3.6 coversion

[boost]

hello all hope someone can guide me in the right direction.i have a "85" 911.wanting to upgrade to varioram 3.6 motor.what is involved ie mounts,g/box,and general.all help or links wpuld be greatly appreciated.thanks in advance.

[3.6 911]

Having done a 3.6 and replaced it with a 3.8 I would highly suggest using a conversion kit. Personally I would use what Steve Timmins has put together. He offers complete tech support and instuctions that others do not. Good luck!

[boost]

next slight problem im located in australia and my guess is steve timmins is in maybe the us.is there any where in aust i can locate a kit or can seak advice.or how do i get in contact with this steve .regards

[magilla]

Boost,

You can do a search, as this has been covered at great length on this board. There are at least half a dozen that have done this swap and another 6 that are in the process. I am, unfortunately, not one of them.

Just click the "Search" button at the top of the page and look for "3.6 conversion", and you shoul dhave more info than you can read in the next few hours.....

PS- Steve Timmins is http://www.instant-g.com/

[3.6 911]

You beat me to it. I was just going to post Steve's address. He is very easy to reach by email and I'd be willing to bet he can ship anywhere.

"Timmins, Steve"

[boost]

thanks you both for the link.regards

[Embs]

Before you do ANY business with Timmins read his policies and warranty statement:http://instant-g.com/Products/Warranty/index.html
Then ask yourself if you have ever read anything like that before at places like Patrick Motorsports, John Walkers Workshop, or Steve Weiner's Rennsport Systems, the answer will be NO.

Yes, a lot of people on this board have had very good luck with Timmins. Myself and two other people that I know of have not had favorable experiences with Timmins. Two of us ended up in court. That being said, he has done what appears to be top notch work for people like Bill Verburg on this BBS.

Regardless of what you do,

Caveat emptor!

[Bill Verburg]

I would recommend the purchase of one of Steve's kits to facilitate the swap. There are lots of little pieces needed that can be a headache to gather on you own.

Not sure what vrams are available in AU but I would want a type M64/21 ROW which has the more easily dealt w/ OBD1 DME unit.

[surflvr911sc]

Originally posted by Bill Verburg
There are lots of little pieces needed that can be a headache to gather on you own.

Aint that the truth! It is very rewarding to figure it out w/ out a kit though. It just depends on what you're looking for.

Some just want it to be done, can't blame them. Some enjoy the journey (good and bad) as much as destination.

Money wise, it won't be a big enough difference to consider.

[ischmitz]

One more thing to be aware of when you go with a Timmens kit is that most of the "little pieces" are either Porsche parts readily available elsewhere (studs, PS blockoff, seals, oil lines) aftermarket parts (clutch, airfilter) or badly engineered parts. I would always gather the parts myself. That way I know what failed rather than having to chase bad design (throttle linkage, duct-tape for vaccum block-offs, fan block-off, electrical).

And beware if something goes wrong in the process. I have seen good and evil when it came to sorting out problems. Read the disclaimer and make sure you understand word for word what your rights are before dropping loads of cash.

All you really need is a custom flywheel (PMS makes them) and some good schematics to hook up the DME to the car electrics.

Ingo

[boost]

oh,WOW,ARENT I NOW CONFUSED.is there any one who has a timmens kits who would like to contribute as im unsure.any more feed back would be greatly appreciated.thanks

[ischmitz]

I have seen it on MikeZ's car. Trust me, I had to deal with sorting out the issues. Plus there are others that had to deal with the same issues. Do a search on conversion on the board. That's what made me shy away from it and do my own thing. I turned out quite well and the car runs without any single issue from day one...

Ingo

[Moses]

If I were to do this again, I would get a motor from Harald Julicher then use this forum to piece out the details.

Bill Verberg, Ingo Schmitz, Thom Fitzpatrick, Jack Olsen and Todd Embs have a wealth of knowledge about this transplant and they are all generous with their help.

[ischmitz]

And remember Paul Scopp (pbs911) has done his conversion (with a Dr. T. kit as starting point) himself and Ryan Williams is in the process of doing his himself without the kit. The bottom line for me is that the useful parts in the kit (e.g flywheel) are made by PMS to begin with.

Harald is a good known and trusted source for motors especially when it comes to OBD I varioram 993's. Don't try to go with a US OBD II varioram since you will get grey hair or loose your hair trying to sort out the DME/antitheft device issues. What you might save initially buying it you will spend tripple getting it to run.

Once I get my website off the ground again, it'll have some good info and documentation of what I did.

ingo

[3.6 911]

To help disspell some of the myths running around the board I offer these comments:
WE all know Todd has had his difficulties with Steve. Let's not reopen this.
Every conversion has it's own set of problems. It really comes down to where did you get the engine and was it butchered upon removal. Keep in mind you are buying a used engine probably out of a wreck. The chances of everything being perfect are slim to none.
As others can support the statement, Steve offers complete tech support through the conversion. As I offered before this is not a perfect world and you are doing a custom conversion.
As for the warranty on the IG website; at least you know where you stand. How many others on the board have had a bad experience becase there was nothing stated anywhere regarding warranty.

[Alan.UK]

Now very confused....

Well until reading this thread I was going with the Dr T kit, (I have not read any threads indicating bad experiences with it) but now I am thinking that maybe I should do it my self and source the parts direct. The main problem for me is the electrics and the wiring up of the DME and engine connection to the pre 73 loom....

Does any have the schematics ? and also I guess the answer is yes, but if I go it alone I am sure you guys will help ? When its time to shoving the motor in if any of you 3.6 conversion guys wants to join me then please feel free. (South Coast UK)

Also does anyone know a good source for the sachs power clutch?

Alan.UK

[Embs]

The flywheel for the 915 or G50, the Center force clutch, The power steering block off, the complete harness and throttle cable are all available (and top notch quality) from:http://www.patrickmotorsports.com/


I got the front oil cooler kit from:
http://tremotorsports.com/ (excellent customer service and quality)

Chip/electronics from: http://www.rennsportsystems.com/1-a.html
(Steve Weiner is the nicest most informative guy you'll ever meet.)

Seals, oil return tubes and most everything else can be purchased here at Pelican including the sach power clutch kit, the center force is better IMHO.

You have to cut a chunk out of your bellhousing for the DME pick-up. Patrick Motorsports gives directions on that.

That pretty much leaves the spacer blocks and the modified crossmember which is any easy weld job for a good welder.

A 3.6 transplant is a job, make no mistake but it is not rocket science. Break the whole project down into logical steps, gather all of the components you'll need and go for it. There is always help on this BBS. I have been bailed out countless times.

As far as Timmins goes, use your own judgement as I stated earlier, many people have used his stuff/had no issues, Bill Verburg being the best example I know of. I am one picky bastard and I want everything exactly right or as "right" as it can be. Timmins is really into racing and his schedule comes first.

[tholyoak]

Well since others have offered their opinions I will add mine

I have done 2 3.6 swaps, as stated this is not rocket science (although the 968 engine into the 944 was actually an easier swap.. but that is another story).

The first swap was done using the kit from Steve Timmins.
The second I did making my own conversion harness fule lines etc. (except for purchasing the flywheel (actually from Steve as well)).

If you want to purchase all the parts in one transaction and have the conversion done in a single weekend then I would highly recommend purchasing Steve's kit.

If you don't mind spending extra time, fabricating a harness, sourcing fittings for fuel lines, modifying sheetmetal etc and are doing the swap because this is what you like to do or are extremely picky in the way things are done then purchase the flywheel from one of the previously mentioned sources and let your engineering skills run wild.

I think if you are going to purchase conversion parts separately (ie a harness here, a flywheel there etc) you will waste a lot of time and not save any money so again in this situation I would recommend Steve's kit.

The only thing I don't like about Steve's kit is the solution to the throttle linkage. I think there are better solutions to this and they have been addressed on the list.

Again just another opinion.

Todd

[Embs]

Originally posted by tholyoak
If you want to purchase all the parts in one transaction and have the conversion done in a single weekend then I would highly recommend purchasing Steve's kit. The only thing I don't like about Steve's kit is the solution to the throttle linkage. I think there are better solutions to this and they have been addressed on the list.

Again just another opinion.

Todd

I can't disagree with that (as much as I would like to) But buy your engine from Harald.

[ischmitz]

Hmmm,

if cutting an oval piece of aluminum is not worth my own time (5min) over buying for more than 100 bucks... I guess that's what the Americans call LIVING LARGE