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Hopelessly Addicted
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Central PA
Posts: 314
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Thank you for all the info, Gentlemen. Think I'll buy the pressure gauge and books on Bosch fuel injection. Which one is the best? Edit: [Maybe covers my 944, too?]
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'81 SC Targa '86 944 '49 Ford F-3 '13 Yamaha FZ-1 (Adrenaline Machine) 
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10-28-2005, 05:27 AM
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Somewhere in the Midwest
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: In the barn!
Posts: 12,499
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Wayne sells a tester:
http://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin/ksearch/PEL_search.cgi?command=show_part_page&please_wait=N&make=POR&model=911L§ion=TOLtol&page=5&bookmark=26&part_number=PEL-PP910450 As for a manual that covers CIS and DME...not on book is good enough for either in my opinion. I have a number of manuals that when put together would be adequate. As a start, I would recommend the Bentley manual. It's not perfect but it is good for CIS and other aspects of your 911 maintenance. Jim Williams his a great CIS primer...someone will come allong and post a link if I don't find it first...or you can search for his posts, and follow his link. There are also other online sites good for learning CIS, some even have good downloadable PDF's. One of these days, I'll write a book on CIS that pulls together all the available information....but that day will probably come when I retire...then there'll only be just a handfull of CIS 911's still running  
Last edited by MotoSook; 10-28-2005 at 06:38 AM.. |
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10-28-2005, 06:04 AM
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Designer King
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Toronto, ON Canada
Posts: 5,499
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Haha, don't be so sure, Souk.
I've been adjusting CIS cars since 1977. Look how many are still around today. With the care people on this BB lavish on these cars I wouldn't be surprised to see quite a few still around for quite a few years, as long as we can still get gas for them! With a trusty 3mm allen, an occasional check for vacuum leaks, and a pressure gauge (optional-I just got my first one this year), along w/ the valuable info on this board, these cars should run for a good long time. Just remember: spring/lean, fall/rich for those of us in northern climes. Usually no more than 1/8 turn is all it takes.
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Paul Yellow 77 Sunroof Coupe/cork interior; 3.2L SS '80 engine/10.3:1/No O2; Carrera Tensioners; 11 Blade Fan; Turbo tie rods; Bilstein B6; 28 tube Cooler; SSI, Dansk; MSD/Blaster; 16x7" Fuchs/205/50 Firestone Firehawk Indy 500s; PCA/UCR, MID9 Never leave well enough alone |
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10-28-2005, 06:24 AM
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Somewhere in the Midwest
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: In the barn!
Posts: 12,499
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Maybe so Paul....rather I hope so
 Not that I think CIS is the only induction system out there, nor the best, but I like simple things that work well...simple for you and me OK! Here is a collection of information that should be helpful: CIS Diagram:  Mixture Adjustment w/o an analyzer: CIS Idle Speed and Mixture Setting Without an Analyzer Jim Williams' CIS Primer: http://members.rennlist.com/jimwms/CIS/CIShome.html CIS cut-away: 
Last edited by MotoSook; 10-28-2005 at 08:04 AM.. |
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10-28-2005, 06:42 AM
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Registered
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Denver
Posts: 1,242
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Where did the CIS cutaway come from? I would like to get a copy large enough to read the print.
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1999 996 C4 Cabriolet 1997 BMW M3 (Hail) 1985 928 S (Sold) 1982 SC Targa (Sold) |
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10-28-2005, 07:46 AM
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Cigars and 911's -- Smile
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This Temperate Climate CIS thread should live on forever.
I know I'll read and probably post again in spring -- right here!
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[GruppeB # 978] 1978 911 SC ROW (Pure Euro, no DOT or EPA work done..) 1991 Toyota MR2 Turbo (3S-GTE 4Banger Rocket) 2001 Audi - A6 Quattro 4.2L-V8 (love the growl) 2014 Honda Odyssey for the soccer-team/accessories |
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10-28-2005, 07:48 AM
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Registered
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Novato, CA
Posts: 3,064
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Quote:
Although I agree with Souk; the CIS is not the best induction system out there by far, but I like simple dependable things that work. And Souk, that is a cool cutaway! Another vote for a larger version if you have one? ianc
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BMW 135i. Nice. Fast. But no 911... "I will tell you there is a big difference between driving money and driving blood, sweat and tears." - PorscheGuy79 |
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10-28-2005, 08:19 AM
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Somewhere in the Midwest
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: In the barn!
Posts: 12,499
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I did not create that picture, and I can't vouch for the text on it...(Edit: I should also add that the cut-away is not that of a Porsche 911 system, but it's close.)
It was posted in this thread (I don't know if Dr. Injection even posts here anymore. He never got back to me on the manual request )CIS metering unit. 
Last edited by MotoSook; 10-28-2005 at 08:52 AM.. |
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10-28-2005, 08:47 AM
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Registered
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 1,226
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How timely is this post. I got in my car this morning, temp 30 deg F
Turned it over . Bang! tried it again. It would start and die, start and die. I pulled the air cleaner off and pushed the control arm up. I do this when it runs rough. The pop-off valve was completely blown off. I started it and the tach pegged. Not good. Took the other car to work. I believe this is all cold weather related. What caused the engine to rev so high? Is there somethind else that would cause this? It's going to be 65 tomorrow. The SC loves that temp.
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Thanks, Mike When I was a kid, I didn't want a stupid pony, I wanted a PORSCHE. 1970 911T Coupe, 1979 911SC Targa Euro, 1971 Honda CT70 HK Trail 70 (the ultimate in two wheeled transportation) |
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10-28-2005, 09:00 AM
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Somewhere in the Midwest
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: In the barn!
Posts: 12,499
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You're bypassing the throttle (pop-off valve blow off right?), and there is enough fuel fed to the engine via the cold start sequence and your priming of the engine...so you essentially had an un-governed engine at that point....
...clean and prep as appropriate and reinstall the pop-off valve, richen the idle mixture a bit (1/8th turn to start with...). If that doesn't work...check for cracks in the airbox (cross your fingers). Good luck. |
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10-28-2005, 09:05 AM
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Registered
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 1,226
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Souk,
Did I "break" something? Where would the cracks be?
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Thanks, Mike When I was a kid, I didn't want a stupid pony, I wanted a PORSCHE. 1970 911T Coupe, 1979 911SC Targa Euro, 1971 Honda CT70 HK Trail 70 (the ultimate in two wheeled transportation) |
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10-28-2005, 09:18 AM
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Somewhere in the Midwest
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: In the barn!
Posts: 12,499
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Quote:
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10-28-2005, 09:27 AM
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Registered
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 1,226
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Busted something as in pistons or valves?
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Thanks, Mike When I was a kid, I didn't want a stupid pony, I wanted a PORSCHE. 1970 911T Coupe, 1979 911SC Targa Euro, 1971 Honda CT70 HK Trail 70 (the ultimate in two wheeled transportation) |
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10-28-2005, 11:27 AM
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Registered
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 1,226
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bump
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Thanks, Mike When I was a kid, I didn't want a stupid pony, I wanted a PORSCHE. 1970 911T Coupe, 1979 911SC Targa Euro, 1971 Honda CT70 HK Trail 70 (the ultimate in two wheeled transportation) |
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10-28-2005, 11:51 AM
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Registered
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Novato, CA
Posts: 3,064
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Don't worry Limble, you didn't damage anything majorly expensive. You will need to reinstall your popoff valve though,
ianc
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BMW 135i. Nice. Fast. But no 911... "I will tell you there is a big difference between driving money and driving blood, sweat and tears." - PorscheGuy79 |
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10-28-2005, 12:01 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,650
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I've got a question:
In the CIS diagram above there is a hose labeled 16 that attaches to part 54. On my '80 SC hose 16 is missing and the nipple on part 54 is exposed to free air. What does hose 16 and part 54 do? From the looks of the diagram something on my CIS system is missing and possibly causing a vaccum leak. -Scott |
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10-28-2005, 12:02 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,650
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Hmm....I think I answered my own question. According to the CIS primer that nipple is exposed to atmosphere on '78-'79 and '81-'83 models. Somewhat strange though since my car is an '80.
http://members.rennlist.com/jimwms/CIS/WUR_photo.html |
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10-28-2005, 12:07 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Novato, CA
Posts: 3,064
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Hi Kaefer,
17a (which hose 16 connects to) looks like an altitude compensating device to me. I would try to locate 17a and see if the hose is plugged or not. It may also be that the WUR (#54) has been replaced on your car and the original did not have it. ianc
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BMW 135i. Nice. Fast. But no 911... "I will tell you there is a big difference between driving money and driving blood, sweat and tears." - PorscheGuy79 |
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10-28-2005, 12:09 PM
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Unregistered
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: a wretched hive of scum and villainy
Posts: 55,652
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That's one of the things that make Porsches like a rubic's cube: they made small changes just about every year to the CIS.
The hose you are talking about it a vaccum line to the warm up regulator #54 (control pressure regulator is the correct name). On a 1980 US SC you don't have one, I don't either. On some earlier years they had one, and on some later years they had one, but on a 1980 they didn't. Thje decel valve (#7) is different also. |
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10-28-2005, 12:13 PM
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Registered
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 12,668
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I saw this a while back and was saving it for a thread like this:
The world is divided into three types of CIS Owners, which one is you? 1) The guys with working CIS systems out driving their cars so they won't reply. 2) The guys that tinker with their CIS systems and have them royally screwed up and keep you running in circles with suggestions. 3) The guys that have spent a fortune on Webers, PMOs, EFI etc will tell you they're great to justify their expenditure to themselves. Your choice. 
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Harry 1970 VW Sunroof Bus - "The Magic Bus" 1971 Jaguar XKE 2+2 V12 Coupe - {insert name here} 1973.5 911T Targa - "Smokey" 2020 MB E350 4Matic |
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10-28-2005, 04:07 PM
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1978 Porsche 911SC 3.0
