Bridgestone S-o3 vs. Toyo T-1 vs. Yoko AVS Sports vs. Kuhmo MX vs. Eagle F1-GSD3?

jbripps · jbripps's Garage

Hi All,

I've researched the archives and have only made myself more confused. I need to get tires for the P-car, and need some more feedback on the above tires. Tirerack has advised me that the Eagles are a new line introduced in Europe and now available here, and have higher reviews than the Pole Positions. I've had the same tires on my car since I bought it over two years ago. Currently, I have Toyo Proxys, and they feel great, but I have not been able to compare them to anything else.

Any input or additional suggestions is greatly appreciated. They all cost around the same, with the exception of Kumho. I do about 3 DE's a year, so I want to maximize my potential. I also would like a tire that performs well in the rain. I'd rather not spin on the street, if you know what I mean.

Also, how big can I go on the tires with Fuchs 16" 6's and 7's?.

Thanks for your help!!

regards,

Rot 911 · 07-10-2003, 06:55 AM

A few months ago I went thru this same process and went with the S-03. Prior to that I had the Dunlap S8000. On the street the dry and wet traction has been impressive and the noise from the tires is very non-intrusive.

rs911t · 07-10-2003, 03:46 PM

Just Monday I installed a new set of Toyo T1-S's on the M3 and almost immediately put 600 miles of highway driving on them. The car had Toyo's when I bought it (used). I've been impressed so far, but this is the first time I've driven'em new. VERY impressed. Great feel, quiet and [again] very responsive. Full set installed was less than $700. 225/45-17 and 235/40-17.

Next time around the 911 will get Toyos.

RoninLB · 07-10-2003, 08:25 PM

it appears many guys around here are trying the S-03s.. and they're impressed with them.. it's probably the best street tire.. I can't comment about the track...........Ron

kellzey · 07-10-2003, 08:30 PM

S03s on the Boxster to replace the Contis on there. Much better handling and an acceptable noise level. Great rain handling

I also bought new S03s in 245/45/16s and 225/50/16s for my 9x16 and 8x16 Fuchs for my 914-6 project car...

Tire Rack lists the 245s as ZR rated and the 225s as WR rated on their website. Both sets of tires came as ZR rated. This was a discussion point on a tire thread a few weeks ago.

nestorjw · nestorjw's Garage

Toyo RA-1's beat all

zotman72 · 07-10-2003, 09:52 PM

I just got a set of Michelin Pilot Sport Cups for my 72 mounted today. They are the hot ticket for a track tire with limited street capability as well. The tread looks far better than the Victoracers.

alf · 07-10-2003, 09:55 PM

I had S03s, excellent all around tires. I just got a set of Toyo RA1s. Drive it for 6 months in the fall and winter to wear down the thread and when Spring rolls around, i have a set of Track tires

I am currently running around on old R1s as daily drivers that came on the 7&9s i bought and even these old R compound tires are MUCH stickier than the SO3s, in the dry anyway.

alf

dd74 · 07-10-2003, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by alf
I had S03s, excellent all around tires. I just got a set of Toyo RA1s. Drive it for 6 months in the fall and winter to wear down the thread and when Spring rolls around, i have a set of Track tires

I am currently running around on old R1s as daily drivers that came on the 7&9s i bought and even these old R compound tires are MUCH stickier than the SO3s, in the dry anyway.

alf

Alf: about how many miles/city blocks, does it take to warm up the Toyo Rs before they're sticky?

alf · 07-10-2003, 10:38 PM

I have not mounted the RA1s yet, they are still in the back of my Pathfinder. But I think they will be as sticky as street tires when cold and gets really sticky when warm. We'll see.

As for the R1s, they warm up in about the same time as the car.

alf

arrivederci · 07-11-2003, 03:47 AM

I should have a set of Kumho MXs on my 930 in the next week (along with some 18" fikses). They're replacing SO3s on Fuchs. From the research I did, the Kumhos are in another league. They're basically an R compound tire with a 220 treadwear slapped on them. Expect grip on the level of BFG KDs. They won't be good rain tires (which SO3s are). I also hear the Goodyears are good in the rain. My dad had a set of Yokos on his '93 928 and recently replaced them with SO3s. He likes the SO3s much better.

KTL · 05:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by nestorjw
Toyo RA-1's beat all

No kidding. They're pretty much an R compound track tire (UTQG of 40)!!!!! Hence the name, RA-1.

I have the Kumho MX and it's a nice tire. Good grip, low noise for a high perf. directional tire with large tread blocks, can't beat the price. Too bad they don't make a 245/45-16 for us. My comparison is rather limited though because the only other tires i've had on the 911 are some old Dunlop SP Sport 4000 A/S ZR's.

The biggest tires you can put on the 6's and 7's are:

205/55 or 205/50 on the 6's. Anything wider would look silly and have a less stiff sidewall.

225/50 or 235/50 (a tad tall and wide for a 7" rim) on the 7's. Same goes as for the 6's. Anything wider will look weird and have less stiff sidewall due to the large "overhang" beyond the rim edge.

rennch · rennch's Garage

I just put a set of 205-50/15 Falken Azenis on my newly polished Fuchs. They are hands down the best bang for the buck (I think they were $73 each, installed) in the tire world. They drive like race rubber (Even picking up gravel after you make a run or a short track outing) and have a killer tread pattern. Almost every SCCA autocrosser that runs in STS (A street tire class) runs the Azenis, so that should say something about them. You can check them out at http://www.vulcantire.com

http://www.vulcantire.com/graphics/tires/azenis.jpg

And no...I don't work for them.

rennch · rennch's Garage

Oh...and they eat S-03's for lunch. If I had a choice (And I did)...I'd go Azenis or BFG KD. I went the cheaper route.

YMMV....

rennch · rennch's Garage

Here are mine:

old_skul · 07-11-2003, 06:57 AM

I have been running AVS Sports for a couple of years now; 3 sets of rears and 2 sets of fronts. I do 3-4 DEs per year on this daily driver.

They suck in the snow, but that's their only failing. They break loose progressively and predictably, and traction is great. Their rain performance is amazing - WAY better than what I expected. I have never hydroplaned with these tires.

I hear good reports on the S-03s, but they're a tad more expensive.

JeremyD · JeremyD's Garage

I have the AVS Sports on mine on 16 x 8's 951 fuchs on the fronts and 16 x 9's on the rear, 225/50's and 245/45's. I bought these because of the positive reviews as a rain tire (I live in Florida).

The other day I was caught in a real gully washer - and because there was no traffic around I purposely tried to break them free and see where their limits were (better to do when no-one is around!)

Anyway - even with standing water - I really had to try and break them free - their wet traction is on par with their dry traction - which is pretty awesome... And you can't beat the tread pattern

BTW - they are not noisy (I expected they would be) and mounted with very little correctional weights.

pbs911 · pbs911's Garage

I switched from AVS to the Kumho MX last week. So far I am impressed with the MX. I didn't know they were R compound they do grip much better than the AVS fom the limited driving I have done so far.

KTL · 07-11-2003, 07:56 AM

Here's another link to Falken's site:

http://www.falkentire.com/

http://www.falkentire.com/flash/inferno.htm

Falkens seem like excellent tires. No doubt. But what's up with the size selection in the Azenis Sport? Six sizes? That's it? WTF? For 16" wheels you have the choice of 205/55 or 215/45. Kinda stinks. I'd like to give the FK-451's a try for my Carrera. If you look at them, they're super similar to the Yoko ES 100. Yoko looks to have a sturdier cross section design though.

Which leads me to another point. So if the Falkens are so good (and I don't doubt this), what makes the other tires such as Bridgestone, Michelin, Goodyear, BFG, etc. so expensive? I don't get it. There's gotta be somebody here who builds tires that can shed some light on this? Or is it some kind of big secret in the tire industry?

I'm all for paying a little extra to get quality stuff. Like OEM Porsche parts for instance. But when it comes to tires, I think there are good tire values out there for fair prices (like Kumho, Sumitomo and Falken) that are going to get you pretty much the same result as the other big dollar tires.

Sorry for the rant.

rennch · rennch's Garage

Kevin,

I wouldn't recommend going with any other Falken tire, other than the Azenis. The word on the street is that Falken bought the rights to the Yokohama AVSR (?) race tire, and essentially rebadged it as the azenis with a slightly harder compound.

So, that's why it's the "secret stash" tire, so I'm told. I can tell you I've raced on them for 3 years, and they don't behave like a street tire. They are much more similar to a Hoosier race tire. (ASO3)

You mentioned the big downside, though...lack of sizing. Apparently, because the sidewalls are so stiff, they have to be a certain height, so it limits the sizing choices. There are rumors that there will be an "Azenis 2" next year with lots of sizes.

mto