930 Help required

[Walko]

I have been looking at a 83 930.

The car has genuine 35000km/s appr 20K miles full history.

I had a PPI done by my mechanic
the following issues were raised as worsdt case scenario
broken head studs
motor wont start when hot
very strong fuel smell when you back off the throttle (I think it is running rich)
Incorrect gearbox fitted ie 915 5 speed.

Now a second mechanic has also looked at it and reckons the head studs are loose.

My question is in all probability would teh head studs work loose or would they break. if they are broken how many hours would it take a machanic to replace repair??

Should I be able to put the original type g/box back in without any issues.


THanks in advance.


Michael
71 911E
930 Hopefully on it way

[Rot 911]

Now how can one mechanic conclude broken head studs and the other saying they are just loose? If they are broken you can easily see that when you take off the valve covers. Did the mechanic that said they were loose try to tighten one up to make sure the head stud wasn't pulled?

[RickM]

Originally posted by Walko

Should I be able to put the original type g/box back in without any issues.

Michael,

I depends on what was done to get the 915 in there. Your mechanic should be able to answer easily.

[beepbeep]

Originally posted by Walko
I have been looking at a 83 930.

The car has genuine 35000km/s appr 20K miles full history.

I had a PPI done by my mechanic
the following issues were raised as worsdt case scenario
broken head studs
motor wont start when hot
very strong fuel smell when you back off the throttle (I think it is running rich)
Incorrect gearbox fitted ie 915 5 speed.

Now a second mechanic has also looked at it and reckons the head studs are loose.

My question is in all probability would teh head studs work loose or would they break. if they are broken how many hours would it take a machanic to replace repair??

Should I be able to put the original type g/box back in without any issues.


THanks in advance.


Michael
71 911E
930 Hopefully on it way

something stinks here.

How could spinky 915 tranny find it's way into otherwise "mint" 930 with only 35000km? Sounds fishy....who would go trough all that swap-job just to install inferior tranny (that won't handle the torque)...all that on car with such small mileage?

Fuel on deccel might be stuck WUR or something...it shouldn't be too hard to fix.

Loose studs? Mechanic went all the way checking all studs but never bothered to tighten them to specs??? If he did then stud would either stop "being loose" or end up in his palm...and you would know the answer imediately.

[Walko]

Well heres the funny part neither mechanic took the valve covers off. THey both took the car for a test drive and both siad they could hear teh compression leaking on boost.

THe mech who siad it has broken head studs has also quoted me approx 40 to 50 hours to do the head studs.

I suppose the easiest way is to pull the valve covers. The dealer is not going to allow this to happen.

The one thing I did notic though was the dealer only put in 91 octane fuel when we did the test drive could low octane fuel sound like compression leaking on boost.

Michael

[beepbeep]

Originally posted by Walko
Well heres the funny part neither mechanic took the valve covers off. THey both took the car for a test drive and both siad they could hear teh compression leaking on boost.

Michael

I test-drove my old 930 before buying and heard "compression leaking", made sure that seller knew what it means and how much it costs to be fixed, bought the car and then changed exhaust gaskets (well, studs were loose, but only on exchanger flange), promptly fixing "the leak".

But of course, your example might be different story. It might have broken studs but i wouldn't trust a mechanic who knows it "by ear"...other solution is that you assume it's butchered car with broken studs and pay accordingly.

I wouldn't touch it otherwise...

Checked VIN and the rest to be sure it's not SC with widebody kit and 930 engine?

[klaucke]

If the dealer won't let you pull the valve covers to inspect the actual condition of the engine, walk away. I agree with Beep that it sounds fishy. Depending on how the head studs broke (or apparently may not have) they could be relatively easy or extremely difficult to replace. If the car is at or near normal market value, it doesn't seem worth the risk.

Just in case, you're sure this is a true 930 and not a turbo SC, right? It would explain the 915 and an aftermarket turbo could pull/break some studs.

[Walko]

I rang my friend at Porsche Cars Australia and they did a full check on the Vin and engine number.

The car was delivered on the 11th April 1983 in germany.

It was a genuine 930 with some additional options.

The asking price was at market however I have talked them down some 15K in dollars.

Ity also comes with a three year warranty which I am currently reviewing to see if it will cover the faults. IF so then i can buy the car at a dicount and have someone else pay to rectify the faults.

Michael

[tiorio]

Man, that 915 swap bugs the heck out of me. The 930 4-speed is damn near bulletproof. Why then was it pulled?

[lendaddy]

There is the chance that it is a RUF 5 speed conversion.??? I mean on such a low mileage car............

[beepbeep]

Originally posted by lendaddy
There is the chance that it is a RUF 5 speed conversion.??? I mean on such a low mileage car............

Well that's easy to check. Take a look at side plate, if there is an intermediate concetrical "rib" on the plate and you manage to switch to 5:th then it is.

Looks like this:

[Walko]

it is not a Ruf 5 speed

Michael

[cowtown]

The 930s used 24 Dilivar head studs. These are prone to breakage. If one or more are broken, you should have them all updated to the latest steel versions. I agree that you should walk away if they won't let you pull the covers off to look at the studs. It is not an intrusive process.

The 915 is also mysterious. It's shorter than the '83 930 gearbox, so either the engine was moved forward or something else was done to compensate.

It's also so easy to mess with the odometers on these cars....

[Dynamik]

I experienced the warm starting issue on an 81 turbo. Don’t ask for the logic with what I am about to tell you. The quick fix (case-by-case) is to go into the fuse and relay box under the front hood and disconnect the square fuel pump relay. Crank the car for a second or two and then plug the fuel pump relay back in. Now crank the car and it should start right up. Many experts might trace this problem down to a bad warm up regulator but that was not the problem with this particular turbo. The problem was with the fuel distributor. This can be corrected by realigning the fuel distributor or replacing it with a new one. That cleared the problem on this particular turbo. As for the head studs… that requires the engine to be pulled and 12 new bottom head studs. The material that Porsche chose for the head studs (one with a similar thermal expansion coefficient as the engine case) was also brittle. Over time, especially in colder climates, they tend to fail. The replacement studs do not have this issue. As mentioned, this problem can be identified by taking off the valve cover gaskets and looking for half of the stud to fall out of the guide hole. Part of every PPI should include looking at the oil drain plug magnet and the oil pump mesh filter. Sometimes pieces of the head stud can be seen there. Good luck!

[john walker's workshop]

how can a head stud get into the engine and be found in the sump screen?? turbos have all 24 dilivar studs, not just the bottom row like NA cars.

[Walko]

Dynamink made a valid point about the magnet however i would have thoght the studs would just break in half not into little splinters.

i have been told they modified the 915 box mount to allow the motor to line up with all the holes. Apparently all I have to do is cahnge some plate which bolts in when I purchase a 930 box.

I am aware teh speedos can be tampered with very easily however the car is so immaculate and does not appear to have ever had any resprays or touch ups.

After owing some thirty plus cars five of which were P cars I have never seen paint work this immaculate except on brand new cars.

If the car had done big miles then the under guards etc would show the stone chips..

Thanks for all your help.

Michael

[RarlyL8]

I have seen a few passages in 930 books about 915 swaps. They were not unpopular back in the early 80's with stock US 930s having low power output and bad turbo lag. If memory serves there are a few pix in BA's book. Don't know about Australia.

All in all sounds fishy.

[Walko]

Guys thank you for all your assistance.

in view of the feed back and further enquiries I have decided to not go ahead with that 930.

But don't fret I have just bought a 82 to get me through the christmas period. I will continue to search for a genuine 930 down here in Australia.

Regards

Michael

[Jason Cullen]

Walko,

I have a 82 930 with a 915 upgrade - World of difference! You hit your powerband in a fraction of the time of the original 4-speed - Also easier driving around town. The performance of my 930 is amazing with the 5-speed.

Jason

[TurboBert]

Run away from it. It isn't worth any amount of the risk you describe.