What'd I do wrong?

[dmk42]

My first ever post - a question about 84 Carrera washer troubles, got 59 reads, no replies. Is it something I said? My junior status? Maybe it's because I'm from St. Louis (Where's that anyway?), home of those nasty LA dissing Rams.

Okay, I'll try begging: Please, please, please oh Oracle's of 911 lore, help me with my windshield washers. I showered and shaved this morning, I'm wearing clean clothes (well, mostly) and I promise I'll get a haircut this afternoon if you'll help me out

Here's the crux of my previous post:
Neither of the washers in my 84 targa are working. There's no power at the windshield washer motor. Before getting into the switch on the column should I look at anything else? There's a washer relay behind the leftmost dash guage, behind the buzzer relay that I can't remove - seems to be frozen in it's socket.
Does anyone know anything about that relay? - Is it supposed to pull out, or is it at all likely that it's the cause of my problem?

DMK

[buttjoint]

What about a fuse? I will look at my bently.

[masraum]

If you were getting power to the motor, but no washing you'd get a lot more help as that is more common. The problem is probably that other than a bad fuse, switch or relay no one probably knows what to tell you, I know I don't.

My thoughts would be to 1st, check the fuse, 2nd check the relay, and third check the switch.

To get at the relay try taking the left most 2 gauges out, that may give you more room to work, or at least you should be able to see the relay from inside the car through the holes in the dash. I think it should just pull straight out, but it's been so long since I was in there I can't say with 100% certainty.

I know that the switch can become troublesome for the wiper actuation, but have never heard anything about the washer.

When you check the motor for power did you have someone actuate the switch? You probably won't get power unless the switch is pulled. (I know that seems obvious, but I had to ask as we all miss obvious things from time to time).

[buttjoint]

just looked at my bently, and it showed that the washer is on the same fuse as the cig lighter, Fuse is located up front in the middle cluster of fuses and is #6 fuse, So if your cig lighter does not work, check the fuse. Jim

[Joeaksa]

DMK (what is your first name? We are a friendly bunch here)

Have you taken a VOM (volt ohm meter) to the wiring to check if there is any power to the motor? Have seen several of them siezed and in that case it can blow the fuse.

Get a Bentley manual when you can. Big help with the wiring diagrams.

If you go to Robata, stand to the East towards Germany and toast the 911 gods with some Sake, it will help. Even if it doesnt, you will feel better after several of them!

JoeA
(ex-Kirkwood type!)

[buttjoint]

The key has to be on or acc

[dmk42]

Thanks for all the info! I'll try to get out to the car this afternoon (after my haircut) and try out some of your suggestions. The cig. lighter works, so I guess that fuses are rulled out.

First name's Don. My Rams theory must be wrong - even an Arizona guy replied (thanks Joe)!

[HarryD]

Don,

Electrical problems are sometimes difficult to diagnose using a shotgun technique. YOu will need a volt-ohm meter (VOM) and the wring diagram as basic tools.

On the diagram, find the circut that goes from the battery to the motor and trace it out. Note where there are connectors, fuses, switches, and other devices connected. Now you need to locate those items in you car. Some will be buried under a ton of stuff or be very hard to reach.

A a quick test, you can run a wire directly from the battery to the motor to see if it runs. (Use the wiring diagram to show you where to apply power). This will help you decide if you have a bad motor or bad wiring.

Then, turn on the power (use the acc position of the key), use your VOM, to measure the voltage at each point you identified in your wiring diagram. Start closest to the battery until you either get a 0 volt reading or you complete the circuit. What you are doing is verifying that the circuit is complete and you are getting power to each point along the way. Chances are you will find a failed componenet, loose conenctor or a broken wire which you can then repair or replace.

It takes time but you will find the problem.

Good luck.

[masraum]

Just another note. Mine didn't work, I put power straight to the motor and it didn't pump, so I pulled it out, took it apart, cleaned it up and put it back together. The gears had been clogged with crud, so after the cleaning the motor worked, but the washer still wouldn't spray on the windshield, so I then had to replace the two flow-back valves. There is a "T" shaped valve at the base of the windshield on the driver's side and an "L" shaped valve on the passenger's side. When those get old the washer often won't work as well.

[dmk42]

Double checked the power at the pump and it has power after all. Don't know how I missed it the first time - maybe the key wasn't on. Anyway, the pump is the problem. Put power straight to it, as Steve suggested, and it stutters a bit, an then stops. I've pulled the pump and will disasemble it tonight. If a good cleaning doesn't get it going I guess I'll be sending some bucks Pelican's way.

Thanks for all the great suggestions.

Don

[jwetering]

My washers didn't (and still don't) work in my 1978. Turns out that neither the PO or I ever drove the car in the rain, so after 20 years the windshield washer fluid had congealed into a gel in the resevoir, the pump, all of the lines, and the nozzles themselves. Very messy.

Stupid thing is that I spent a day taking it ALL apart and cleaning it out, and then promptly refilled the system with fresh washer fluid. I haven't used the washers since so it's probably happeneing all over again.

Actually I made a half hearetd attempt to flush the tank with clean water, but since the nozzles are plugged I have no idea if I was succesful.

Lastly.....I've heard the thing to do for fair weather fliers like me is to set up a plastic soda bottle in the luggage compartment right next to the pump. It'll hold enough for the occasional use and the bonus is you get to remove a 3 litre tank of liquid (about 7 pounds) from inside your front fender.

Welcome to the board by the way.

[stomachmonkey]

Don,

You can buy a pump at any local PEP boys for $12.

When I replaced mine they looked up 84 Porsche and handed me a GM unit.

Works fine.

Turns out my biggest problem was the washer nozzles themselves had clogged with gak.

Clean your original pump, hook some hose to it and run it outside the car, see if you can get fluid out of the hose, then hook it into your system, if you get nothing you need to clean the nozzles or better yet buy new ones, they are cheap.

If you clean them just soak them in some warm vinegar for a while and that should loosen the crud.

Honestly if the system got little use by the PO I would just pick up a new pump, 20 feet of hose, some new nozzles, a couple of t fittings and redo the whole thing.

Probably cost you $30 max and an afternoon of your time, then never worry about it again.

Scott

[dmk42]

Success! I cleaned it up, lubed it a bit and put it back together. I've tested it with 12 volts DC and it's spinning freely. I'll get it back in the car tomorrow. I guess then I'll find out what else is wrong with the system.

It's amazing to me that this thing is serviceable, and that the gears are brass, not plastic or nylon. If this is typical of Porsche quality I'm really going to enjoy working on one, and not just driving it!

Again, thanks for all of the suggestions.

Don

[Joeaksa]

Don,

The other posters are correct about the tubing and such. Get new valves at a minimum as they get full of calc and lime which clog up your squirters.

Glad to hear it worked!

JoeA