Need your opinion (rebuild vs replace engine) - Page 2

azasadny · azasadny's Garage

alexander911,

It sounds like we're in the same position. I've just begun this whole adventure, but I'm leaning towards buying the 3.0L engine from the guy I know. I'd rather do a "drop and swap" than an entire rebuild. My 2.7L runs great, so I think I can sell it "as is" or part it out, not sure yet... Good luck!

KobaltBlau · 06-16-2004, 12:43 PM

IMHO: Pull the valve covers, and if you verify that there are problems, get the 3.0. otherwise, drive the 2.7 until there are problems (if ever).

PRE-H20 · PRE-H20's Garage

art,....

well sounds like your in good shape if yours is running perfectly.... mine isnt at the moment, sluggish a bit. i am not a mechanic AND i just relocated to southern cali so i am in uncorfortable waters at the moment..... my mechanic is 500 miles away in san francisco.

i am also dripping oil alot.... although i saw a great bumper sticker at a recent swap meet, "old porsches dont leak oil, they just mark their spots"

so it was nice to read someone else same year having the same rebuild/swap issues.... but i got quoted 5k to start and up to 7k,.... yikes.....

Alexander

aigel · aigel's Garage

One more datapoint: Rebuilding the 2.7 correctly (with the machinework to the case) is more expensive than rebuilding the 3.0. If you buy a used engine, make sure you get compression and leak down numbers and get to at least hear the engine if not drive a car with it in it. If it has good compression and performs well, it will serve you for quite a while. These engines generally wear out very gradually.

George

PRE-H20 · PRE-H20's Garage

george,

what are leakdown 3's? (sorry for the bonehead question as i am not a mechanic!)

toolman · toolman's Garage

Hi Art, I think it is sound advise to go with the 3.0 litre engine. I would check the head stud first to make sure that is your problem. You might only have an exhaust gasket or exhaust manifold leak.

aigel · aigel's Garage

alexander911:

Time to buy Wayne's engine rebuild book.

Leak down is a static compression test. You stick a hose into the spark plug hole when the piston is at top dead center and both valves are closed. You put pressure in there and then see how much / quickly it leaks out.

The leak down is a bit different from a dynamic compression test where you also stick a hose into the spark plug hole but then just see how many PSI the engine will produce by cranking it over.

Hope this helps. If not, do a search!

George

azasadny · azasadny's Garage

George,

Thanks for explaining what a "leak down" test is, I'll get one of those done on the 3.0L as well as listen to it run on the stand before buying it. I'll post the test results when I get them. Thanks again for the good advice!

rpiper · 06-17-2004, 09:25 AM

By all means, go with the 3.0

azasadny · azasadny's Garage

Bobby,
I like your quote from "Stripes", that always makes me laugh! They don't call me "Psycho" for nothing!!

fintstone · fintstone's Garage

I replaced the 150 hp 2.7 in my '74 with a 3.0 and am quite pleased. for just a few more thousand than it would cost to rebuild my 2.7...I got a great 3.0..totally rebuilt and installed in Costa Mesa, CA (one day down time) and with a 2 year, unlimited mileage warranty. The additional performance is great and the car starts and runs like a Toyota. If you do have a 3.0 rebuilt, make sure you know exactly what you want going in. I wanted hotter cams, etc and saved a lot of money building the engine I wanted the first time.

PRE-H20 · PRE-H20's Garage

im in costa mesa also, and have a 74 2.7, looking to eventually make that move,.....

how much did it cost you?

where did you go?

fintstone · fintstone's Garage

I bought mine from Henry at Supertec. He posts a lot on the engine rebuild thread. he really knows his stuff and he has a couple of great wrenches. He will make that 3.0 look like it was installed in your '74 at the factory. You can see the finished product (my car) at:
http://www.pelicanparts.com/gallery/fintstone/
He will pretty much build to suit your needs. He found the 3.0 core and had it rebuilt and ready to install when I arrived. Since I had him add a lot of performance parts, my price would probably not be a good indicator and you should call him or drop by. When he gives you an estimate...that is the price...none of the price creep that some shops do. Be warned...he will not halfway do it. He uses a lot of new parts and is not super cheap...but certainly reasonable considering the quality. I imagine that is why he stands by his work and offers such a good warranty. There are some prices and examples of his work on his website:
http://www.supertecperformance.com/

Ed Bighi · Ed Bighi's Garage

I am not an engine swap freak, unless you are talking 3.3 turbo. But I don't like 2.7s either. Go and get a 3.0. Put it in drive and the piss out of it. Pound it. It can take it. As for 3.2, I own one too. Motronic never felt to me like god's second coming. Feels no better than my 3.0. The day I feel a big difference in either of my cars, then I'll change my mind either way. You will be happy with the 3.0.

makaio · 06-19-2004, 08:50 AM

Sell that 2.7 while it's still worth some money!

fintstone · fintstone's Garage

Before you sell your 2.7, keep in mind that some engine builders will want/take the 2.7 as a trade. You certainly will not get top dollar that way, but there are definite advantages to driving the car to the shop one day with the 2.7 and driving away with the 3.0 installed the next. Especially if you want to have them swap over your exhaust, etc. Also, you can probably get the installation done for approximately the cost of shipping your engine to them and theirs to you. That means you will have an expert checking out the clutch, cooling system, etc and doing the final adjustments/tweaking.."while they are in there."

Jay Auskin · 06-19-2004, 11:10 AM

Art--it sounds like you have an answer in your head, so do it. A well rebuild 3.0L form someone you trust. Then go for it! It's a no-brainer in my mind, as you're not looking for the max performance, a 3.2L doesn't need to be considered.

You can then part-out your 2.7L for some extra money, or take your time, and work on re-building it to somethings with more power when you decide you need it.

Go with the 3.0L...it sounds like you're really comfortable with the seller, and the idea of the swap.

azasadny · azasadny's Garage

I took a look last Friday and sure enough, the barrel nut for cyl #3 was rolling around loose. I put it back on the head stud and torqued it to spec and it held and so did the others on that side. I didn't check the other side yet. I know it's inevitable that the stud will continue to pull and the barrel nut will loosen again... I'm hoping to postpone this until the fall as we are beginning our home improvement project now. Unfortunately, I need to wait until the fall (October-November) to get the "drop and swap" done. I checked the receipt for the rebuild the PO had done on my engine and in 1994 the bottom end rebuild was done with valves, rings, etc... But the cylinder head studs were not replaced, so I must still have the original studs on the block! They held for 30 years, which isn't too bad, but my '74 doesn't have thermal reactors and it does have the front-mounted, Carrera-style oil cooler, so that must have helped!

aigel · aigel's Garage

What are you talking about? Your engine is falling apart! Is your roof leaking? You have to get your priorities straight. The 911 first, then the house! It's all in the presentation to the better half. "Honey, if I don't fix the 911 now, it will blow up and that would be very unsafe".

What a bummer, that someone would do a top end and not redo the case.

George

vash · vash's Garage

i have met a bunch of guys who feel a rebuilt 2.7 is like a badge of honor. personally, i would go for the three liter. as i understand it. a 3.0 from a 78 or 79 is the easiest swap.

i ended up, going with the 3.0 too. but i had to buy the entire car around it.