OTR at Willow Springs - Jan. 21st

[dd74]

Who's going to Willow Springs for the Open Track Racing on Jan. 21st? Anyone?

I sent in all my paperwork Tuesday, and received my group assignment. Now all I need is a helmet and gloves.

[surflvr911sc]

I'll be there, and I'm bringing my Dad w/ his car. We'll probably go up the night before and spend the night.

[Jack Olsen]

I'll be there. As usual, we'll try to get enough experienced Pelicanites to instruct the new guys.

For those of you considering it, there's more information here.

[campbellcj]

I'll try to make it -- my work schedule is a bit unpredictable, and I am fighting the burning urge to take apart the car (again)

[Jack Olsen]

Looks like we might have Hans Stoehr, too.

[surflvr911sc]

Hopefully a lot of P-cars show up and there aren't 25+ cars running in yellow this time, that looked like a bit much. Blue must have had almost as many.

Credit to the OTR guys though, they seemed to do a great job of handling the crowd w/o turning guys away.

[speeder]

I'll be there, just booked the job that will pay for this month's Porsche shenanigans. I missed the last one and it hurt me to my core.

Jack, that picture is just the cat's pajamas, where was it taken?

[ted]

Originally posted by surflvr911sc
Hopefully a lot of P-cars show up and there aren't 25+ cars running in yellow this time, that looked like a bit much. Blue must have had almost as many.

Credit to the OTR guys though, they seemed to do a great job of handling the crowd w/o turning guys away.

I'd like to attend though when I commute the 3.5 hours from San Diego I would rather make it a two day race event. Weekends are easier (cheaper) for me too.

Here is another option.
Good luck racing,
Mike

The San Diego PCA holds two day weekend events at Big Willow, Streets of Willow and Button Willow and the California Speedway. It would appear some of you have entered a couple of these OTD events and might now qualify for a PCA event. The 2 day PCA events are actually a better bargain than the OTD one events. Competitive entry fees and more track time with better drivers.

At the PCA events you would be running with mostly Porsches. PCA drivers have fulfilled the minimum PCA driving experience requirements. Hopefully no bone heads.

Just a thought, PCA will be at SOW this month and Button Willow the following month. California Speedway and Big Willow will be this spring. Great events run by Porsche owners for Porsche drivers.

Check it out.
http://www.pcasdr.org/timetrial/index.html

San Diego PCA TT schedule.

Jan 24-25 Sat/Sun - Streets of Willow (Zone 8)
Feb 14-15 Sat/Sun - Buttonwillow
May 14-16 Fri-Sun - Fontana (Zone 8)
Jun 26-27 Sat/Sun - Willow Springs (Zone 8)
Oct 2-3 Sat/Sun - Spring Mountain
Nov 13-14 Sat/Sun - Streets of Willow (Zone 8)
Dec 11-12 Sat/Sun - Willow Springs (Zone 8)

[Jack Olsen]

San Diego's PCA runs a great event, and they do it on weekends, which works better for most guys.

But Open Track Racing is less crowded (even in the case of the last, seriously overbooked, event in December), and you get more track time (only three run groups, so at least five 30-minute sessions).

On the other hand, I'd say PCA/SD has better instructors (and I say that as the chief Porsche instructor with OTR ), and more Porsches.

But both are good events.

Denis, the picture is from Willow Springs, from a March event with Open Track Racing. BB2 was freshly built, and I was running the ducktail.

[RSupdate]

Originally posted by ted
The San Diego PCA holds two day weekend events at Big Willow, Streets of Willow and Button Willow and the California Speedway. It would appear some of you have entered a couple of these OTD events and might now qualify for a PCA event. The 2 day PCA events are actually a better bargain than the OTD one events. Competitive entry fees and more track time with better drivers.

At the PCA events you would be running with mostly Porsches. PCA drivers have fulfilled the minimum PCA driving experience requirements. Hopefully no bone heads.

Just a thought, PCA will be at SOW this month and Button Willow the following month. California Speedway and Big Willow will be this spring. Great events run by Porsche owners for Porsche drivers.

Check it out.
http://www.pcasdr.org/timetrial/index.html

San Diego PCA TT schedule.

Jan 24-25 Sat/Sun - Streets of Willow (Zone 8)
Feb 14-15 Sat/Sun - Buttonwillow
May 14-16 Fri-Sun - Fontana (Zone 8)
Jun 26-27 Sat/Sun - Willow Springs (Zone 8)
Oct 2-3 Sat/Sun - Spring Mountain
Nov 13-14 Sat/Sun - Streets of Willow (Zone 8)
Dec 11-12 Sat/Sun - Willow Springs (Zone 8)

Mikey's right.

At least for what works for me he is...

Anyway, the PCA-SDR events are not that crowded and everyone out on the track has had a set minimum of mandated PCA instruction. Even the slow guys(and gals) know what's right vs. wrong in 99% of the "traffic" situations.

I personally find comfort in the fact that in every close car passing situation I've been in, the other guy has just as much to lose $$$ wise as I do in the event of any "contact". Thus I have observed a very evident sort of chivalry amongst the drivers. It gives me piece of mind when one considers being banged into by a nissan, acura or Ford Focus owner who pays pennies on the dollar when compared to what we must pay for....and Porsche owners I ve driven with don't seem to get "rice in their eyes" or "the rice mist" out on the track.

Jack, I would have to question you on the OTR events being less crowded than the PCA TT's.....

For example.... The last two PCA-TT's I entered (Pahrump & WSIR) the overall total # of cars per run group was like 15-17 cars. Are the OTR events less crowded than that? In fact there was extra space for the WSIR TT back on Dec 13-14 and 3 vipers put the $$$ down to come out and play. I think there was a ttl of 50-something cars.....

I've seen the pre-event entry lists for the OTR events and the super cool pricing attracts IMHO, alot of drivers...and a good chunk of them have Tokyo stamped sheet metal....no?

[Vipergrün]

Wedding anniversary on the 21st.....nuff said....I'll still be having fun on the curves

Have a great time guys!

-B

[Tyson Schmidt]

I'm a lock. Wouldn't miss it for the world!

I'll see if I can get one more track day out of these tires that were pretty much gone 3 track weekends ago. At least it makes it more exciting for my passengers.

David, I'm so proud of you for getting out there! Soon, it will all make sense!

[dd74]

[i]

David, I'm so proud of you for getting out there! Soon, it will all make sense! [/B]

If this persistant hangover fades by then, I'll be there.

NOTE: never play drinking games with an Irish "Lord of the Dance" type like I did. Oooooo...

[Vipergrün]

Dave, I have a size medium Bell full face helmet and some gloves you are welcome to borrow. I can drive vicariously thru my helmet

Let me know and we can make arrangements.

-B

[dd74]

Originally posted by bb80sc
Dave, I have a size medium Bell full face helmet and some gloves you are welcome to borrow. I can drive vicariously thru my helmet

Let me know and we can make arrangements.

-B

Thanks, Brad, but I'm all set. I ordered a helmet and gloves earlier today. I didn't want to put out or inconvenience anyone.

[ted]

Originally posted by JackOlsen
less crowded (even in the case of the last, seriously overbooked, event in December), and you get more track time (only three run groups, so at least five 30-minute sessions).

Hey Jack,
You might enjoy running with the PCA. You should join us at Buttonwillow next month.

The OTD at Big Willow for $125 for 5 sessions is a good price. No doubt the promoter will stick to their 3 run groups schedule to sell it as 2.5+ hours of track time.

So the trade off is the sessions may be crowded but you will still have only 3 run groups.

With complete disregard to the issues of novice drivers, limited instruction and crowded conditions I would question if this scenario would be conducive to me improving as a driver. It sounds like I would rarely get a clean lap in or even be able to lap continuously with a car of matched performance without traffic being an issue.

At the last Big Willow PCA weekend event we had 3 run groups with less than 17 cars in a run group. One session I was able to run 6 continuous 1:31 laps with a C2 50 yards in tow. That was enjoyable, more so than yielding to faster cars or dodging others every lap. Still I did have to give way to a GT3 cup car, a Viper and Corvette track car and a couple fast 911 track cars too.

The PCA at Big Willow has a more conservative cut off.
If it were to take approximatley 20 cars a session to continue the 3 run group schedule then the PCA might opt for four run groups with lighter traffic. That cut off is based on run groups with experienced drivers or moderately experienced driver’s receiving good instruction.
Cost for a 2 day weekend with the PCA is $250, and hopefully nobody will have to miss a day at work.

OTD... ongoing traffic day?

[dd74]

I'm doing it because there won't be any cops around like on PCH.

[ajackson]

Would anyone like to share a hotel room the night before? I am planning on driving from San Diego on Tue, so if someone else would like to share the cost let me know.

[Jack Olsen]

I don't mean to knock the PCA/SD events in any way. I've run with them, and had a great time. The last event of theirs I went to was pretty crowded, but it may not have been representative, since it was at California Speedway, which is an extroardinarily expensive track to rent.

Here would be my pros and cons list for Open Track Racing's events:

They're not-for-profit, which means they can get by with a total enrollment for the day of around 40 people. At $125 for the day, this makes for a great deal, if you can get off from work on a Wednesday. What's more, they get a company to come in and sponsor a free lunch for everybody.

They provide a lot of track time. I've driven with just about every group running events in California, and no one delivers as much seat time as these guys. The runner up might be Tracquest, but they charge about three times as much. Typically, at an OTR event, you get 2.5 hours of track time, and then they open the track up at the end of the day until pretty much no one has the energy to run any more. For me, it's usually a two-tanks-of-gas event, which is rare.

The December event was an exception to this, and there were so many new people that the event turned a profit, and had crowded run groups. This is the only time I've ever seen this happen with Open Track Racing. They took the extra money they earned from the event and donated it to children's Christmas charities, which is pretty cool, in my book. (Usually, they lose a little money, and the organizer makes it up out of his own pocket.)

For a Pelicanite, the instruction with this group is pretty good. I wouldn't put it on par with the POC, which in my opinion is the best, but you'll generally get instructed by 911 drivers you've met on this board. For the yellow group, there are two classroom sessions, and also a ducks-in-a-row session.

The advantage to PCA and POC events is that they help you make the next step to the POC Short Track Series, or other events, pretty easily. The overall skill level of the instructors is better in the POC and PCA, too. They're almost exclusively Porsche, too, which lets you compare yourself to other drivers in a more apples-to-apples way.

Open Track Racing has a wide variety of cars, but the overall safety and courtesy level is -- in my opinion -- at least as high as POC or PCA events, and much higher than some of the younger-skewing track groups, where things can get a litttle scary. They take safety very seriously, and I've seen them send guys home for aggressive behavior. Also, since there aren't a lot of club racers with dedicated track cars running with the group, the overall dedication to driving the car back home is pretty high.

Again, the PCA/SD also runs a great event, and I plan on doing more driving with them. But OTR has some advantages that a group as big as the PCA can't duplicate. And by the same token, there are some things the PCA offers that a small, mixed-make group like OTR can't match.

[nuvo]

I was going to take part in the Rgruppe's Jan. 26th event at Willow, and was unaware of this event. Is there any reason to choose one over the other?