'71 911S Value

[BlueSideUp]

My brother has owned this car for about a year. I am thinking about buying it from him and am looking for your help on establishing a value.

Here are the specifics

1971 911S Targa



112,000 miles

Numbers match

Later model Recaro Sport seats recently recovered



Rear seats and side panels recovered

Targa headliner recovered

Door pockets not installed at this time



Broken tape deck replaced with a MP3/CD player

Tach rebuilt and refaced by Palo Alto Speedo

New carpet kit installed with composite floorboards

The engine is very strong but my brother couldn't remember the numbers from a recent compression test. The best he could recall was something around 150psi on all cylinders. The car has been converted to Weber carbs so the MFI is gone. The engine and transmission were recently removed due to an oil leak at the flywheel end of the engine.



New oil return tubes

Cleaned and leak checked engine mounted oil cooler

Turbo valve covers

New SSI heat exchangers

New Dansk Sport Mufflers

Carrera tensioners

New coil, cap and rotor

Carrera oil cooler recently installed

Replaced 1st gear syncro

Swepco lube

New shift coupler

New engine sound pad

New clutch, throwout bearing, resurfaced flywheel

Recent plugs and valve adjustment

The wheels are 6s & 7s

Tires are Dunlop W10s

Obviously this car is far from original but it is a serious blast to drive. The overall condition of the car is very good.

The car was repainted five years ago. The glass was all taken out and all the rubber seals were replaced. I would say the paint job is a 6 or 7 out of 10. It's not chipped or rusty but has some orange peel. Perhaps a wet sanding would improve the results.

So I'm looking for an honest valuation from fellow Pelicans. This car is a real S in great condition that I wouldn't be afraid to drive. Probably the only thing I'd do to the car right away would be to retrofit some inertial seatbelts.

[c911s]

Excellence listed 2005 values for 71 S targa as: poor - 14508, good - 16496, excellent - 22083. You will have to decide where the car fits, but it's likely at the upper end.

[ficke]

I would also check out www.early911Sregistry.org

[RetroSC]

Looks like the tach was refaced incorrectly. Might be the pic, but an S should have the redline at 7200.

Sooo.. that detracts the value about $100 if that helps any

Bruce's stuff still seems low to me. Excellent S's are almost always 30K+. A "driver" condition 67 just went for 30K on Ebay last week... It needed a lot to be anywhere near excellent and was still way over Bruce's prices.

Really hard to tell without seeing it, but I can say it's not a 30K car, and it's not a 10K car. So SURVEY SAY'S!!! 18K

Edit,
Man, I need to put the beer down tonight.

[BlueSideUp]

Sorry that was an old pic from last year before the interior work. It was also obviously before he had the tach done.

Sharp eyes for tossing back some brews!

[RetroSC]

I'll admit, I was pretty impressed with myself for spotting that. Guess I'll revise my estimate. $18,100!

And another one down... time for bed

[Bobboloo]

Looks like a very nice car. Condition and originality are everything on determining value on these early S's . Condition looks very good here. Originality is not to far off. If the motor number matches the chassis that's a big plus.

Items that I can see are unoriginal are the tach, carbs, seats, window trim, and steering wheel. If these were all original and the car was mechanically sound then you'd have a $30k car. As it is I'd say $18k is a pretty good guess.

[donstevens]

Nice looking car. My first guess would be $20,000. The car would have to have the MFI to get the top numbers so the $18,000. that other are saying is probably best.


Don

[silverc4s]

You are buying a car that is currently appreciating at a pretty high rate. I don't know how close you & brother are, but be careful in this arrangement that one or the other of you does not come to feel shafted a few years down the road, should this car become worth serious money.
Never easy to mix money & good relationships...;-)

PS: I don't know what your brother has invested in it, but the car is easily worth $20K right now, on the market, just as it sits.

[fryardds]

Yep, I agree with Bobby and Don. I think the low $20K range. Does it have an Aluminum engine lid and license plate panel? Those would have come on the car originally also.

[Zeke]

Originally posted by fryardds
Yep, I agree with Bobby and Don. I think the low $20K range. Does it have an Aluminum engine lid and license plate panel? Those would have come on the car originally also.

Good catch.

The items listed as not original are easily replaced except for the seats and the lid. They don't come up too often.

I would say you and your brother should start at nearly top dollar and subtract for each thing needed to bring the car back to stone original. The 3 biggest items on that list will be the MFI, lid and the seats. It will take some research to get current prices on all the items, but I can tell you the seats will be in the neighborhood of $3500 and the MFI in the neighborhood of $2000. Figure a grand for the lid.

There could be some significant labor added for changing all the things, but that is really a pretty subjective discussion. Limiting the deductions to the hard cost of needed original items should set a benchmark for the car's value that neither you or your brother will contest "down the road."

Sounds like you're going to end up around 20K as people have already suggested. Pretty savy group, eh?

Edit: BTW, If you put this up over on the Early S board (if you haven't already), there are a scant few who don't bother to cross over to Pelican much. They may have some additional perspective. And show these threads to your brother.

[BlueSideUp]

Do you guys mean the entire engine lid should be made out of aluminum or just the grill?

When he bought the car it had black P O R S C H E letters on the lid but he has since installed the gold letters as it was originally. The grill is aluminum but I'm not sure about the lid itself.

My brother has been a member of Pelican since buying the car, I can't remember his sig but I do know he was on here asking wiring questions a year ago or so.

Prior to the SSIs and Dansk sport muffler the car had a muffler with four pipes straight out on either side of the license plate. Is this a desirable exhaust on the aftermarket? I personally prefer the Dansk because exhaust doesn't get sucked into the fan but the sound of the other muffler was nice.

Thank you so much for the help, I wish I had more photos but the stuff I have is pretty old. My brother's laptop crashed recently with his newer photos on it.

[BlueSideUp]

Oh and is the little round mirror on the driver's side OEM? It never has had a passenger side mirror.

[fryardds]

The entire engine lid (not just the grille) and license plate panel should be Aluminum. Yes the round driver's side mirror is correct. Most cars didn't have a passenger side mirror unless it was ordered that way.

[kenikh]

Originally posted by c911s
Excellence listed 2005 values for 71 S targa as: poor - 14508, good - 16496, excellent - 22083. You will have to decide where the car fits, but it's likely at the upper end.

Bruce's values are invariably low on early esses. I would move the grades one notch: excellent prices to average, etc. These cars in excellent condition sell for stupid money.

(edit) that said, $18K for the car seems fair.

[Scott Clarke]

Add wheels to the list on non-original items. The back look like 7", so the fenders have likely been rolled. The finish is also incorrect. Looks like a nice car.

[SandyI]

Bottom line, the 2.2 S is a very valuable 911. If this was an excellent, original coupe, you'd be asking for $45K and probably fielding multiple offers. I'd start your car at $24,000 and see if you get any nibbles. Good luck.

[kenikh]

Originally posted by SandyI
Bottom line, the 2.2 S is a very valuable 911. If this was an excellent, original coupe, you'd be asking for $45K and probably fielding multiple offers. I'd start your car at $24,000 and see if you get any nibbles. Good luck.

To be clear, ANY 'S' is very valuable. Some would say the 2.2 was the best car: large jugs w/ 66mm crank as well as the aluminum body parts. I prefer my 2.0L ESS, though.

[SandyI]

Originally posted by kenikh
To be clear, ANY 'S' is very valuable.

Up to 1973.
The '74-'77 911S would be a very different story.

[boston95]

Is the engine lid aluminum on the S only?