Steve Wong custom chip installed...
 

I had Steve Wong (stevekw@pacbell.net) burn a custom chip for me several months ago and I just got time to install it last week. Man, what a difference! Not a huge power increase but definitely much better overall.

The car is an '88 Carrera 3.2, with Dansk euro premuffler and Dansk sport muffler with a single 84mm tip. The face has been cut off the airbox and it has a K&N filter. Those changes alone provided a very nice power boost, but the chip really woke the car up! BTW, the car originally came with the better "8" chip (same thing as a Club Sport chip but with the stock RPM limit).

I asked Steve to keep the timing a little on the conservative side because I sometimes run the car in hot weather with the A/C on, and I didn't want any preignition issues. Many of the mass-produced chips run up to 33 degrees total advance, but we held this one to 29 degrees. Otherwise the timing is more advanced throughout the range, and the fuel maps are richer where needed. I also had him hold the stock RPM limit because I really don't spend a lot of time up around redline. Most of the chip manufacturers get higher horsepower numbers by raising the RPM limit.

The main things I notice are:

Improved throttle response - the engine always feels like it's ready to go with the slightest crack of the throttle. A lot like the Saab Turbos we've owned for years, once they're up on boost.

More power down low, like below 3000 RPM - not a lot but definitely noticeable. It accelerates faster and smoother from lower RPMs than it did before.

More power from 3500 to redline - pulls smoother and harder than it did before, and right up to redline. This is especially noticeable in 4th and 5th.

Before the chip swap the exhaust made an occasional popping sound on decelleration (probably from a lean condition?), and that's gone. The exhaust note sounds healthier too.

Absolutely no evidence of preignition, even with the A/C on and air temperatures in the high 90's, oil temperature at about 210 degrees.

I couldn't be happier and I'd recommend Steve's work to anyone. You can get a custom chip burned specifically for your application for quite a bit less than what the mass-produced chips cost.

Hi Wavey (Dave!) - thanks for the thorough review and plug. Glad to hear the custom chip is performing properly for you in all respects. Always good to hear customer response, and positive feedback is always a good thing. Have fun!

My post responding to others on this kind of topic may have been lost...my experience with a Steve Wong chip is almost identical for my 85 USA spec Carrera. I also had the car on the track at Watkins Glen for DE, and the car performed faultlessly.

My response is that this chip is not an overwhwelming change from before, but the "crispness" of the throttle response has been improved, as has idle quality, as has throttle response in low speed/ high gear situations. I beleive I'm getting better overall top end HP but this is not the main factor one notices, it's the street response mentioned. Overall, very satisfied and nice to deal with Steve one-on-one to get a custom chip for *your* mods ( or very close to it from the many mappings he's got "on file" from all his previous work). Reasonably priced too compared to the aftermarket chip market.
---Wil Ferch

I had a hard time with chips, because of the mods I'd done in rebuilding the engine. C2 cams, porting, intake & exhaust all combined to make a simple chip replacement not so simple. I also have a VERY early Carrera (Oct '83), with a motronic computer that no one's ever heard of before.

Steve W is just a fabulous guy who does excellent work. After Autothority chips wouldn't even start, Steve and I tried multiple versions of a custom chip. Because of the tricky nature of my setup, I ended up having to go with a locally dyno-tuned Dastek piggyback computer, but Steve W burned me a copy of my original chip in order to raise the rev limiter to 7400 rpm (racing valve springs & rod bolts). I absolutely LOVE the extra rpms. My car feels like a real exotic now and goes like hell (217 rwhp).

Cheers,

Must throw my 2 cents in here as well. I too have a SteveW installed masterpiece. My 85 has the Dansk premuff and when I get home, stuck in Guam w/broke jet, I have the Dansk sport muffler 1in/1 out waiting for me. Steve will I need to update the chip by adding the muffler?

The car does all of the above. It just seems to perform so much more efficiently with Steves Chip. I have been extremely pleased. If you make changes to your cars setup, Steve will "update" your chip for a nominal fee. Great to deal with.

I have a different, yet at least as positive comment about Steve's work. I bought one of his 'stock custom' chipsa few months back and - well, I'm having strange problems with the car. It stalls and the idle fluctuates and it predetonates [at high oil temp and A/C on]. It has the problem both with the stock chip and Steve's. To help me with my peculiar problems, and since I think I have gone through all the likely suspect parts [as far as my capability allows], he has sent me two more chips of different parameters [aggressive; less so], this after a lot of talk understanding the issues with the car.

His help has been invaluable to me and very much appreciated -- I hope I am close to resolution. I drove a bit today after 'refurbing' the AFM wiper contacts and tightening the clock spring a bit to compensate for aging, and with the more aggressive of the new chips Steve sent, the car did not stall. The idle fluctuated at operating temp, but I do not have the CO mix properly set. So, if I can get good running off idle I will be happy and take it to a shop with the proper equip to set the idle mix.


General note;

Kudos are deserved to Wayne; without this board and Pelican Parts, how many of us would be as well off as we are with these old cars. I know mine would be in much lesser shape and I'd be out a bunch more bucks.


todd,
86 cpe

hi dave, nice to read your report on the steve w chip. i was curious if the modded chip made a significant difference in performance. i'm also glad to hear you can upgrade the chip as you upgrade the motor. another item to be added to my must buy list for my car. ric

Guys, thanks for all your input and support. I try to get each chip optimized for each owners specific application and it seems to be working well. Occasionally there are issues where it's difficult for a chip to cure, such as in Todd's case. Todd, have you check your car's running voltage? John Walker has noted recently that a bad voltage regulator in the alternator creating a system voltage above 14 volts through the car will cause unusual idle stability problems. If the last two chips I sent you did not help much, there is most likely some external issue as the culprit.

Hey Dan, good to hear the upgrade chip has worked out well for you. The revised chip I sent you is already customized to work with the increased flow of the Europremuffler and sport muffler combination. I've programmed it to provide about 5% more fuel at high loads and full throttle to take advantage of the increased volumetric efficiency, in fact the full throttle maps bear a close resemblance to the factory European 3.2 chip, which you have basically converted your exhaust to. As the premuffler generally nets you a 8 hp gain, and a dual out sport muffler about 3-4 hp, the extra fuel is already provided for your setup. There would be little to no difference in the chip mappings for a premuffler setup with a stock or sport muffler. It's only when you go to the next significant exhaust change - SSIs would I provide a different chip setup.

Todd, I agree with you, Wayne and this board deserves mucho kudos. The members, support, and respect here is unmatched by any other, and is leaps and bounds superior to the Rennlist forums.

Hi Ric!

Well, the chip didn't exactly turn the car into a tire-burning monster or anything, but it's definitely making more power across the board. It's hard to say how much, maybe another 8-10 hp over the exhaust mods? The real difference is in how the car responds to more throttle - the response is a lot more immediate. And above 3500 in 4th and 5th the engine definitely feels stronger. I intend to eventually do a dyno run and that will provide some real numbers.

My mech told me Porsches aren't really supposed to butn tires anyway. Since there not built like a ford there designed to keep there rubber stuck to the pavement. He told me I could do alot of damage to the transmission if I burned tires (he gave me the talk since I owned a mustang gt prior...). Seems to make sense to me thou...

Sounds like that chip is right where it should be..

So, does SteveW do chips for 95' 993 engine! A fellow Pelicanite is selling a 'PatrickMotorsports-first generation flywheel' that is I believe is a 9-pound compared to the latest generatio of 11 pound or so. I am not exact about the numbers but the first generation is definitely lighter than the current one.

Anyway, I know that some 3.6 transplant have been having problems with idle. Could Steve fix the idle problem with either the 9lbs or 11-lbs?

rickwon, the amount of power increase over your stock chip is dependent on which stock chip your car came with originally. The 84-87s were programmed conservatively, which is why Porsche rated those cars at a max of 207 hp. (200 hp in California in 84 with a 0-60 time of 6.7 seconds) The 88-89s used a couple of different chips, with the more aggressive 358 chip probably used by Porsche to claim a peak hp rating of 217 hp. Wavey's car is an 88 3.2, so his gains are not as pronounced as what it would be with the earlier cars, but nevertheless, both cars should run equal when they have the same chip mappings and should run sub 6 second 0-60 times. When I used to run just a premuffler, stock muffler, stock air flow sensor, extrudehoned manifolds and bored throttle body and a cone air filter, I was able to hard chirp my rear tires under hard acceleration from first to second, and that is with 265 wide rear tires and a factory limited slip diff.

Hi cab83_750. The 993 idle stability with a lightweight flywheel could probably be simply addressed, since there are a couple of programmable values in its code that control the idle control valve vs. the RPM and also vs. the cylinder head temp. But since I have never worked with anyone on this before, it would be difficult to know were to start unless I were actually working on the car in front of me. You might want to check around, as I vaguely recall that someone may have programmed a chip to address lightweight flywheels, or was that for 964s (?).

Hey Steve, I've been contemplating a chip swap for my 85 but somewhere in the past I recall hearing that not all the DME's had removable chips and that some were soldered in. Is this true?? If so, how can I check if my chip can be pulled out? Thanks Mike :)

Mike, only some early 84s had a soldered in chip which normally would have a chip socket added, so you don't need to worry. But if you are interested in reviewing the procedure on removing and opening the DME, Pelican has a nice tech article here:

http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/911_motronic_chip/911_motronic_chip2.htm

or shoot me your email and I can send you detailed instructions.

Steve: I have an 84 that is completely stock except for a Dansk sport muffler (which is a slightly more agressive version of the stock muffler). I use the car for weekend fun up in the hills, the beach, etc. No tracking. What would you suggest I do in the way of a chip upgrade?

Thanks.

Hi Scott, I would recommend going for the standard chip upgrade, your car will be a different animal. You might want to think about combining it with the Dansk europremuffler which Pelican sells and I can match it up to a chip I specially program for a premuffler/sport muffler system for a real nice power boost - at least 20+ hp and 20+ lbs of torque over what you have now. If you're around Los Angeles, you're welcome to stop by and try it out.

Steve: I want to keep the car pretty much stock, but wouldn't mind some performance improvements. Given that I don't want to get into modifying the exhaust, do you have a chip that will help me even though I have an (almost) stock exhaust system?

Yes scott, that would be the chip programmed for the stock/almost stock configuration.

What kind of improvements will I get with that chip?

Scott, the improvements are pretty much what some of the guys here have posted. Peak hp is increased, and even more so in the midrange, as there's a lot of range left there to optimize. Fuel economy and emissions basically remains the same, unless you like to push your car a lot. Throttle response will be like immediate when you change throttle position, like an immediate jump rather than lag, and it just pulls a little harder. I think Wil Ferch also did a very thorough subjective and objective analysis and description of the difference with the new chip, though I can't find it. You may want to try a search. Basically you releasing what power is being held back by the conservative settings in the stock chip. Best would be if you are interested, is just to try the chip, and if it doesn't work out for you for whatever reason, just return it so your risk is minimal.

Hi Steve, I have one for you. I have a 1985 Euro Carrera, with the higher compression. I am just about to put on a Dansk pre-muffler from Pelican, and I would probably run a K&N air filter. Plans are to upgrade to a wider throttle body, and an adjustable fuel pressure regulator in the next few months. What chip would you recommend, and would it matter whether or not I had yet to install the wider throttle body or the adj. fuel press. regulator? Thanks

Bill, absolutely there is some gain to be achieved, as long as you run quality premium fuel. I would not bother with the adjustable fuel regulator as the stock injectors are more than capable of supplying enough fuel for your motor. Guys usually do that because they have no other way of enrichening the fuel mixture such as by programming the fuel maps, or they modify their car so much so as to max out the injector capacities. The premuffler is a good idea as it would basically revert your Euro to a true Euro car with it's exhaust. The throttle body boring may give you a little more throttle response, its benefit more noticeable with other engine modifications - but it's not pertinent to the chip programming.

The basic modifications to the ignition and fuel maps of a European chip are as follows:

a) part throttle fuel maps are increased by 5-6 % throughout, increasing net torque and hp.

b) idle and full throttle fuel maps are left alone, as they are already ideal for the car's setup.

c) the part throttle ignition maps are modified with 4-8 degrees more ignition advance throughout, and about 5-6 degrees more in the full throttle ignition maps, improving efficiency and throttle response

d) rev limiter revised to 6800, or whatever you would like to specify.

Again, you need to run good gas, as the European car's higher compression puts you more at the limit. If you have predetonation issues now in hot weather, then I would limit the modifications only to the fuel maps.

Steve: I'm in LA, so I might just take you up on that offer.

Scott

Steve, I'm getting ready to change the exhaust system on my '86 3.2 from a straight pipe & stock muffler to the SSI w/sport muffler. Using your chip I'm I going to ge noticeably more power with the SSI/sport muffler compared to a straight pipe w/Dansk sport muffler? The motor is in my '73 Targa so smog isn't an issue.

Scott, sure, just contact me anytime.

Gumba, the whole stock heat exchangers with a premuffler vs. SSIs has been debated many times. But since you are coming from a straight pipe, you should notice a difference just on the exhaust change. I never had experience with a straight pipe, but Bruce Anderson once told me straight pipes don't seem to do much for a 3.2 except create noise, but the European premuffler is an exception. Combined with a sport muffler, it has been dyno proven to produce about 11.5 hp at 6000 rpm. The premuffler is responsible for about 8 of that hp. SSIs are supposed to produce about 12 hp also. A few years ago I switched from a premuffler setup to a SSI/Monty combo and noticed no change in power. Needless to say I was disappointed in the $2000 spent. But it wasn't until I customized a chip to specifically address the fuel requirements of the SSIs did I notice the power increase. The problem stems from the fact that at full throttle, the DME injects only a fixed preprogrammed amount of fuel, determined by the full throttle fuel map in the chip, and no matter what modifications you do to your car, the DME will not adjust and add more fuel, and fuel=power. Matching your chip to your setup is always the best thing, and matching it to the SSI/sport muffler exhaust will only maximize the power potential your modifications are capable of producing.

The following image is a chart illustrating the variation of air/fuel ratios with respect to power. On this graph, it shows maximum power at an afr of 12.6:1, with max power on a 911 engine being somewhere between there and 13.0:1, which incidentally is where the engine is least likely to predetonate. You can see that slight variations in the afrs at that point have minor effects on the power delivered, however, as you get leaner, the dropoff in power starts to drop appreciably. So if for example, your stock chip was optimized for a stock car to deliver a 13.0:1 afr, but you increased your engine's breathing capacity by 10% with exhaust and/or engine modifications, your afr would now increase to (13.0 x 1.1) or 14.3:1, quite a bit off from the max power ratio, and increasing you motor's predisposition to knock. If we can minimize the motor's tendency to knock, we then have more margin to safely increase the ignition timing for even more power. If we increased the injected fuel by 10% we would then go back to the 13.0:1 afr [ 14.3 / (1 x 1.10) ]

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads/AFRCURVE.gif

Steve, what specifically do you mean by quality gas? I regulary purchase Chevron 91 - which is the highest I can get for California. Do you just mean to stay away from the middle and lower grades? I noticed a big difference in performance when I went from cheapo gas to techron alone.

Also, in regards to the K& N filter that I already have, but plan to put back on - would that help or deter from the performance? Can you compensate in the chip for the extra air flow? Thanks!

You can get the same results by a simple adjustment of the AFM without
wasting money on a chip and without the potential problem of pinging or
detonation. This can be done any time the exhaust system is changed
and the mixture needs to be adjusted.

Check this website (systemsc.com) under Technical. It may have some
useful info.

Good Luck
Loren
'88 3.2 without chip or pinging, no octane booster needed

Additional Note:

For those guys with Euro pistons/high compression, be prepared to use
a lot of octane booster or maybe consider switching to 120 octane if
you can find it.

Good Luck
Loren
'88 3.2

I can attest to Steve's wizardry on the chip for my 84 Carrera (Steve I still owe you 2 chips in return, sorry!!! :rolleyes: )

Anyway I have a RUF sport muffler(one in dual out) with a fabspeed euro-pre-muffler. The chip really wakes up the whole combo. Driveability is increased overall as well. Best money an mod I ever spent made was Steve's chip. He also took the time to work with me on a custom setup and did not stop sending me chips until I was totally satisfied.

Jeff
nolift911@hotmail.com

Bill, the European Carreras which have a 10.3:1 compression ratio were designed to run on 98 RON/88MON octane fuel, which is equivalent to 93 octane at our pumps (our CLC average system). This contrasts to the US Carreras which has a CR of 9.5:1 and require a fuel quality of 87 CLC octane. Since we have lost our 92 octane fuel here in California, and all we can get is 91, putting in 89 or 87 will definitely decrease your performance, if not also be bad for the motor. A K&N filter replacement by itself will not do much to increase your airflow, though you could try cutting some large holes in your airbox cover, there seems to be some flow improvement on cone filters with adapters which funnel the air into the square opening of the air flow meter. The adapters generally start with a mouth of a larger surface area, and progressively taper down to the rectangular opening of the air flow meter, much like the intake stacks on the top of a set of Weber carbs, or like the intake runners on the new Carrera GT. Small mods like this are best if combined with other modifications.

Hey Jeff, good hearing from you. Glad to hear the combo has been working well. No sweat over the chips, you've probably long lost them by now after that flood. :)

I also just installed a Steve W chip in my stock 85 Coupe...kept the factory rev limit intact. Fantastic difference! The "lag" is gone...the car spools up much more quickly....MUCH zippier around town....the car "feels" much lighter and much more nimble....highly recommended! Thanks Steve.

Steve--do you customize chips for 3.6L's? I already have an Autothority chip and was wondering if you can improve on this. Thanks

Hi Marc, I knew you'd like it. The chip uncovers all the power Porsche meant the 3.2 to have, but because of all the U.S. restrictions with respect to emissions, among other factors, we just couldn't get it. I've optimized it in all the right places, and it's safe for your car, as I'm not overly aggressive with the ignition timing.

Jon, 3.6 chips are in the works for the future. Can I improve on your Autothority chip? Maybe - here's a recent email from a fellow Pelican who ran an Autothority chip in his 911 before he installed mine:

"Steve,

Your chip arrived yesterday and I installed it this morning. Everything went fine with the installation...your instructions were very helpful.

Car drives very nicely. Seems to pull stronger in the low and mid-range RPM's. Top end seems about the same as the Autothority chip I had been using. I can see where someone installing your chip to replace the OEM chip would really be impressed. I'm impressed and I had a Autothority chip!

Do you have any sense for the incremental HP gains with the euro-exhaust system, sport muffler and your chip? I have to think that combo is probably good for 20 HP...but you may have better data.

Thanks again.

Regards, Bruce"


BTW, I recently received a copy of the factory chip from a 964 Carrera C2 3.6 RS. These are the specs for the car, excuse the French:

CARRERA C2 3,6 RS
Moteur
Moteur de 964 (3l6), avec boitier spécifique, délivrant 260 CV à 6100 trs/mn (type M64/03).
Couple : 325Nm à 4800 trs/mn (310 Nm pour carrera 2)
régime maxi : 6720 trs / mn
Compression 11.3
Carburant SP 98
Carburation et allumage : Appareil de commande DME spécifique (angles d'allumage avancés).
Régime de ralenti identique à carrera 2
Performances officielles : 0 - 100 en 5.3 s
Poids du moteur : 226 kgs

Would it work for a U.S. car? Hmmmm . . . . . .

thanks Steve--keep us 3.6 guys posted!

I wrote Steve the note (see above) about replacing an Autothority chip with Steve's custom chip. As I said in my note, there are noticable performance improvements in the low and mid-range RPMs. Overall, I am very pleased with Steve's custom chip. His "customer service" is world class.

I have a K&N cone air intake system and Dansk euro pre-muffler and SS sport muffler (one in, one out w/84MM outlet). I have my idle CO set at 3.2% using the Gunson CO Tester. Here in the mid-Atlantic we have ample access to 93 and 94 octane gas; I use Sunoco 94.

I talking with Steve, his custom chip and my intake/exhaust system set up should get my 3.2 ltr. engine close to the euro spec engine's output of 231 HP. I have never had my car on a dyno, so I do not have any emperical proof on which to base my assumption.

Thanks again Steve. No relation, just a satisified customer.

Bruce

Dear Steve,

I have a '86 Carrera with no changes (K&N). I was interested in bringing the car up to around 250 HP with exhaust, ignition and chip. Is this possible or do I need more compression? Do I also need intake improvements? I feel that the car is good above 3000 but nothing at low RPM. Would there be a difference in a chip made for SSIs vs GHL with CATs?

I don't want to lose mileage or relibility. I was told that the factory has the cars set up to run more rich to avoid detonation and that a chip could improve overall performance and mileage. I don't want to lose relibility.

DG, getting 250 hp is going to take a lot of work and $$$. To get close to that, you are going to have to modify or backdate your exhaust, use a sport muffler, ExtrudeHone your intake manifolds, install 964 cams, perhaps twin plug your heads, install a mass flow sensor and put in a good chip. I program a different chip for the different exhaust configurations - this is gets you the most over a one size fits all deal. All of the modifications above, including a properly programmed chip does nothing to reduce your mileage or reliability. In fact usually, because most of these modifications actually improve the efficiency of the motor and system as a whole, your car runs, idles, and breaths better, oftentimes running cooler. An example is a mass flow sensor which makes your car's idle rock steady because it's so much faster and accurate at measuring airflow. It has none of that dreaded sub idle drop some cars get as they age.

I hate to give hp numbers because it's the combination and system of modifications that produce the net result. If I were to generalize though, you can use this as a guideline:

Base hp for an 86 3.2: 207
europremuffler: +8 $200-300 plus labor
sport muffler dual out for above: +2-3 hp $400
backdated exhaust or headers w/sport muffler: +12-14 $2000
chip matched for above: 12-15 hp $230
mass flow sensor: +10hp $1100-1800
964 cams: 8-10hp $600-800 plus labor
ExtrudeHone manifolds: +7hp $600 plus labor
Twin plugging: minimal, but crisper throttle response $2000

Bear in mind that not all the hp gains are at the peak rpm at 6000, so just simply adding up all the figures is not going to give you an accurate figure. How you time a cam, for example moves the torque curve either up or down. Anyways, it's the collective area under the power curve starting from idle to redline that's important, and where we spend most of our time. I would suggest doing the reasonable things first to get the most bang for your buck, because once you pass that, it's a parabolic climb at $100-150 per hp.

Steve,
How do I get a hold of you? I PM'd you last week. Please send me an e-mail @ don_911_2000@yahoo.com.

I'd like to talk chip with you.:) Thanks.

Hi Don, seems like the PM function has been acting up because I have been getting return errors also. Best is to email me: stevekw@pacbell.net

good deal
 

Steve W put a chip in my 1986 Carrera and then I put on a Dansk pre-muffler that I purchased from Pelican. The big increase came from Steve’s chip.The Dansk pre-muffler made it a little more powerful but the biggest increase came right after I drove away from Steve’s place. The price for a Steve W chip is a great deal. It is well worth the money $230. to perk up the power. The Dansk pre-muffler and new bolts and nuts and gaskets from Pelican, $400. delivered. I took it to a muffler shop and they put the pipe in for $45. This was a week later, so I know what I was feeling. Steve W chip, great deal, Dansk pre-muffler was a bit of bread for not that much bang. Over all, the car is much faster and as I keep driving it. I find the rear 245 Goodyear F1s spin much more in left turns from a light than before. The power is as people have posted. I am not going to put it on a dyno but the numbers must be higher. Thanks Steve.

Bobhttp://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1059877497.jpg