![]() |
Quote:
https://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/6523-911-driving-tips-2.html |
Massmike
Came across another thread that might be helpful.. https://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/927421-solved-3-0sc-cis-bucking-surging-bad-idle.html |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
If that doesn’t work, the ECU might be faulty. Where are you from — the US or Europe? |
Quote:
|
Quote:
I am from the US. https://www.pelicanparts.com/More_Info/92860612400.htm?pn=928-606-124-00-M14&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=22944729823&gbraid =0AAAAAD_tz51aR6fEzeMTMQXCHDvDUcXuH&gclid=CjwKCAiA wqHIBhAEEiwAx9cTeXkqAtAWK5EzQELK7Myrxnx3zIArg2uIUc FEnzW5tk1de4lQde40exoCanAQAvD_BwE http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1762195607.jpg http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1762195619.jpg |
For the three-wire sensor, you should use power from the fuse box — the circuit that’s live when the key is on.
You don’t need a Porsche branded sensor; just use the one directly from Bosch: 0 258 986 502. If you lived in Europe, I would have sent you a Digi-ECU to test — but with the current tariffs, and especially the extremely high shipping costs from Germany to the U.S. right now, that’s just not really feasible. |
I did some testing and best I can tell this plug I found is getting power from Pin 30 at the fuel pump relay, so this power would be pulled from fuse #16 and passed through a relay. It seems like it would be the perfect power source for the 3 wire oxygen sensor.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1762268115.jpg |
The sensor’s heating element draws a lot of current, so as I mentioned, use the switched power from the fuse panel on the left side.
Or use the current from the wire in the pic above from the fuel pump relay for driving a relay which connects the heater to pin 30 in tje fuse box on the left. This is the safest option as by this the sensors heating element gets only current when engine is running Also, with a properly functioning lambda control, no specific driving style is needed. With my engine—and in many others where the lambda control is active—you get full performance across the entire rev range without any surging or similar issues. |
Another update... I was able to add a 3 wire O2 sensor to the car. I used a Bosch 13918 which was powered with a relay. I used a positive signal from the unused thermo valve plug that I mentioned above and constant 12V came from the Heater fan fuse in the rear fuse panel. Unfortunately this made little to no difference in the surging effect while driving with light loads.
I also spoke with the folks at Systems Consulting regarding the ECU box. They mentioned that these Lambda boxes are generally pretty reliable and generally work or don't. I described the problem I was experiencing and they didn't feel that the ECU would be to blame but did offer to test it for me. https://systemsc.com/index.htm I am still on the hunt for the next thing to check |
my near original 1975 911S had the same/similar issue, I chased it for several years. Just converted her to twin Weber 40 IDA carbs. Best thing I have done in years. This beauty was basically not enjoyable to drive.
Best she has run in many many years When new the CIS was unbeatable, after 50 years, not so much my 1987 930 still has the CIS, runs great |
Quote:
But as mentioned, this does not eliminate the root cause — the engine will still run incorrectly, since this would also mean that under certain operating conditions, the mixture becomes too rich. It may result in smooth driving (as you already reported), but with improper fueling and the associated drawbacks. |
It's critical for the warm WUR control pressure be set properly for open loop, checked using the pressure gauge.
In closed-loop, the Lambda ECU should not need to vary the pressure significantly, causing surging, to achieve the optimum Lambda. |
Quote:
I can go back and verify control pressures again to make sure nothing has changed. Any thoughts on the Frequency valve, Anyway it could be sticking, or failing? |
Quote:
Quote:
Check it with the O2 connected & not connected, i.e. basically no pressure difference. If still no improvements, one can always attenuate the O2 signal, e.g. reduce by 50% - a simple two resistor voltage divider in the Lambda ECU. |
Another update. I took the car for a 20ish mile ride to get some heat in the engine, then checked pressures. Fuel pump pressure was measured at 67psi and hot control pressure at 49psi. Both are on the low side of the spec, but nothing major. I do see about a 1psi increase on hot control pressure if the motor is revved, but I just equated this to a slight increase in voltage to the fuel pump. Should I be concerned with either of these readings? No change in pressures from O2 sensor connected or disconnected.
|
Quote:
|
"If still no improvements, one can always attenuate the O2 signal, e.g. reduce by 50% - a simple two resistor voltage divider in the Lambda ECU."
Dave, what is the purpose behind this? Phil |
…lets the signal provide less voltage to the ECU, and the signal’s amplitude will be lower. The ECU interprets this as a too lean mixture even if it's ok and increases the duty cycle.
It’s ok for testing purposes, but it still compensates for a fault on the CIS side, so the real solution is to fix the existing problem. |
Quote:
You should first have your WUR checked and readjusted. Ask Tony here in the forum — he’s your man. Here are the correct pressures mentioned: https://nineelevenheaven.wordpress.com/adjusting-the-warm-up-regulator/ Then take another test drive. And if you still have issues afterward, ask Dave if he can test your ECU. |
Quote:
This is what causes the engine surging. An incorrect warm control pressure WUR setting can cause this, or the Lambda ECU's closed loop feedback gain. |
| All times are GMT -8. The time now is 05:41 AM. |
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2025 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website