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-   -   CIS (82 SC) Cold Start (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/249978-cis-82-sc-cold-start.html)

ruf-porsche 11-13-2005 07:26 PM

Re: Update
 
Quote:

Originally posted by twopoorsche
Pulled a plug. I am gettng visible spark. Plug was dry when I pulled it, and the engine had been turned over for 30 seconds or so before pulling the plug.

Reinserted plug, and used a liberal amount of starting fluid. White smoke from tailpipe, but NO indication of starting.

Now that you pulled the plug and verified a spark, pull an injector and verify if you have gas.

twopoorsche 11-16-2005 05:17 PM

Another Update
 
I was advised against pulling an injector in an older car.

I took a line off of the fuel accumulator (left side, near the firewall of the engine compartment). Only a few drops of gasoline present. Tried to start the car, and no gasoline was transported though the line or the accumulator.

Is it safe to say that I need a fuel pump, despite the fact that I can hear the fuel pump running?

Gunter 11-17-2005 05:43 AM

twopoorsche:
You keep asking for advise and when it is given, you ignore it.
Loren, and others have given you advise on how to troubleshoot; why don't you follow those steps?
You are going all over the place without really knowing what you're doing.
The accumulator on an '82 has 2 connections on top, and 1 connection on the bottom. The top is: One coming from the pump; one going to the filter. The bottom is a return/dump back to the tank.
What line on the accumulator did you disconnect?
DO NOT leave the lines open when trying to start.
If you get around to test for fuel supply as suggested, keep an extinguisher handy.
Your advisor on not to pull an injector in an older car doesn't know what he is talking about. Since you don't follow the advise given here, why don't you ask this "Expert" to diagnose your problems?
I suggest that you read through all the answers given here. We cannot help you if you don't want to accept help from this board; please, let's not go around in circles. Read the replies again.
Good luck.

twopoorsche 11-17-2005 10:03 AM

Expert
 
The expert is (according to the service manager of the dealership) the best CIS technician at one of the largest Porsche dealerships in the country. He stated, very logically, that if you pull injectors on an older car, that the seals etc may be cracked due to age, and that it can be a hassle to get them to reseat without replacing the seals, etc., and that it is not a risk worth taking just to see if there is fuel getting to the system. He therefore suggested pulling the accumulator line that I pulled, which does not show any signs of fuel flow.

But I guess he doesn't know what he is talking about.

I would get him to look at the problem, but he is 300 miles away. I can't find a local technician who is trustworthy and won't take a month to fix what is probably a simple problem.

To answer your question, I pulled one of the top lines off of the accumulator-the one closest to the engine.

While I appreciate your reply, it does not answer my question, which is, what are the odds I have a fuel pump problem?

ianc 11-17-2005 10:15 AM

If the seals on the injectors are that cracked and old, you need to replace them anyway. Instead of giving direct suggestions, I'll just let you handle it. You suspect that you're not getting fuel. Great; start at the pump (or however you want to do it) and verify that you're getting fuel at each component in the line. If you're not, you know what to do,

ianc

vash 11-17-2005 10:15 AM

i think you need to pull an injector. logical way is to start at the point furthest downstream and work BACK from there. in addition, i have pulled a sparkplug before and seen spark only to find out later that the spark was not sufficient. i now use one of those dummy plugs with a ground clamp.

you have gotten some great advice here. i would make a list and follow some.

ruf-porsche 11-17-2005 12:36 PM

If you can't afford to replace the o-ring on the fuel injector, it's time to sell the car.

Our host has the o-ring for a $1.00 each.

Injector O-Ring, (6 X 5mm) 911 (1974-83)
Brand: Bruss [Photo] [Photo]

999-701-423-40-M16 $1.00

cantdrv55 11-17-2005 02:47 PM

Man, I'm dying to know what's causing the problem. Replace the pump and ck valve already. If that's not it, well then you'll have your first spare parts.

twopoorsche 11-17-2005 04:40 PM

I've learned a lot from this thread. Not necessarily about how to diagose and fix the problem with my SC, but I have learned a lot.

In particular, I have learned about filters: Filiter the advice that you are given on the internet.

I'll make a final post after I solve this problem

cantdrv55 11-17-2005 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by twopoorsche
In particular, I have learned about filters: Filiter the advice that you are given on the internet.


good point

ianc 11-17-2005 10:49 PM

Quote:

In particular, I have learned about filters: Filiter the advice that you are given on the internet
Hmmm... Filtered our advice and your engine's still not running yet. Fancy that...

ianc

twopoorsche 11-27-2005 12:44 PM

Got the car started
 
I got the car started.

I jacked up the front, put it on jack stands. Pulled the plate off that covers the fuel pump. Inspected the fuel pump and lines. Did not see any obvious problems.

Even though I previously verified that I could hear the fuel pump running, I thought I'd listen again with the cover plate removed. I lifted the pressure plate in the air box. The entire CIS system sounded different that it had before. I guessed that the system was now getting fuel, and that it was not getting fuel before, as I originally suspected.


Sure enough, the car started (it wasn't that easy--the starter hung up, and I had to get it unstuck, but anyway...)

What was the problem? I am not sure. I am guessing that I have trash in the fuel tank (it's a 24 year old car) and that the trash settled to the bottom of the tank between the last time that that I drove the car and a week later when I tried to start it. The trash was obstructing the fuel pickup. When I jacked the car up, the trash moved out of the way, and the car started.

That's my best guess. Any other theories?

Thanks for all who offered advice in this thread.

ruf-porsche 11-27-2005 08:06 PM

Do a search for SOUK, CIS problems and fuel tank.


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