Help - Planning a 2.2 S Engine Rebuild

Poorsche Man · 03-18-2004, 11:18 AM

I have a '71 911 s with the 2.2. The car currently has 113k on it and it runs pretty well, but has developed an oil leak out of the front of the engine which I assume is the intermediate shaft seal. I need to pull the motor in order to fix the leak, but with the miles on the car an engine rebuild is probably due.

I went to a local Porsche mechanic here in Campbell, CA and he suggested I put a later motor in the car like a 3.0 or 3.2. I don't think that is something I want to do because I want to keep the numbers matching on the car and because it is an 's'. He told me a rough figure on a complete engine rebuild would be around $8500 if he didn't have to replace pistons. This sounds a bit high and maybe there is another mechanic around Nor Cal that someone knows of. I can do some of the work myself, but it might be a better idea to have it all done by a mechanic. Maybe getting involved with the local PCA would be beneficial in my rebuild process.

Any thoughts or opinions?

Thanks

zac

Tim Walsh · Tim Walsh's Garage

If you've got a garage and are fairly handy with tools I'd say save yourself a bundle and do it yourself. 8500 really isn't out of line for a "drive in, drive out" rebuild. I've spent around 5 grand on my rebuild and I"m doing it myself.

B D · 03-18-2004, 11:34 AM

Miles seem low for a rebuild, have you done a compression or leak down test? I have driven in several 911's with 180,000+ miles that still run strong.

Also you may want to post this in the engine rebuilding forum and get Waynes book on Engine Rebuilding a great resource even if you're not doing the work.

sundaypunch · 03-18-2004, 11:45 AM

I wouldn't go to the extreme of a rebuild unless you are having more major problems. Check compression and leakdown first as others mentioned. If the car is running good but leaking oil I'd fix the leaks first, make sure it's properly tuned, and hold off. If it's a tired engine that's another story.

911ctS · 03-18-2004, 11:47 AM

hey Zac, sounds like a fun project!! $8500 without P/C seems pretty high to me!! You may not need the new pistons anyway. If your ring groove wear limits are ok and if they are in good condition then they should last quite a bit longer. A good upgrade you may want to consider is putting in a 70.4mm crank out of a 2.4 or 2.7. This combination with your current pistons will create a higher compression 2.4L. The compression will end up at about 9.6:1 which is ideal for street use and quality pump gas. Also an elgin mod S cam would be heaps more fun and torquier than the stock S cams.
having done all these mods and some casework will set you back around the quoted figure of $8500. Assuming your 66mm crank is in good cond. and you sell it or trade for the 70.4mm

Clint

West · 03-18-2004, 12:50 PM

If you really are the POORsche Man , then just fix the oil leak. I don't think that 113,000 miles is a ton of miles for a 2.2. I had a 2.2 that had over 200K before I did anything major to it. Just fix the oil leak and see if you can get another 100K out of it.

Rich911E · Rich911E's Garage

Just have someone pull the motor and replace the seal. It shouldn't be that expensive. 113K on that engine is not much. If the compression is good and leakdown is solid, there is nothing wrong with it.

The 2.2 S is a GREAT engine. Do not change it to a later model engine. Or, if you do tell me first! I would love to get one for my car. It is very light and strong and will never break. Do not change the motor to a 2.7 -- if you want one, I'll swap you! The 2.7 has lots of torque, but that high RPM scream is gone. A friend has a 2.2 S spec motor with webers and the thing runs fantastic.

I would perhaps suggest taking the car over to Pacific Fuel Injection and let them take a look at it and maybe do a really good tune of the MFI. You will never look back once that car is running right.

Rich

Joe Bob · Joe Bob's Garage

That's the motor that is going into the 356....great motor....

Grady Clay · 03-18-2004, 04:36 PM

zac,

I agree with Rich, just fix what is needed. Only if you find you need a total rebuild should you even consider other options. There are many.

B D, sundaypunch, and west are correct. Give us more information.
What is the overall condition of the 911S? Prior work, previous damage, rust, other? What are your intensions; daily driver, weekends, DE, etc? You have access to lots of Pelicans who can offer great sage advice.

Tim is right, if you are at all handy with tools, this is a good DIY project. Again, tap the Pelican talent and even then you can hire a mechanic to help.

You can ask Wayne to move this to the “911 Engine Rebuilding” forum, that would be best.

Best,
Grady

speeder · 03-18-2004, 11:34 PM

Zac, The 2.2S motor is one of my all-time favorite 911 motors, high compression+ S cams= the pinnacle of early 911S development, IMO.

The mechanic who gave you that advice either wanted to swindle you out of your (most likely perfect) motor or is just an absolute idiot. Anyone who would consider swapping out your motor from a numbers matching '71 911S w/ ~100k miles for a later CIS motor because of an oil leak should not be anywhere near Porsches. If this was 2 weeks later I would call April Fools on this entire thread.

If you have the mechanical ability to consider a rebuild on your own, then just fix the oil leak(s). It would be very normal for this motor to need re-sealing after 33 years, even if it is otherwise perfect. Good luck!

Sean_irl · 03-19-2004, 01:11 AM

I echo everyones comments...don't even think about replacing the engine...the 2.2S engine is one of the most sought after engines for early p-cars....

$8.5K seems very very high to me.......take the car to someone who knows these cars and get an honest opinion. If you don't have the cash...sort the leak....if you do have the cash...do a top end rebuild.

You will probably need to do it anyhow in the next couple of years...if it hasn't been toughed before.

Best of luck,
Sean

limble · 03-19-2004, 10:06 AM

I had an estimate for a 2,2 engine build in 1995 at $10,000. He was probably trying to cover his ass. So $8500 doesn't seem like much.
Also like any good mechanic he ought to give you all options. Putting a 3.0 or 3.2 engine in an early 911 to me is a great idea but just keep the old engine for the next owner.
Joining PCA? They've been bashed ad nauseam on this board but I've been a member for 10 years and have met many good people.
Just stay away from the concours people they are crazy. I had one attack me with a Q-tip once.

The leak might be return tubes. One of the easier DIY projects.

PorschePilot · 03-19-2004, 11:16 AM

Get a second and then third opinion from recommended Porsche shops. If you are willing to drive up north, I recommend Gary at GD Racing in San Bruno. He only works on Porsches and he'll give you the straight scoop om what needs to be done.

Poorsche Man · 03-19-2004, 11:27 AM

Thanks guys for allt he help. I agree with West that I should get a compression test and a leak down test to determine how strong the engine is. I believe that it is in pretty good shape other than the oil leak and if some of the 2.2 s engines go 200k I don't see why my could not.

So my plan is to do a compression check and a leak down test. If the results prove the engine to be good then I will fix the oil leak and get a tune up. I will also need to reinstall the front mounted oil cooler to have reassurance that the car won't run hot. I haven't seen to many temps above 205 F so it hasn't been running overly hot. I would like to get the factory thermostat that comes off the fire wall with maybe a Carrera intercooler. The thermostats are hard to find though so maybe theres an advantage to using another intercooler setup entirely.

Thanks