What to do about rust?

[Tom '74 911]

Hi -
I have a smallish rust bubble below the P-Side headlight. What is the best way to deal w/it? My car does see rain occasionally and I don't want to be scared to get it wet. Two photos - one close up and another a little further away for size reference.

Has any one used this product? Por Patch?

http://www.por15.com/product.asp?productid=8

I know Por-15 get mentioned a lot here and was wondering about the thicker stuff for filling after grinding?

Thanks,
Tom

[Matt_C]

I think that’s going to need more than a "fill" for that bubble. If you were to take a wire wheel to that spot I bet you'd find that it goes all the way through. Probably need to patch it the old fashioned way.

[redcoupe86]

I'll give you my advise, but it is by far not the most experienced, so take it with a grain of salt.

I am kinda going through this right now.

It started off as a few bits of surface rust. Mind you, you will have to assertain weather its surface rust or not. By the look it, the rust is coming through the back of the bumper and that is not good. If it is surface rust, and the only way to tell is feel behind the metal then its going to be problematic for a couple of reasons. First, you have to take the bumper off to get access behind the fender. Second, there is an under coating behind the panel, so to really tell you will eventually have to take the quarter panel off and remove some unercoateing. Once off you'll have a good look at it. You will have to take the bumper off anyway b/c the rust looks like its going under the lip of the fender. That lip turns under and meets that black bumper strip. Water collects there and boom, you have rust. All said and done, depending on what you want to do and your budget you will have to either have the rust cut out, or buy and new qarter panel. Others can say better here. As for POR 15, I'm not sure what its specifc properities of workability are.

I was lucky, it was just surface rust, but Im ending up (im in the middle of it right now) painting my lower valence, bumper, the little pieces just behind the front bellows and the quarter panel.

Hope this info shed some light.

[HarryD]

Tom,

POR 15 is not a filler but a coating to prevent an area from re-rusting once you neutralize the rust (think naval jelly or similar product).

[Tom '74 911]

Originally posted by HarryD
Tom,

POR 15 is not a filler but a coating to prevent an area from re-rusting once you neutralize the rust (think naval jelly or similar product).

Harry - The link I posted is actually to a product called POR PATCH, which is a thicker version of POR 15 - "for filling seams or holes". I was wondering if cleaning up the rust w/a wire wheel and then filling it w/the POR PATCH might fill it and seal it up well enough, and still be paintable. Has anyone tried this product? This is assuming that the fender isn't rusted thru of course.
Tom

[Tom '74 911]

Originally posted by Matt_C
I think that’s going to need more than a "fill" for that bubble. If you were to take a wire wheel to that spot I bet you'd find that it goes all the way through. Probably need to patch it the old fashioned way.

Matt - I'm assuming you mean cutting the rust out and welding a piece in to fill the hole? Sorry for my ignorance!
Thanks, Tom

[svandamme]

only way to asses, is to bite the bullet, and clean it up with a wire wheel.... once you know how far or how deep the rust is... then you can decide on what tactics to apply ...

[Tom '74 911]

Originally posted by svandamme
only way to asses, is to bite the bullet, and clean it up with a wire wheel.... once you know how far or how deep the rust is... then you can decide on what tactics to apply ...

Thanks Stijn - I'm going to be snow bound any day now and I am just trying to get my winter project list together. Although I've barely finished my fall project list! I guess the wire wheel will come out soon and I'll know what I'm dealing with.
Thanks,
Tom

[svandamme]

the trickiest part will probably be matching the paint, red can be a PITA in that respect... i'm sure the metal part won't be that bad... i've seen first hand how fast a good welder/body guy can fix rust holes when they did mine... had it cleaned up, dropped off the chassis, next day went with some more panels, and he'de allready done 90% of the welds... and i'm talking underside, wheel well, lot's of bends and nooks and cranny's , all taken care off, including new water drains... , that was both wheel wells, and the floor pan edges... in less then a day...

[Matt_C]

Originally posted by Tom '74 911
Matt - I'm assuming you mean cutting the rust out and welding a piece in to fill the hole? Sorry for my ignorance!
Thanks, Tom

Tom, yes that's what I was referring to.

Not trying to be a downer, but I had some bubbles on my car like that and ended up with pin holes all the way through. Also, there’s probably more that you haven’t found under the fenders, fender wings/supports, and where the fender meets the body. Again not trying to be a downer, but these cars are notorious for rust. Do a search for rust and you’ll find lots of good info.

Good luck with the wire wheel…..hopefully it’s not that bad.

[SC Schrauber]

What I would do if not replacing the fender:

grind, fertan (http://www.fertan.de/fertan.com/en/), possibly fiber, paint

Frank

[Tom '74 911]

Matt - Thanks for clarifying. Yes, I'm a little nervous about digging in too deep and finding much more than I bargined for and want to deal with. Thus I'm a little scared to take the fender off for fear of what is lurking underneath. I think I'll start small and just remove the headlight and fender for starters to get at the area.

Frank - Thanks for the link - that product Fertan looks interesting. Will fiberglass stick directly to the metal fender? I know I've read quite a bit about fender flares added by glassing instead of welding, so it must work. I do have quite a bit of glassing experience building windsurfers and boats so this sounds appealing as I could do it myself. Are there any long term bonding/cracking issues between the metal and fiberglass?

Thanks,
Tom

[RickM]

Originally posted by Tom '74 911
Yes, I'm a little nervous about digging in too deep and finding much more than I bargined for and want to deal with. Thus I'm a little scared to take the fender off for fear of what is lurking underneath. I think I'll start small and just remove the headlight and fender for starters to get at the area.

Get it all now or it'll get you. I'd bite the bullet and cut that cancer out completely. Perfect winter project.

[svandamme]

Tom,

when i bought my Targa, without ppi ( duh ) , i went to the dealer, to get it some maintenance

the dealere had a hard time keeping from laughing when he showed my car on the bridge.... leaky tank, rustholes in the wheel wells, floor pan , he kept poking in my precious 911 , commenting about targa's and crap they all sag and it's no use restoring and blablabla and i nearly threw my hands up in the air, and gave up...

after the initial shock, i went for it , stripped her nekked, wirebrush, paint stripper... that took me 2 weeks in all...

the welder did his work in 2 days, then 5 more days to paint...

the rest of my story wasn't as easy , as obviously i removed my engine and that was toast as well.... but frankly , the chassis cleanup and fixup ... that wasn't hard at all... and not that expensive either compared to the engine work....


the only catch with the nose, is the wires for the signal indicators and headlights...... yours is only a year younger than mine, so those could be brittle and worn as well... be very carefull when you remove them....

you could start with that patch, wirebrush it , see how far the rust is ...
if it ain't bad, it's best to find out before you take off the fender... if it's well aligned now , leave it unless you absolely have to ... there's to much kit glue in there to simply unbolt it and replace

most of the other areas on the nose and car are accessible if you jack/lift it up to 45 degrees ( make sure it's well supported !! ), except maybe the middle of the car itself, but that's not a specific problem area...