Midwest 915 Rebuild Questions, Who Ya Got?

[80schstragedy]

Hello all!

Longtime listener, first time caller here.

I have a 915 in need of a little help. Story goes, I have 1980 911SC I acquired with failed head studs. The entire fuel system (everything besides hard lines) was replaced and then the vehicle was running and driving. Dropping into first was difficult and second occasionally was difficult too. I was not comfortable getting everything up to temp (trans wise) to see if things improved with heat due to the 5 failed studs and brakes on a car that had been sitting for 15 years took a few pumps to get to sorta grab... When pulling the engine, and disconnecting the shift coupler, I found a small pool in that housing area that the transmission had obviously been leaking into. Havent drained the trans yet...

Im currently in the process on doing an engine refresh with euro pistons/cylinders, upgraded cams, rebuilt heads, new chains, the stuffs, but I'd like the get the trans gone over to make sure everything is good when it goes back together. I have contacted a few places (the big online places) and the only estimate I got back was for $11k+ without knowing if any gears would be needed (which would increase the price) and the return email felt very "brush off" to me. I was a little bit surprised at the price honestly. So I have a few questions I was hoping you all might be able to help me out with.

A. Is this the going rate for a rebuild on these transmissions? I know thats a bit of a loaded question until everything is opened up however. I guess mainly, what have others paid for similar situations? I work in the automotive field as an advisor in a german only independent, so I'm familiar with pricing being a bit more, but maybe I am just not familiar enough with these transmissions costs.

B. Who else should I get ahold of? I don't mind shipping the trans to a reputable builder if price and logistics are right, but if there was a good builder in the Midwest (I'm in SW Michigan) I'd like that even more!

I have read a bunch of post prior on this and most builders seem to be west coast/vegas and online venders like Coggs & Coggs and Vertex seem to have sketchy histories here. I don't even mind an exchange as I'm not too concerned about keep the trans original to the car.

Hopefully I'm not beating a dead horse here.... Thanks for any help!

[shoooo32]

You've got the right idea - find someone local. If there's nothing out of the ordinary, it should be $2-3k in parts and around $1500 in labor for a 915 refresh where you deliver the gearbox out of the car. If a bearing race spun in the case, add $750 for machining and new bearings (I recommend CMS for this service).

[EC900]

I agree - get someone local so if there’s any problems or tweaks needed it can be addressed under warranty.
The only problems I find is time…shops are backlogged with run of the mill stuff and rebuilding might be a secondary or “off-season” task.

Also, the 915 is an oddball trans and a bit finicky until you get used to the operation. 2nd to 1st is a common complaint. The leaks at the shifter rod seal caused the pool in the tunnel also common, so maybe you’re low on fluid or it’s just old if you haven’t taken the car on a proper ride, add some worn shifter bushings and coupler adjustment can also cause a miserable shift experience.

[Tony V]

Before you go through the expense of a transmission rebuild, how did the all the shift bushings look?
Many 915 shifting issues are caused by worn bushings or misalignment. The fluid, in the rear tunnel, is from the front seal of the transmission. Easily replaced. If you're not comfortable doing it, a local shop can handle it, especially if you have the unit out and can bring it to them. If they're really slow, it should be less than an hour.
I recently inspected a car, for an elderly PCA club member. She was thinking of selling it but it was impossible to shift. She was told it needed a rebuild. The front bushing, under the shifter was dust. The rear bushings, in the coupler, were gone. Replaced them and the transmission now shifts like new. Give it a look and decide if you want to just throw money away.
Tony

[mepstein]

Originally Posted by shoooo32

You've got the right idea - find someone local. If there's nothing out of the ordinary, it should be $2-3k in parts and around $1500 in labor for a 915 refresh where you deliver the gearbox out of the car. If a bearing race spun in the case, add $750 for machining and new bearings (I recommend CMS for this service).

Pretty much exactly what we charge. $1450 for labor, parts are what’s needed but prices are almost identical to what Pelican charges. Usually comes out at 2-3k unless like it was stated, the bearings are loose. Shipping is ~$150 ish. We do them for customers as well as some shops. Turn around is about 3 weeks.
I’m at Mark@MarkEpstein.net or happy to talk on the phone.

[Matt Monson]

Try Claudio at Foreign Car Service in Portage.
import auto repair, Foreign Car Services Portage, MI Home

Or Brian Copans at BMC and Gee in Athens, OH. The latter is a gearbox specialist with more experience than all the other mail order builders you’ve listed, combined.

[winders]

Originally Posted by 80schstragedy

Hello all!

Longtime listener, first time caller here.

I have a 915 in need of a little help. Story goes, I have 1980 911SC I acquired with failed head studs. The entire fuel system (everything besides hard lines) was replaced and then the vehicle was running and driving. Dropping into first was difficult and second occasionally was difficult too. I was not comfortable getting everything up to temp (trans wise) to see if things improved with heat due to the 5 failed studs and brakes on a car that had been sitting for 15 years took a few pumps to get to sorta grab... When pulling the engine, and disconnecting the shift coupler, I found a small pool in that housing area that the transmission had obviously been leaking into. Havent drained the trans yet...

Im currently in the process on doing an engine refresh with euro pistons/cylinders, upgraded cams, rebuilt heads, new chains, the stuffs, but I'd like the get the trans gone over to make sure everything is good when it goes back together. I have contacted a few places (the big online places) and the only estimate I got back was for $11k+ without knowing if any gears would be needed (which would increase the price) and the return email felt very "brush off" to me. I was a little bit surprised at the price honestly. So I have a few questions I was hoping you all might be able to help me out with.

A. Is this the going rate for a rebuild on these transmissions? I know thats a bit of a loaded question until everything is opened up however. I guess mainly, what have others paid for similar situations? I work in the automotive field as an advisor in a german only independent, so I'm familiar with pricing being a bit more, but maybe I am just not familiar enough with these transmissions costs.

B. Who else should I get ahold of? I don't mind shipping the trans to a reputable builder if price and logistics are right, but if there was a good builder in the Midwest (I'm in SW Michigan) I'd like that even more!

I have read a bunch of post prior on this and most builders seem to be west coast/vegas and online venders like Coggs & Coggs and Vertex seem to have sketchy histories here. I don't even mind an exchange as I'm not too concerned about keep the trans original to the car.

Hopefully I'm not beating a dead horse here.... Thanks for any help!

I would contact Bill Rader at Bill Rader Motorsports in Las Vegas. He is the best and his prices are actually the most reasonable I ever came across. I sent my race 915 to him at the end of every season. It always worked great for the entire next race season. I was a little hard on 2nd and 3rd gear synchros sometimes so those parts always needed to be evaluated at the end of the year.

I shipped the 915 to him in an Igloo ice chest and I could ship it out of a regular FedEx office as it was not over the weight limit.

[tkxrs]

Another thumbs up for Bill Radar Motorsports. He has done two of my trans for different cars and they work great right out of the cooler!
Cheers

[bbturbo]

I’d recommend Farmer Automotive outside of Indy. Bob is honest, fair, and has been working on Porsches since the 70s. Also, Bob was the first 930 mechanic for Porsche in Indiana. He’s who will be doing my next 915, no contest.

[kevingross]

I don't give estimates for 915 rebuilds any more. The problem is that I get asked for a "best case scenario," and it's never the best case scenario. These transmissions are up to 52 years old, a long life, they are tired and in need of unknown attention.

The smarter approach is to ask questions that drive price:
- what's your hourly rate?
- how do you price parts?
- what work do you do when servicing, what's your approach to a rebuild?
- how do we collaborate through the process?
- if it needs an X, do you have them on the shelf, or how do you get one?
- ... and so forth

My approach is to tear the transmission down, clean and inspect it, report back to the customer with a set of photos (DropBox) plus a bullet list of what's right and wrong. We then discuss options for repair, agree to the path forward, and at that time I'm in a position to give a pretty good estimate.

Nothing wrong -- and a lot right! -- with using a local shop, when they have the know-how, special tools needed, and will take the time to do it right. But the cost of shipping to and from a specialist who ticks all the boxes will be a small element of the ultimate cost. I use an LTL freight carrier: they are quick, reliable, and used to handling the weight of a transmission in a crate or on a pallet.

Good luck with the project!

[shoooo32]

The OP didn't state what he plans to do with the car, but that factors a lot into the cost as well. A concours queen that's never going to see the angry side of the tach will be a completely different build from the car that's going PCA club racing.

[Dan J]

[QUOTE=Matt Monson;12277269]Try Claudio at Foreign Car Service in Portage.
import auto repair, Foreign Car Services Portage, MI Home

Another vote for Claudio A great technician. And probably you could drop it off

[mepstein]

Originally Posted by shoooo32

The OP didn't state what he plans to do with the car, but that factors a lot into the cost as well. A concours queen that's never going to see the angry side of the tach will be a completely different build from the car that's going PCA club racing.

I don’t know that’s really accurate. We’ve built expensive trans for show cars because that’s what the owner wants or the high mileage drivers that just need almost everything replaced. But “expensive” is all relative to people’s wallets. You can’t put new parts against worn out ones or the new parts will wear super fast. These trans are 30-50 years old so sometimes you’re just dancing with the partner you brought. We just build the best trans we can with budget, desire and reality in mind.

[shoooo32]

Point well taken - I was more so referring to aftermarket upgrades. The OP mentioned engine mods, so I assumed they'd be open to gearbox upgrades as well. This is a slippery slope that can easily double the parts cost of the build, without even mentioning new ratios.

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by Dan J

Another vote for Claudio A great technician. And probably you could drop it off

I generally try to recommend a local shop for a number of reasons. There’s nothing wrong with the specialty shop gearbox builders, but with current freight rates it can easily add $400-500 to the job with no actual added value when it comes to servicing a 915. These things aren’t Cup Car gearboxes.

The exception is with case repairs, where you want someone with a machine shop on site doing that work at the same time. Even so, someone like CMS can be shipped a bare case for repair for far less expense than shipping a complete gearbox.

[PeteKz]

Matt, that's good advice.