3.2 performance upgrades
 

What simple performance options are available for the 3.2.

Increase in HP, but at this time cannot incur too much cost

Air filter, exhaust, manifold mods. Don't want to pull engine now, I'll save that for the rebuild.

thanks for the info

85 911 carrerahttp://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1073446646.jpg

Chip
 

Steve Wong Chip

DCN
1988 911 Coupe

premuffler / muffler - Steve W chip

What gains do you get with the dansk pre-muffler and 2 out

How good is the steve chip on the us model - I read another forum going round and round about the dyno

thanks,

See:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=140154&perpage=20&pagen umber=1

On my car the difference was nothing short of amazing. To think that people are charging 100 bucks for cone filters and fancy air filters that make alot more noise than hp, Steve's chip is a bargin.

IMHO

SteveW chip all the way. That's currently the only upgrade I have and it was well worth the money. Made the car much more fun to drive, and generally more drivable around town.

Exhaust = good. Chip = good. Air filter = almost useless.

-Wayne

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=61178&highlight=dyno+fi gures

Chip?
Read the FAQ page Question 2 on the Andial web site (www.andial.com).
Andial is Porsche Racing USA for the Porsche Factory.

Don't get sucked into buying junk chips which do little to nothing!

Good Luck
Loren
'88 3.2

Andial is saying exactly what everyone with sanity has been saying here for a long while-exhaust mods + an appropriate, conservative chip will give you a minor hp increase, and maybe some subtle drivablility increase as well.

Adding an additional exhaust tip to my stock muff was the best bang for the buck. Not huge but worth it.

A search will yield plenty of direction.

From the Andial web site:

"If you do nothing else to the engine but install a chip from a reputable
company, you can expect, on average an approximate 5 % horsepower
increase. "

They say REPUTABLE!

Also, remember: HP = Torque X RPMs

Assuming a fairly flat torque curve, then

At 6000 RPMs, HP for 3.2 is about 210 @ 5% that's about 10 hp increase
At 3000 RPMs, Hp for 3.2 is about 105 @ 5% that's about 5 hp increase

Not much to write home about, since most driving occurs at <<6000RPMs.
Plus, the problems with potential pinging, idling, & driveability.

Have Fun
Loren
'88 3.2, no chip

Don't you have to deduct 15% for drive train loss?

The numbers make the point. Using RWHP the gain is even less!

Have Fun
Loren
'88 3.2

OK so let's assume 10 hp on the 3.2 - Steve charges what? $280? - $28 per HP has to be some of the cheapest PORSCHE hp ever!

Depending on the smog regs in your state you can be limited to just a chip or various stages of intake & exhaust improvements.

In order to improve the engines ability to function as an air pump, which is all internal combution engines are, really, you can use the going hot chip, int his case Steve Wong's, to improve the fuel mapping.

Next you want to open up the intake side with a cone style K&N airfilter(not a H.P. inducing addition in itself) then a set of SSI's and then a dual out sport muffler.

If you have smog law considerstions and or a slimmer budget, you'll have to go the pre-muff/bypass route, which is almost as good as the SSI's, but still a compromise.

Everything above, together working as a "system" will give you a good amount of add'l punch when you put your foot into it.

Just my.02 ...good luck!!!

So who, in your mind, is reputable?

I've got a SteveW chip and cat bypass. I think it's totally worth the money. There are just not a lot of cheap upgrades for these cars, but this is one of them. Don't expect miracles, but there is a difference.

I don't think the power is up so much as the responsiveness and torque are better, especially in the low rev range. I find myself cruising around at lower RPMs. I did have the bypass pipe on without the chip for several months, and it is the chip making the difference. I did have the "more aggressive" of the two factory chips that Porsche put in the '88 cars to start with, so I'm probably seeing the least dramatic increase of anyone. But it was still worth it.

I agree with Wayne, Chip + exhaust (pre-muffler & Sport Muffler) make the car a pleasure and more sporting to drive. Made a nice difference in my 87, engine pulls much stronger above 1500 rpm. Put chip in first - that made a nice improvement. Once the pre-muffler and sport muffler went on, the improvement was very noticeable, nice sound to boot. I went with the Steve Wong chip, great people to deal with and will answer any questions you have.

5% isn't significant? What car manufacturer consistently produces better results than 5% annual improvements? In 1987 the 911 had 217hp. In 1997 is had 285hp. Thats a 31% improvement that took 10 years to achieve. Pick other years and models and you'll see similar numbers. Now factor in weight. The 993 is a lot heavier than a 911 Carrera. The improvment in hp/lb ratio isn't nearly as good as just hp.

So you are telling me I can gain 5% hp without any weight gain for $280 and 30 minutes of my time? Sign me up!

The KEY forgotten point:

It is ASSUMED that the increase is 6 to 8%. No proof though.
Cost per HP = $280 divided by ? is probably infinite by my math.

But it's the FEELINGS. Sounds like a Clinton pitch!

Good Luck
Loren
'88 3.2

On my 86 911, I first started with the dansk 1 in 2 out sport muffler then added the premuffler and notice a power increase. Added a Steve Wong chip an notice another power increase. The car was much more enjoyable to drive. Wong chip was best money spent and he is a great guy, very helpful.

Tell that to all the 930 guys who try to reduce turbo lag, even without increasing horsepower. Sometimes the non-quantifiable is still a valid pursuit.

But what about this from this thread http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/140400-steve-wong-chip-installed-post1086908.html#post1086908 :

hi steve,
just got done with making some runs comparing stock car with stock chip vs.
yr chip. made 6-7 runs each on the same stretch of road. i chose to
compare horsepower only as 0-60 times is just too hard to replicate and i
don't want to abuse my clutch so much. the horsepower numbers were obtained
from wot in second gear till the rev limiter kicked in. i tried to control
the other variables as much as possible such as the amount of gas in the
tank (filled up b4 each set of runs), and external temp was within 3
degrees. the g-tech was set with the vehicle wt as 3000 pounds and kept
constant in its position and setting for each run. i eliminated the highest
and lowest runs from each set and obtained the following avg horsepower:
stock chip: 174.75 your chip: 188.25! and as i said before, not only
does it show better numbers, it makes the car so much more lively and fun to
drive throughout the rpm range which is what really counts for me. it's
idling a bit higher but is very smooth, no hunting and no pinging that i can
tell so far. the fabspeed premuffler is going on later and i'll make more
runs in the next two days when i can get the external temp to cooperate.
btw, please feel free to share any of this info with anyone. take care,
mike

Other than the chip, what could have made the g-tech "feel" the increase in hp?

Loren,
I can't understand your negitivity regarding Steve's work.
So far he has sent me three differant chips trying to razor
edge tune the power curve of my 87 Carrera. I have been increasing my smiles with every change. I havn't installed
the third one yet because of time but this Saturday it too
will be installed and I'm sure that will prduce even more
grins. I'm serious right now it purrs at idle and sound like
ripping sheets at 6000. Steve keep up the good work,
maybe you should send the used one I will be sending back to Loren just to shut him up!!

Keith Epperly 87 Slant nose turbo look Carrera cabriolet

Loren - I have got to say this - I think you bring some valid arguments - but you my friend have probably done more for Steve Wong's business than ANYONE. I hope he sent you a Christmas Card. Everytime you respond with your assertions - 30 happy Steve Wong customers (and usually different ones) write their satisfaction with his product. I have yet to see anybody say - yeah - tried SteveW chip and didn't do anything... Or tried Steve's number and didn't get a call back...

LOL...

Kepperly:

"So far he has sent me three differant chips trying to razor
edge tune the power curve of my 87 Carrera."

Why three different chips? A 3.2 is a 3.2. If it were done properly
using a dyno, you wouldn't have to be "playing" around. What a joke!
That's real "REPUTABLE" isn't it, as Andial says.

Have Good Feelings
Loren
'88 3.2

Since I have a 3.2 that has had several chips, stock, Authothority, and finally, Steve's, I'm amused that any post about a 3.2 upgrade will inevitably turn into a p*ssing match of chip vs no chip. What gives? I'll spell it out, and if I've missed something, let me know:

Porsche builds car. Porsche must make car fit US regulation for emissions and fuel milage. Porsche must also make allowances for car gasolines available over a large octane level. Porsche designs chip to meet minimal requirements. Chip programmer designs chip to run on higher octance gas. Programmer does not have to worry about fuel efficiency or milage. Programmer can then only program the optimal setting to maximize engine performance.

Sounds too simple I guess. Just like the last time I had my car at the track that I had run 100's of time before. The only change was a change to Steve's chip and my redline was hitting way before it did on prior runs. Lap times down. Explanation?

Loren, what would make you happy?

Here is what I want...
 

I'd like a really cheap mod that gives me about 275 to 300 rwhp, increases the power across the whole rev range and promotes engine longevity. Any suggestions?

Loren, Steve offered me my money back If I did not like his chip. Sounds fairly reputable to me. Pelican is reputable and so is Andial, but both places have never offerd money back if you don't happen to "like" a product. How about your company? Is there a money back policy if I don't "like" it?

Jeff

Loren:
The points you make are generically valid, but there is no denying that chips can work ( and indeed seem to be the case with my Steve W chip !). You seem to dismiss "seat-of-pants" experiences out of hand...as a possible placebo effect...but even for some seasoned guys like myself there is absolutely no denying the mid-range torque improvement effect on a direct before-and-after change using Steve's chip. I intend to dyno my car in spring ( after winter hibernation) as I already have baseline dyno runs on my car before. This may help settle the issue at that time.

To the point of the poster's original question, however, a mild but noticeable upgrade can be made using a combo of :
- a good chip
- a Euro-pre muffler in lieu of cat. (I know the Porsche part works and presume the Fabspeed or Dansk similar shape unit will do as well. A normal "straight-pipe", however....may not improve things).
- dual-out muffler.

With such mods, my otherwise stock 85 3.2 Carrera dyno'd at 200 rear-wheel hp retaining the cat and using a "performance" chip and drilled airbox. Sequentially adding the Euro premuffler and later , Steve's chip gave incrementally improved results via the butt-dyno. Real dyno numbers will be interesting...even if they should only show a fattening of the mid range torque curve and no hp increase at top-end. That wouldn't disappoint me either based on how the car now feels.

---Wil Ferch

Why for everyone on this board to send their DME into him to work on. That's his business. To be honest, he is always so antagonistic that he would probably be the last person I would ever send anything to.

Oh...to Trader220:
You want cheap, painless, reliable 300 rear wheel ( ! ) hp?

.....Chevy conversion.... :)

--Wil Ferch

Wil, thanks but i said cheap as in the cost of a chip.

5% HP increase... My 87 Carrera made 217 bhp stock. 5% X 217 = 10.85.

Therefore, Steve W's chip puts my 1987 Carrera at 228 bhp and does wonders for the low end torque range. That is a nice increase for $230!

And now, with Andial and Lorenfb making the claim..., I feel even better about my Steve W chip--thanks!

Mike

Trader:
Even a $10,000 chip isn't going to get you 300 REAR wheel hp in a 3.2 .....LOL :)

----Wil Ferch

Loren,
You are about to pxxs me off. I take it with your worlds
of experience that you have never played around with
the timing on any of your previous vehicles, otherwise
you would understand why one changes the advance
curve. Steve also has capabilities of allowing the injectors
to stay open longer intervals to pump more fuel into the combustion chamber at any given rpm. If I had had the
experience of motronic tuning modification back when I
owned a 69 copo 427 camaro it would of had a motronic and Steve Wong chip and over 550 hp instead of the 494hp it
made on the dyno.

Keith Epperly 87 slant nose carrera wide body cabriolet

The SteveW chip gives me a difference that I can definitely notice. Even if it "only" gives me 2%-5% overall increase in HP, it made the car have a *much* *much* nicer overall powerband. It was worth it. SteveW also provided great support when I had questions about the chip, its installation and its effect.

Try it, and if you don't like it, return it. Simple.