1986 Carrera 915 vs. G50 For Bro In Law

[Max Von]

Brother in law (super nice guy, know for 25 years) wants to buy a 911 after 4 years of drooling over my 1988 Carrera. I have helped him get an education on the marque for the last year or so and we have looked at at least 12 cars so far ranging from clapped out to decent SC's to primo 87~89 Carreras. Bottom line is I have told him to hold out for a decent original 87+ G50 car . Well, he came across this little gem today. His original budget was $17K.

1986 Carrera
$ 21,900
69,000 miles

Clutch @ 51,000 miles
Maojr service @ 67,000
Brake pads 50 %- something master pads- "brake master ? "
No oil leaks
No rust
All service records
Original manual and warranty book
Jack, tool kit, compressor original
Paint is original and outstanding ! No Flaws

VIN WPoab0914gs122613

Factory short shift
Factory sport seats
Front strut bar
Metallic Gray
Sunroof
A/C works

Needs: cruise control cable
rear tires
front headlight washers don't work
heater booster fan in foot wells ( both sides )


Seems really nice. PCA member etc. Guy owns three other P cars and knows what he has.

I'm tellilng my Bro that $21K is high for an 86 (BA's recent evaluation aside) but this car's condition is exceptional according to my brother in law. I will be making a trip to inspect this one later in the week.

Opinions welcome.

[preeble]

Ask yourself - what is the G50 worth - to me, perhaps $3,000? Hard to put a price tag on it. So if you were looking at some car, but a year older, would he pay almost $25 for it? I think $25 is too high - I purchased an 87 with less than 40k miles for less than that.

However, if he loves the color combo it may be worth it. If he is so-so about this rare color, he should wait to find exactly what he is looking for at this price level.

This is my opinion, but if I really wanted the car, I would pay maybe $20k for it? Again, just my opinion. The dangerous game is - is he willing to lose the car over a $500 diff - assuming the owner is willing to negotiate a little?

The other thing is that he could spend another $500-$1000 on the car just fixing the items you mentioned above, so he needs to factor that in too.

Not sure if I helped any...

[Max Von]

Damn, still trying to post correct picture!

[Max Von]

Wrong image attached. Here we go...hopefully.

[moazam]

$21K for an '86 sounds pretty high. The fact that it has low miles could mean more money needed to replace basic stuff anyways which would have already been done on a higher mileage car.

I'd keep looking for either a 915 or G50 based car within a decent budget.

Practically any car you buy, you'll end up putting some money into, so if your starting point is already $21k, you're only going to go higher..

[Sonic dB]

Looking at the pics, and at that mileage....I think that $21K is at the upper range of its value...BUT it is not unreasonable. Moazam makes a great point above about the mileage vs. a higher mileage car.

Would I pay $21K for that car...no. But I would if it was a Cab. Would I offer $18K? Yes somewhere around there.

Comparing my 86 Cab (which are generally worth more) to this car...Id have to say keep shopping.

I purchased my 86 last April for only $17K. Now...keep in mind that the market has rebounded a bit since then...AND I got a Hell of a great deal which I looked long and hard for...at only 64,000 miles at the time.

But, Ive put in approximately $5K to upgrade and maintain the car in the first year. I do not expect to pay this every year from now on since the car is updated...but it is my daily driver.

Re: 915 vs G50. The 915 can be like any good woman: requires some patience and effort to smoothly groove with. However if its a good one, and he uses Swepco tranny fluid, these trannys are known to be good providers for a long time.

[Chris Lovell]

I agree that $21k is steep. But, like the others, not way out of line for a good, strong and leak free 911. And, although completely irrelevant to your decision, I really don't like the color. Per the tranny, I actually prefer the 915 in my '86. The G50 is tight and "modern" but the slop and play in the 915 is fun and easy to manage. Swepco, patience in shifting, and consistently low blood pressure makes the 915 just fine for me. IMHO.

[Max Von]

Thanks for the replies. I've tried to explain to my brother in law that all pre 1989 911's are at the very least $20K automobiles. You buy one for $15K and sink at least $5K more to make it OK. This one seems to be at the high end of the pre-G50 market threshold. But then again, low miles and very clean....

[Sonic dB]

Wow...a man with 2 86s. I personally like the 86s more than the 87-89s because of the 915 as well as little things like the bigger Porsche on the rear reflector.

[nostatic]

I've owned both G50 and 915 and imho the G50 is overrated *if* you compare it to a 915 that is in good shape. What I've found is that G50 cars tend to have a more consistent feel from car to car, and that feel is less mileage dependent. 915s however are all over the map, from snick-snick tight to "where the hell is the gear" loose.

$21K seems on the high side unless it is a *very* clean/sorted car. Having the clutch done is a plus, but I'd also worry about premature valve guide wear. Also check to see if the clutch was upgraded when replaced (release fork?). Given that there are a few things that don't work (and it needs tires), I do not think it is a $21K car. Have a PPI done and try and find the other little things that are wrong, and make an offer accordingly. If everything else is clean I might see this at about $18K plus or minus, but not breaking the $20K barrier.

[yelcab1]

Sorry, $21K is way high. Considering that it is close to its valve guide replacement interval.

$16-$17K is where that car is, $18K if you gotta have it.

[mwbaum]

Not all Carreras need valve guides...only some. My 85 has 83K miles and burns a quart of oil....every 4000 miles. No valve guide probs.

[dickster]

i paid the equivalent US$21,000 for my '86 here in the uk. while i have seen many priced below US$16,000 here the condition varies wildly. i looked at the lower end when i bought mine and many had rust problems etc.

i would suggest that if the condition is as good as you say and the colour etc is what you are after then go for it.

[Sonic dB]

Not all Carreras need valve guides...only some. My 85 has 83K miles and burns a quart of oil....every 4000 miles. No valve guide probs.

True. My 86 barely burns oil at all... maybe a quart every 2000 or so.

I laugh when I read about Carreras that have 150K miles on them and are starting to show valve guide wear.... as if this was a problem symptomatic to the Carrera. What do you expect at 150K?

[moazam]

Originally posted by Sonic dB
True. My 86 barely burns oil at all... maybe a quart every 2000 or so.

I laugh when I read about Carreras that have 150K miles on them and are starting to show valve guide wear.... as if this was a problem symptomatic to the Carrera. What do you expect at 150K?

I've got 178k miles and no valve guide wear.

[logician]

IMHO, '86 is the best year for a Carrera because they offer the best performance. The '86 Carreras had the stiffer suspension of the '87-89 vintage, but were lighter because of the 915 vs. G50 transmission. The earlier '84-85 Carreras came with softer torsion bars. Once you put a chip in the DME, all Carreras produce the same HP. Another thing to consider is that 915 gear boxes are a lot cheaper to rebuild than G50 gearboxes.

I have only owned 915 and 930 equiped Porsches, and I like the quirky older synchros. Once you learn to match revs and heal-toe, which you really should know, the 915 gear boxes shift really nicely.

-Juan

[stuartj]

I currently own an 86 with a rebuilt 915, and a 964. The gear boxes are different, but I wouldnt hesitate to buy a car with a 915-assuming it was in good order, but that holds for the G50 too.

When you are pressing on, the 915 is works beautifully. Yep they take some getting used to, but, hell, anyone can drive a G50.

I'd be more concerned about the the fact that the 85 911 made 231hp, and the 86 made 207hp. Quite different cars in that regard.

Edit: Those HP figures- I have no idea if thats true for USA cars. Here in AUS, we got unleaded fuel and cats for the first time in the 86 build 911. Engine compression is down, so is the HP figure. It crept up again in the 87-89 cars to 220hp or so.


stuart

[89911]

Tell him to drive a G50 and a 915 and then decide.

[Ray B]

I'm with Stuart on this one. I own both and don't have a favorite- I like 'em both. They are diffferent to be sure. I'd be sure to have a chat with the mech who performed the service and would have my mech check out the valve guides as others have mentioned. The price is on the high end, but if it's a nice car buy and enjoy it. Life is short.

[creaturecat]

looks like a beautiful car. i love my 915 - steep learning curve however very rewarding once mastered .really nice cars are getting hard to find - given a positive ppi i would be willing to pay a premium for this car.