More Power!

[wanabe911 owner]

Hello all, hope all is well. Well it seems like we are waiting for another hurricane here in S florida! (This Sucks) I'm seriously considering moving to the desert! Anyway, I want more zing out of my 86 3.2 911. Should I start with exhaust and cams and such, or just bite the bullet and do a Turbo or SC conversion? If I go the boost route, would my recently rebuilt 915 take it? Please help!

[KobaltBlau]

boost is cheaper per horsepower but a big investment. if you don't have emissions laws the normal upgrades would be SSI heat exhangers, dual in muffler, 964 cams, steve wong chip. there should be some posts on this board of dyno charts for a similar engine.

How do you like the elise?

[DW SD]

Shed your car's weight. 12 lbs to 15lbs = 1 HP, more or less at your car's weight. A few hundred lbs = 20 to 30HP. The more you lose, the greater the increase in HP / weight.

Doug

[wanabe911 owner]

KobaltBlau: Thanks for the response, the Elise is great! Light weight, great handling, nimble! Not very practical, and makes my a$$ numb from the seats!

[wanabe911 owner]

DW SD : Without removing the A/C, what else can I do to shed weight, glass bumpers, fenders, etc?

[wanabe911 owner]

KobaltBlau: If I went the N/A route, and did not want heat, which header would you recommend

[stlrj]

Should I start with exhaust and cams and such

How about a tune up?

And while your at it you might do a search on why our 3.2's feel so slow.

[DW SD]

Originally posted by wanabe911 owner
DW SD : Without removing the A/C, what else can I do to shed weight, glass bumpers, fenders, etc?

You'd be amazed. My early widebody weighed about 2200lbs (less actually) with 5 gallons of gas. Bumpers are FG, hood and ducktail. Fenders are steel. The late Carreras weigh anywhere between 2750 to 3000 lbs with the same amount of gas, I think.

You mentioned a number of items, which help. Interiors weigh a lot, as does insulation (under carpet and rear seats), a pair of factory seats is ~ 100lbs where some FG buckets are 30lbs. Center console, etc. Rear seats have some weight, too.

Lightweight battery reduces weight and if moved to closer to the center of the car reduces polar moment of inertia (good for responsiveness).

Check out this link written by some of our fanatical 911 brethren: http://www.rennlight.com/light/index.html

Doug

[DG624]

Doug, the lightweight aarticle didn't mention AC. I am guessing that the AC would add 60lbs total. This is good reference...I would like to delete the sunroof and AC but don't want to upset the F/R balance.

[GaryR]

Chevy Small block....

[wanabe911 owner]

stlrj: Did a tune up already, and I never said my car feels slow, I would however like to modify it for more power.

In relation to my Elise, and my EVO yes my 3.2 feels and is slow, but I did not buy my 3.2 for the speed, I purchased it because I always wanted a Porsche, and I enjoy driving it. I however can never leave well enough alone! The reason I am asking for advice is, I want the benefit of the experience of this board... You may not rmember but you were very helpfull when I first got my car a year ago and had the hesitation problem.

[DW SD]

Originally posted by DG624
Doug, the lightweight article didn't mention AC. I am guessing that the AC would add 60lbs total. This is good reference...I would like to delete the sunroof and AC but don't want to upset the F/R balance.

I think A/C is good for 60 to 100lbs total, but don't know that first-hand. My car never had A/C. As for f/r balance, removing weight from the furthest point in the rear of the car is very beneficial to handling and polar moment of inertia. The compressor is left off of race and track cars IS for many reasons! Also the rear bumpers are very heavy, as are the bumper shocks. All of those items are there for a reason, but not to optimize F/R balance.

Find a car to ride in that has been modified by minimizing weight at the ends of the vehicle, as well as stripped down in general and you will notice a massive difference.

Doug

[dean]

I also felt my SC was slow. So being that I love boost I put a turbo motor in my car. Holy ***** batman it ain't slow no mo. So my advice is to either turbo your car or sell it and buy a 930. The 930 route would be cheaper in the long run I think. And no I don't think the 915 will handle the boost for long.

Dean

[stlrj]

From a cost per ponie perspective, how can you beat a turbo?

[drsimonwong]

Straight line speed.....turbo. But you're better off starting with a 930.

Cornering speed.....suspension and weight reduction.

A little of both for a lot of money......engine work.

Standard route for most guys appears to follow:

Chip (Steve Wong's as good as it gets) and SSI's and muffler.
Often a rebuild can bring a tired car up to specs. Some cars are under by a long way.

Then prepare to access your Swiss bank account.....

Engine management such as Motec in conjuction with above then brings you 260-270 bhp.
964 M64 cams are nice, but if you change to high compression race pistons you can go S cams. Very nice.
Six independent throttle bodies on top again and 300-320bhp.
But by here you have spend sooooo much money it'll make your eyes water.

Capacity increase is another way. 3.4 or 3.5 plus cams and SSI's can net reasonable gains.

Then you look at engine swaps with later model 3.6's which will buy you best bang for bucks but less so than a 930

Much simpler route will be lightening the car.
AC's weight 60lbs
Seats swaps can net 40lbs
Removing the sound insulation under the carpet is good for 40lbs.
Your bumpers and engine lid and bonnet and doors and sunroof can all go fibreglass.

Another path ca be swapping to a close ratio gear set. That will feel like 30+ bhp. 15 inch wheels can give a similar feel too(lesser degree).

Suspension is the best for dropping 3-4 sec off any track course for reasonable money.

Change all the rubber. Elephant racing or Wevo.
Go Bilstein or Konis for dampers
Up the torsion sizes.
Sways
Monoballs.
Strut brace.
Get a good raceshop to align it.

Actually if you've gone this far, get the body on a jig to true it up while your at it.

Very obsessive and expensive world you've entered!

I'm being silly to some degree here, but equally not out of context as if you search this board you'll find there isn't anything I've listed that someone hasn't done :-)

Oh actually the cheapest speed gain is driver ed.

Simon

Kinda depends on what extremes you will go to.

[tsuter]

The 915 will handle 300HP as long as you own the car. The wannabes are stuck with 200 with their SC 3.0s ... after they put in their SSIs and and cams and free flows. An 86 3.2??? Pump it up....an easy 300.
Muhahahaha!

[randywebb]

fanatical?

We're all just regular guys, reasonable people... moderates.


You just have to decide what you can live without - and throw it away.
The next step is to decide how many pennies you want ot spend on light wt. parts - e.g. my car has heavier brakes but I lightened the rear with a different trans., FG F&R bumpers, and FG engine lid, lightwt. starter, and some other items.

But I kept the sunroof...

[stlrj]

We're all just regular guys, reasonable people

But this board has highest proportion of those infected with the obsessive compusive bug that you will ever see in one place.

Have to admit my obsession is performance too but with a corresponding increase in efficiency which can be a bit of a challenge without the backing of a Swiss acct.

[charlesbahn]

yup- TURBO, TURBO, TURBO. Ain't nothing like it.

[jtratza]

If you go with 964 grid cams go to John Dougherty in California. I did on this summers rebuild and was very happy with his service and the cams result. Engine just keeps piling on the power as it reaches redline. I should have time this week to get dyno results which I'll post. Cost was about $300 plus shipping and the not minor cost of the rebuild.