Guys- I Need Some Major Moral Support!

Rot 911 · 02-29-2004, 02:30 PM

I spent about 6 hours yesterday installing the engine and tranny back into the car after my winter rebuild. Today I finished making all the connections and filling the engine with oil. I hooked up the battery to do my oil pressure test and with both excitement and trepidation I turned the ignition key. All I hear is the starter spinning, but no engine turning over. Well I figured maybe the starter hung up from not being used. I whack it a couple of times with a hammer and still only spins, but doesn't engage. WFT??? Well it is true, you can remove the starter with the engine in the car, not easy, but doable. I bench test the starter, works perfect! Reinstall thinking maybe just didn't mesh with the ring gear on the pressure plate. Turn the key, still just spins! Pull the starter a second time. Bench tests just fine, starter gear kicks out about an inch. Now I am really getting worried. If you twist and squirm enough you can just shine a light and see in the hole where the starter goes. Hmmm something doesn't look quite right. My new pressure plates looks just a bit different, but I'm not sure exactly what it is. The ring gear? I get out my caliper and do some measuring. The ring gear on the new pressure plate sits in 1" farther than the ring gear on the old pressure plate. The starter gear can't even kick out far enough to reach the new ring gear!!!!!!!! Has anyone ever had such a problem? It looks like I have no other choice but to drop the engine and pull the pressure plate. Damn the bad luck. Double damn that I didn't compare the old and new pressure plate! I am going to give a try with just dropping the engine and leaving the tranny in place. And to add insult to injury as I was getting out from under the car I rolled on the point of the caliper poking a hole in my butt. In less than a minute after that I managed to hit my head on the corner of the trunk lid, poking a hole in my head. I'm bleeding at both ends! Now I sit here typing with a sore butt and head. Damn, damn, damn.

chrisp · 02-29-2004, 02:36 PM

What type of clutch did you put in? Never heard of this before.

speeder · 02-29-2004, 02:39 PM

Bummer, Kurt. You have my moral support and if I was closer I would come over and help you.

AFJuvat · 02-29-2004, 02:42 PM

Deepest sympathies Kurt. What kind of clutch kit did you install? Every one I've installed to date hasn't had a problem.

AFJuvat

Dantilla · 02-29-2004, 02:52 PM

It's time for the Do-it-yourselfers-of-the-world to unite behind Kurt.

Rot 911 · 02-29-2004, 02:53 PM

I installed a stock Sachs pressure plate and clutch. I am sitting here looking at the box it came in: "1974-86 Cast Iron Pressure Plate, part number 915-116-001-27"

mjshira · 02-29-2004, 02:55 PM

dude, I would take a break for the day/night. You know how it is when you get a little frustrated - you make mistakes (at least I do) so get a buddy to come and take a look with you later in the week.

I would check all my mounting points (drive train) just for the heck of it. I would also carefully reverse the installation process and take the tranny out too. As I recall it is much easier to put them both in together.

Good luck!

James

steve930t · 02-29-2004, 02:56 PM

Sounds like you left the starter ring gear out. It looks like it's part of the pressure plate...but it's not. You need to transfer it to the new one.

Erakad · Erakad's Garage

Kurt...heart goes out to ya...I sympathize cause this is the type of thing that only (until now) happens to me...right down to siting on the caliper and hitting your head. Listen to these yahoos, they'll get you through it.

Good luck!

Rot 911 · 02-29-2004, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by steve930t
Sounds like you left the starter ring gear out. It looks like it's part of the pressure plate...but it's not. You need to transfer it to the new one.

Are you sure? I can see a ring gear up in there and I don't think it is the one on the flywheel. But in any event the engine is going to have to come out.

steve930t · 02-29-2004, 03:04 PM

What year is your car? I did the same thing with my 86. The teeth on the flywheel are for the sensors, the ring gear on the p/p is for the starter.

steve930t · 02-29-2004, 03:08 PM

Look at the old p/p. If the ring gear is still on it, that should be your problem.

Rot 911 · 02-29-2004, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by steve930t
Look at the old p/p. If the ring gear is still on it, that should be your problem.

Oh yeah there is still a ring gear on my old pressure plate, but I could have sworn the new one had a ring gear on it, but now I am not sure. If it doesn't do I just heat the old one up with a torch to get it off?

steve930t · 02-29-2004, 03:13 PM

From the tech article on this site...

On the 915 transmission, the starter ring is separate from the flywheel. When you remove your old pressure plate, you should remove this starter ring from the plate. Place the starter ring on the top of the engine in clear sight. Almost every mechanic at one time has completely installed the 911 motor and forgotten to install the starter ring.

Engine R&I is easier the second time....good luck.

North Coast Cab · North Coast Cab's Garage

I just did this job myself and read Wayne's reminder about ten times about the starter ring gear. I think it goes something like "every good Porsche mechanic has left it out at least once in their career." Good news is nothing is wrong or damaged.

John

Rick Cabell · 02-29-2004, 03:14 PM

Kurt, I feel your pain. About 4 years ago I did a top end job on my car, and did a marathon session in the shop to try to finish it all up one Sunday. I thought I was moments away from being able to should "clear prop!" and fire her up -- all that was left to do was reconnect the battery -- when I looked under the shop cart I was working off of and discovered, smirking at me...the ring gear. Ouch.

Rot 911 · 02-29-2004, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by steve930t
From the tech article on this site...

On the 915 transmission, the starter ring is separate from the flywheel. When you remove your old pressure plate, you should remove this starter ring from the plate. Place the starter ring on the top of the engine in clear sight. Almost every mechanic at one time has completely installed the 911 motor and forgotten to install the starter ring.

I'm sure I've done dumber things in my life, but right now I sure can't remember one that tops this!

steve930t · 02-29-2004, 03:19 PM

If it doesn't do I just heat the old one up with a torch to get it off?

Mine came off without heat. I was able to tap it lightly with a block of wood and hammer, just make sure you do it evenly so it doesn't bind.

Doug E · 02-29-2004, 03:36 PM

Sorry to hear the news Kurt ... having just gone through a rebuild myself I can only imagine what is going through your mind right now. Take a deep breath, get a good nights sleep and then dive in. You'll have it fixed and be back on the road before you know it.

Good luck!

724doorE · 02-29-2004, 03:50 PM

Don't fret Kurt, I once put in a toploader four speed and bell housing and had it allthe way in when I discovered I forgot the throwout bearing. It was a cast iron trans(heavy) and bell housing and I had no trans jack, did it all with arm power. I was freaking dead when I finally got that thing back together!