip]

Happily I can report that in Orange County at least I see 911s out being used very frequently, so depends on where you live and seasonality.

I'd suggest that at least part of why early Porsche prices are strong because compared to similar vintage cars they 1) tend to stay fixed once fixed 2) parts availability is outstanding and 3) while busy there are still shops that know how to work on the cars. All of that make them a pragmatic choice...

[ADDvanced]

Originally Posted by tdskip

Happily I can report that in Orange County at least I see 911s out being used very frequently, so depends on where you live and seasonality.

I'd suggest that at least part of why early Porsche prices are strong because compared to similar vintage cars they 1) tend to stay fixed once fixed 2) parts availability is outstanding and 3) while busy there are still shops that know how to work on the cars. All of that make them a pragmatic choice...

I think some other reasons is that even the old ones drive a lot like modern cars, and still feel substantial everywhere. An old MG roadster migth be fun but it lets you know it's thin british steel and questionable build quality even if it's well maintained and reliable.

[jrwilson]

Originally Posted by ADDvanced

I think some other reasons is that even the old ones drive a lot like modern cars, and still feel substantial everywhere.

I have to echo this - I was shocked at how well my '78 drove and how usable it turns out to be on a day-to-day basis. It's an incredibly practical car for a classic.

[HarryD]

I got my 1973 over 20 years ago. We still go on drives (by myself and with PCA), do Autocross and HPDE. The car remains a ton of fun. At most events, the next oldest car in attendance is at least 10 years newer.

[PeteKz]

Just make sure you drive it often. That's not only good for the mechanicals, it's good for the soul. I don't think anyone on their death bed ever said, "I wish I had driven my 911 less."

[shoooo32]

I stopped attending PCA events within the first few years of buying my SC. Everyone had watercooled stuff and they didn't work on their cars. I was in my thirties and they were retired...

Instagram was the game changer. I met a ton of like minded folks that wrenched on (and gasp! modified) their Porsches. Whether it's road trips across the country or a weekend wrenching session, there's always someone in my network down for aircooled shenanigans. No different than Pelican, we share knowledge, parts, or a couch to crash on.

[ADDvanced]

Originally Posted by shoooo32

I stopped attending PCA events within the first few years of buying my SC. Everyone had watercooled stuff and they didn't work on their cars. I was in my thirties and they were retired...

Instagram was the game changer. I met a ton of like minded folks that wrenched on (and gasp! modified) their Porsches. Whether it's road trips across the country or a weekend wrenching session, there's always someone in my network down for aircooled shenanigans. No different than Pelican, we share knowledge, parts, or a couch to crash on.

I went to one in Madison. Everyone had white hair. It was hosted at a mechanics place where most people got all their work done. I didn't ever go back.

[r_towle]

Enjoy the car, drive it more. It is the easiest car to park nowadays.

Rich

[mziggy16]

All great points.

A lot of 70’s, 80’s and 90’s kids plastered these cars on their bedroom walls and they are now making enough scratch to buy one.

[josephvman]

The cost of parts and service has definitely gone up significantly, even before this latest general inflationary cycle we're in. It also seem to me that there are a lot more shops that "specialize" in air-cooled cars, but many young, inexperienced techs who have a lot more enthusiasm for the cars than actual knowledge or expertise. There are more places to bring these cars, but the reality is that there are probably fewer really qualified and experienced guys turning the wrenches.

It also seems like a proliferation of backdated custom builds, and while original collector-grade cars will always bring the big money, I'm surprised at how much people will pay for wide-body builds with RSR wheels and Singer-inspired details.

[r_towle]

Originally Posted by mziggy16

All great points.

A lot of 70’s, 80’s and 90’s kids plastered these cars on their bedroom walls and they are now making enough scratch to buy one.

I like being referred to as a kid, thank you.