When do you usually shift?
 

I have an 87 coupe. Stock motor, pretty much stock everything.
The owners manual talks about a light that will come on to tell me when to "optimally" shift. The light does not work.

For average driving (starting out from a light in the city or something like that) when do you guys typically shift? 3k- 4k- something else?

Is there a problem if I want to typically upshift at 3.5 to 4k rpm just to enjoy the engine? The car seems to get pissy if I try to accelerate anywhere below about 2.2k.

just curious as to how others drive their cars in everyday situations. I have no comparison as this is the only sports car I have ever owned.

thanks.

22k, 35k , 40 k rm???

you better call the f1 teams and have em slap a price on yer head
coz i'm sure they'de like to know how you make yer 87 911 do 22000, 35000 or 40000 rpms...without blowing it up....


just kidding , i guess you mean 2200 , 3500 and 4000 rpm

porches like redline rpm
just give em time to get used to it
make sure they are warm before redlining
and if you have a lazy engine , train it slowly towards redline....

4000 is not the shift rpm
it's the rpm you get AFTER you shifted.... ( exagerating now , not all 911's will arrive at 4000 after you shift at redline ) , but you get the idea...these are not V8's , these engines like, require, deserve the occasional redline shift

For normal, everyday driving I shift around 3.5-4.5K rpms. IMO, 3.5K is the minimum shift point because the rpms drop to 2.5K after the shift. Below 2.5K feels like I would be lugging the car.

I'm with svandamme, my car really seems to run better after I beat on it a little. Wait until your temp is above the big white block and then have at it. In town I guess 2-3k is OK to putter around the neighborhood but if you want to enjoy driving it, don't be afraid to get it in that 4000-6500 rpm range where it will perform at its best. The main this is to not stomp on it cold.
After you push it for a spirited drive, you will notice how much nicer it idles and runs at lower rpms that day.

After the rebuild with upper end timing- around town a sedate 4500. On it with a big smile- 6000. The US SC is geared with a second gear that really has to dip low into the r.p.m.s as compared to the other gears. At least that's how I feel.

1st to 6k 35mph
2nd to 6k 58mph
3rd to 6k can't say for sure:}

It's a revvy car now. It kicks in at 4500 to redline or just a tad into redline before the limiter kicks in. I expressly had Walt install racing springs when he did the valve job. It has Elgin cheater cams too. I don't race the car though. The car seems to be getting quicker at a little over 25k on the rebuild. Followed Wayne's book.

16 mpg city
20 mpg highway

When the rev limiter kicks in....

I have a stock '87 Coupe also. I generally shift around the mid 3.5ks in city driving. But roads permitting with the engine warm (about 20 minutes), the car loves to be redlined and I more than happy to accomodate it. Forget the Casio light; it's for "optimal" shifting for fuel economy.

That scares the shift outta me:D

As high an RPM as allowed by conditions and traffic. No not really....Redline baby!

With the eng. cold, I slowly take it to 2500-3K. Once she is warmed up, traffic permitting. 3500-5K. I have yet to take her to redline.

I wish my shift light didn't come on.

rust never sleeps

Take the bulb out, problem solved.

Holy crap!! Dude, what's wrong?? "have yet to take her to redline." OK, you have a supermodel wife, but you don't actually have sex with her?? NO, so then, take your car to redline. These things build peak power at 5800 rpm. Porsche designed them to redline safely at 6500 rpm for a reason. 3.5-5k is great for regular cruising, but at least once per day or per drive you should hit redline.

I suppose at least you are getting to 5k, we've had some members that set their own personal redline at 4k. After we talked some sense into them they came back from several hour drives, changed their shorts, and then thanked us.

Masraum, look at the cars in his "Collection", two turbo diesels. Redlining one of those is like be@ting off, you got the desired results, but so what, its not very satisfying!

3,500 to 4,000 is best when just driving around. Unfortunately when driving anywhere in the NY metro area going beyond that in any gear but 1st means that I'm going too fast when I hit the next expansion joint/pot hole and the SC moans. Driving the SC around makes me feel like I'm four wheeling in a dune buggy. I think the solution is to jack up the SC, remove the deck lid, put flood lights on the roof and make it like a VW Baja.

In my Porsche SC and BMW M3, I try to keep the rev above 4K, that means shifting at 6-7K. A few times, the rev limitters did the reminding.

I usually shift at around 3.5K-5K. I take the car to redline every couple of days. :D I have noticed that the more/harder I drive the car, the better the engine sounds too. Why is that?

Normal, slow, driving = between 2.5k to 3k.
Little agressive = 3.5k to 5k.
That light is way to early, I think, and it's on and off itself for fun :lol:

Normal driving around town 3~4.5 ......having fun 4.5 ~6, I have yet to bump the rev limiter.

I will have to agree with those who say thee harder you drive it the better and smoother it runs.

Last Nov I took 2 trips to Gatlinburg TN. about 150 miles each way 75% interstate driving. I noticed after the trip she ran like a different car.............cant explain it but it works:cool:

thanks for the input guys

I thought I saw here that the light can not be removed.

I have an 87 Targa with 98K miles. I follow the owner's manual instructions and do not take it over 4500 rpm until the engine is warm, shifting at about 4000. After the car is warm, I shift at 4500 to 6000 during normal driving. When driving at a constant speed, I usually run between 3000-3500 rpm. My engine seems exceptionally smooth here, and has plenty of pickup for in-town driving.

The shift light is a joke. I tried shifting when it lit up a few times, and I ended up in overdrive at 30 mph, with rpm barely over idle.

The light is based on lack of pedal movment, hold it down and shift at red line as much as you can in what ever gear. It's hard to do in 4th, It's nice to drop down from 5th to 4th and give it a poke, get to learn your skill first so you DO NOT hit 2nd, On this board you can read some storys about missing a shift.
Have fun and watch out for the Cop's I read your other post, this is not a car to have sitting in the garage to wax only.
Safe driving and lots of it!

I cringe when I hear about folks shifting at 3500-4000 rpms in these cars...they are missing out, and the car doesn't particularly like it either imo. I keep my car in the power band (3500-redline) when I'm driving, approaching redline (and occasionally hitting the rev limit) on each and every shift after she's good and warm. In other words, I've got a 22 mile 'back roads commute' to work, and most of the time, I don't get past 3rd gear :).

Dorschman,

Let me give you another viewpoint. When the car is cold, you don't want to use as many revs, obviously. Running the engine to 3000 initially, maybe 3500 after a couple minutes and maybe 4000 once you get 120C oil temp. I'd wait till full oil temp is reached before using a lot of revs or throttle.

Once it's warmed up, then what? It depends entirely on what you are doing, or going to do. I'll elaborate. The faster you wish to accelerate, the more you open the throttle and the more revs you use. Sounds obvious, right? What it boils down to is you don't want to use a lot of throttle at low revs or very little throttle at high revs. The former isn't particularily good for an engine, the other is equally pointless. Think of them as going hand in hand, the higher the engine speed, the more throttle you give it. Once you get to a cruising speed, if no further acceleration is likely, shift up to a gear that still feels a little responsive if you increase the throtttle opening. What I mean by this is, if the revs are too low for a particular gear, large changes in throttle position will have little effect on engine power and the car will feel unresponsive to you inputs. Try accelerating from 45 or 50 mph in third, fourth and fifth just to see how each feels. You'll see the difference.

If you are cruising along and anticipate a need to accelerate coming up, drop it down a gear or two, depending on how hard you are going to accelerate. Pretty soon, if you pay attention to what the car is trying to tell you, you'll develop a certain amount of mechanical sympathy and smoothness in your driving.

"Italian tuneups," where you run through the gears to redline periodically to clean the plugs or clean the carbon deposits out of the cylinders is pretty much unnecessary at this point, with modern injection systems and good quality fuels. It's more important to get the engine to full operating temp each time you drive it and to boil off as much condensed water in the engine and exhaust as you can.

Of course, if you want to bang the engine off the rev limiter each and every shift, or howl down the freeway two gears too low, feel free to do so. The rebuilds will just come sooner....

JR

masraum used a great analogy with the "supermodel" as wife thing--LOL.

In all honesty, I would not be at all interested in driving my 911 if I were deliberately shifting before 4.5k. Otherwise, why even own the car?

Mike

I never can understand these shifting questions, to me its like asking how to have sex. Yes there are some guidelines but most of the shifting should be felt, rather than a numerical point. If you feel like the engine is strung out or not feeling as it should, up change. If you feel like the engine is lugging, down change. If you really want to know your car, put it in second gear on a long clean straight and floor it from about 2k up wards and watch how the engine behaves. I know my engine well enough to know that it goes berserk from 5k to 6k. I actually shift before the redline because I can feel that the power isnt as rich as it could be up near there. Every different motor is completely different in how it should be driven, you should learn the pros and cons of each motors rev range.

Then crush the hell out it.....are ya man or a mouse...:eek:

I hate things that tell me what to do.....

After all warmed up, 5,000 "normal" and 6,200 when converting gas into smiles.

It's really funny when I drive someone's car, when they ask me to take a look at it. Most people shift at about 3-4K, and I run the car up to just under redline, almost all the time (only when warm). These cars were meant to be driven - the rev-limiter is there to prevent damage - hitting it will not damage the engine. The looks on these 3-4K shifters is priceless as they think I'm trashing their car. Then I take them for a ride in my '72RS, and then they begin to understand.

-Wayne

i couldn't possibly not rev the snot out of a Porsche engine
i'm mentally uncapable of doing so, even when warming up , i eyeball the temp gauge like a hawk ... every bit of movement there, means a tiny increase of rev range....

it's not the speed, it's the accelleration, the throttle response and the noise... shifting at anything less then 5000 is such a waste... might as well buy a diesel then...

My engine is "on song" 4-6k, I encourage tenative guest drivers to "take a gulp - don't just take a sip!" As Wayne said, "they start to get it" if you show them the way. I like watching the look on a guest driver's face as they start to "get it".... I also enjoy a moment in the passenger seat to concentrate on listening to the engine sound - so sweet!

Always with a warm engine though....

I drive my car near redline when appropriate but it's kind of hard to do around town except for first gear since 6000 rpms in 2nd gear exceeds most city street speed limits.

It's fun to redline the engine and always drive in a higher RPM range than necessary, but wasteful as well. You'll use more fuel, run at hotter temps, and be looking at a rebuild sooner. Is this even debatable? Spinning the engine over faster than it needs to leads to higher operating stresses and consequently a reduced service life. That simple. These engines are built to withstand a lot, but all other things being equal, an engine shifted at 4500 and not abused will outlast an engine that is consistently thrashed to redline for no particular reason. Pay for a rebuild and then decide. ;)

Shift when you no longer need the acceleration of the lower gear, or if you're just having fun, when you notice the engine running out of power. Many people point to HP figures being higher at higher RPM's, but torque figures equate more closely to acceleration, and these are achieved lower down in the RPM band. My SC's max torque occurs before 4500 RPM.

I too wish my CASIS light didn't work. ;)

ianc

What Matthew, Stijn and Ian said nicely blended and stirred not shaken..

why bother owning one of these cars if you don't beat the snot out of it?

I don't see the point. Drive a mercedes or something else but not a purpose built sports car.

JMZ,

Cause its one of very few cars that does not necessarily have to be spanked hard in order to be fun to drive. ;)

I'd like to connect the upshift light on my 74 w/86 3.2 just for fun. What do I need?

Cheers,

Joe

Some patience, a small lightbulb, and the willingness to be constantly annoyed. ;)

So the only way you can derive enjoyment from driving your car is beating the crap out of it? Hope you don't feel the same way about your girlfriend\wife? ;)

ianc

Do a search on the CASIS light there is a thread on which wire to clip to disconnect it.

As you may have seen from this thread, the 3.2 engine really doesn't come into its power band until you hit 3K rpms. An aftermarket chip will give you more low end torque. I just installed the SW chip and it has done a great deal to improve the low end power range.