'82 SC prepurchase advice needed please
 

Hi guys. This is a longshot, but there is an '82 sc for sale that the owner wants to sell me. I've been fighting him on the price of $20k for over 8 months now. He told me over the phone this weekend that he took the car out for a drive and then to get some gas. He said that after he put the gas in he noticed that there was a small amount of gasoline leaking from a rubber hose underneath where you put the gas in (crazy, but I can't remember what this opening is called!!!).
Does anyone know what this might be and if it is anything to worry about? It seems that this has motivated him to sell the car to me for less (I was asking to pay $19k).
Thanks if you can help,

Curt

Here's a couple pics:
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1142896993.jpg

The owner also mentioned that "quite honestly" He'd like to sell it before something goes on it. I was surprised to hear him say this, but I have no reason to think there's something imminent coming. Cockpit:http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1142897159.jpg

IMHO you are at the crossroads of lust and reason. I have never been happy when I chose reason.

The leak is probably a leak of some kind and there will be other problems later, some serious, some not. If you have been chasing this beauty for 8 months you will not be happy until it is yours.

Be happy. Money comes and goes. Good luck.

19,000 is a bit high for an SC unless it is an extremely low mileage and/or the body & mechanicals are in perfect shape.

You can get a nice Carrera for the same price.

Someone posted a really nice 78 White SC Coupe on the Porsche Parts Forum for a decent price.

John

My SC looks just as good and I picked it up for $12K. I figure that was a deal and it's worth like $15K. For $19K though you can get a nice Carrera.

Thanks for your replies. Please keep in mind there's little more than crap here on the east coast!

Curt,

I'm not selling my 82, but if I was, it would be for a high price because absolutely everything is buttoned down, nothing is leaking, and I wouldn't be expecting "something to go on it." The engine, trans, brake system, heat and air conditioning have all been re-done and so has the interior. These are older cars now and things do go south. However, that asking price is for a low mileage, pristine SC, including no visible wear on the seat bolsters, maybe some 8 or 9 inch rear wheels, correct deck-lid, etc. I probably have at least 20 grand into my car (doing most of the work myself and with my P-car technician buddy), but it's as perfect as a 24 year old car can be. For that price, you should end up with a near-perfect SC. Good luck.

Steve

There is a drain line from the area around the filler neck incase of
overfilling or spilling. 911s are kind of a pain to put fuel in because
of the turns in the filler neck. You have to fill them slowly.

Nice looking SC, how many miles are on it?
(BTW, it may be faster if he left some of the keys at home)

Excellence is showing pricing around $19K for an excellent '82. For that much money, I'd expect it to have a perfect PPI and be flawless.

According to Bruce's Excellence Magazine Market Update, an '82
SC falls into the following range...
low - $13542
good - $15398
excellent - $20613
This is from August 2005 and the values continue to go
up each year.

$19k is a reasonable price for this car if the condition is as
good as the pictures look.

I would not pay $19k for an SC where the owner is expecting 'something to go' on it.

Why does he think that? because he has has been deferring maintenance?

Personally I would prefer a higher mileage car where the owner has gone over all the major systems thoroughly than a low mileage garage queen that just gets oil changes & the occasional valve adjustment.

If you buy the car & something does 'go' soon after purchase you're pretty quickly going to have mid $20's into the car. Thats alot for an SC!

I think Excellence values are high for SC's & Carreras. I would sell my 82 today for the 'low' value, and this is a car that has had engine, clutch, brakes, and some suspension refreshed, excellent full leather interior w/ sport seats, brand new tires on near perfect Fuchs ... yadda yadda.

Don't put too much stock in the purchase prices typically quoted here on Pelican. I've never seen so many $20,000 cars bought for $11k. Everyone's a genius (except you and me).

Seriously, get the car you want...don't worry about what these guys think. Me included.

Great replies from each of you guys. I really appreciate it.
Steve- You are right. It should be perfect, but what if its in fantastic condition with no upgrades?
DSmeyer- It has 60k miles on it. Its a 2-owner. The present owner claims to have had it for 15 years. I'm going to take a look-see this weekend and will let you guys know. Thanks again.
rrs- I think its going to be expensive anyway that you look at it!

Excellence prices are currently too optimistic, no doubt, but I feel that the SCs will be increasing in price relatively soon much like their American muscle cousins. If I buy it this is how I intend to justify its price :)

Regards,

Curt

Thanks Mike. I will probably end up paying for this car alot over its price, but I will love it.

I realize most everyone here has my best interest in mind. I really like the comraderie here and appreciate it very much. If, or when I should say, I am in the possession of an SC I will be a regular here and consider myself a Pelican. You guys are great.

Sincerely,
Curt

For what it is worth there is an outstanding, full records, ALL upgrades you'd want, anal-retentive owner (the best kind) white '82 SC on the Cars For Sale board right now. It is in Arizona.

Okay, so white isn't as sexy as black but that car's asking price is only $14,900. I'd buy it in a heartbeat.

This black car looks good but its beuty may be skin deep at best. Just look over the white one and you'll see it is premium. My personal opinion is the black car's owner is asking too much and you're over pursuing. This will probably be clear six months after you purchase it. By the way, no affiliation whatsoever with the white SC for sale. Just thought you should know.

Good luck whatever you decide. (Scoop up that white one, man it is nice, complete and hell you could put a VERY nice black paint job (eek) on it if you MUST have black)

Dan, That is a great car. Interestingly enough I had a dream just last night that I bought a white SC. As I was driving it, it dawned on me that it was a white SC and wondered why I didn't get a black one. White is a second choice, I am firmly on a black one for multiple reasons. Thank you again for the heads-up.

Curt

Just to let you know what is on the east coast...well southeast coast...kinda...I bought an 87 Carrera with top end done less than 500 miles ago...new steering rack...turbo tie rod ends...7s and 8s...drilled rotors...prototipo wheel...new Dunlops...cold air...every document dating back to original purchase...plus some very nice parts that will be installed upon my return home....and I got it for what your seller is asking....of course it only took me five years to talk my brother into selling it to me.... shamed him into it....but hey....there are deals out there to be had...

$19K for an 82SC???? Dude even if it is hard to find a decent 911 on the east coast, that is way overpriced.

Here I will sell you my '86 Carrera for $19K, which is in much better condition than that SC.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1142910767.jpg

Thanks for the encouragement, Don!

Kurt- Nice car, but I'm stuck on the SC for illogical reasons. Thanks!!

Well, you need to tell us about the mileage? records? and then have someone without an erection look at it. Bottomline is the car is worth what you are willing to pay. Almost everyone on this board will agree that these are 20 k cars..either up front or by the time you are done. You just don't want to spend 20 k and need an engine rebuild or a new tranny. I also agree with you that nice cars on the east coast are hard to find. Looks sweet. The seat sags are telling me high miles

I spent close to a year looking for my 82 SC. Its not a cream puff, but is in nice shape. I paid 17K Canadian, 19K US seems a bit on the high side, but can you really put a price on happiness. Take it for a PPI and if it checks out take it home. You will always need to spend money on your P Car it just a matter if you spend it now or later. I do finid it interesting that the selling wants to get rid of it "before something goes". That would leave me a little suspect. Just my $0.02

Thanks Ron And Jason. It has 60k miles and limited records, from what I remember.

Agreed. A rebuild would be a nightmare after paying top dollar for it.
It is suspect that he wants to unload it now. Lets see how the PPI turns out after I see it next weekend-IF it looks good in the flesh!

Regards,
Curt

Make sure you get a leakdown, compression check, and check for broken head studs during the PPI. If everything is not perfect, it doesn't mean you shouldn't buy the car, but it gives you some bargaining ammo.

Plenty of great SCs out there for 15K and good ones for $12-13K (like mine for $12.5K). Consider finding a nice CA. car, having it checked out, fly out there and save yourself $5K over a questionable east coast car.

FWIW, a local in Bremerton, WA just got an 86 CA. targa for $14K in outstanding condition. I was at the P-car mechanic shop when it was there for a post-buy inspection and it certainly was an excellant example.

Also useful bargaining chips:

-does it have the upgraded chain tensioners? ($500 parts, about $400 labor if you pay for it) Those will very likely fail (as they did on my 82 SC).

-what state is the hinge-stop on the driver's side door like? (does it crack when you open it?)

-when was the clutch last replaced?

-how do the synchros from 1st to 2nd gears feel?

Good luck, looks like a sweet ride!!

Babak

Looks like a nice car, but $20K is way on the high side. If I were to recommend that someone pay that much for a car, it better come with 2 or 3 concours trophies as well...

-Wayne

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cars-sale/239580-1984-lowered-red-carrera-coupe.html

I would go for this nice red Carrera instead.

Do not look at the thread if you already purchased the SChttp://www.pelicanparts.com/support/.../cheeburga.gif

To me, the gas "leak" just sounds like the overflow drain but it also sounds like the owner is worried that his lack of proactive maintenance may be leading to other issues.

It's a nice looking car but 19K is too much for a stock SC with 60K miles.
If you like it, tell the owner what you think it may be worth and whether the outcome of a PPI could provide room for negotiating. If he won't budge on the price, then you should probably walk away and wish him the best of luck.

I wouldn't go just by low mileage.

The orginal owner of the Targa I have purchased it with 62,000 miles.

A short time later after he had the car the internal T-stat went bad so he had to pull the motor and then found a broken valve spring so he had the heads send off to a machine shop for new springs, valve guides etc and replaced the head studs with steel ones and a bunch of other stuff for $$$$.

Then the wheel bearings had to be replaced, brake calipers rebuilt etc....

Now I have the Traga with almost every suspensiopn, seal, fuel lines, oil hoses, brakes, clutch, bushings all replaced and the interior is in perfect shape and the original paint still shines

Good luck with your decision.

David- Thank youu- Bargaining power indeed, I'm hoping!

Nick- Good option, but it would be disappointing if the car looked terrible once I saw it after the 6 hour trip! :)

Babak- Thank you.

Wayne- Thank you too. I am being clobbered over the head by reason :)

John- I'm really stuck on black for now, thank you for directing me there though.

Jim- I think you hit it on target. Its probably been sitting for the longest time, but hopefully the PPI will bring certain things to the surface. Thanks again.

John- Agreed. Thanks much!!

Curt

http://deemsriddle.tripod.com/1980_911_sc

Here's a nice black 80 SC listed on Rennlist for $12,500 obo.

I would paint the rims black

http://www.dorkiphus.com/porsche/showthread.php?t=6298&highlight=black

Black 84 Coupe with tail near Philly ubde 15k

Thanks John for your leads! You are too kind. The 80SC interior leather is a little weird looking (cheap!:) and the car looks uncared for. The '84 has burgundy interior which is something I could never swallow! Not trying to be picky!! :) I am stuck on a black/black SC. I am grateful for you keeping me in mind.
Regards,
Kurt

Black on Black SC's rule :cool:

Haha. Yes!

yep...your obsessed! Your gonna get it no matter anybody says.

I personally hate black interior, it fades, it scuffs, its hot, it shows badly. And all the black car owners can attest to weekly cursings at dust, bird droppings, swirls marks, scratches on and on. Boy...that sounded synical.

Get the black 80'SC and change the interior to black. You can sell those cork pieces, dash (hec fire you can get 1K for those electric cork seats)....totally recoup the cost for a new inside.

That will be 1 dollar please for solving this problem.

If Wayne says no go......you ain't listening to nobody!

I agree.

Black & Black down south is torture unless you only drive at night once it's above 50 degrees or if you have a Targa you can just leave the top off. Planning on geting lighter color seat covers to keep cool in the warmer weathe r or my car.

My Jetta GLI has a black interior and I even have to crank up the A/C to cool off in the winter after leaving it parked outside in the sun for a while.

I was persistent with getting a mid-year Targa before I picked up my SC. Really nice car and in great mechanical condition.
Took it for three test drives (One for about 70 miles) but there was something in my mind that stopped me from pulling the trigger at the last second.

Let us know how the PPI goes.

This is a difficult period in the life of these 911SCs. First there is an incredibly wide range of condition, degree of maintenance and rejuvenation. None should be in the restoration category yet. (Yes, there are some needing restoration but that isn’t remotely economical.)

The absolute best advice is to buy the best example within your budget. Yes, that probably means paying over market. Even then you will need to apply a lot of the proper lubricant ($$$) to get it where you want it and maintain its condition at the top rung. I think those are the best long term bargains.

A year or so ago I considered a ’81 911SC. Original paint, original full blue leather, 125K and a broken head stud. Overall it was in pretty good original condition. As I looked closely, aside from the engine rebuild, the clutch was way off, the trans needed at least syncros, old (original?) suspension needed attention, brakes worn out, heat exchangers needed replacing, and there were another 15-20 “minor” issues. There were $20K needed to be spent to bring it to $12K market value.

Needless to say I didn’t insult the owner by offering to take it off his hands for free so I politely walked. I suppose with my crazy Porsche obsession, if free, I would have spent $20K+ on the repairs and upgrades just to recover it to $15-18K value.

What happens to these cars is they get made to look nice and the flaws that an unknowledgeable buyer might identify be fixed. This is the “used car” market.

This illustrates why careful and through Pre-Purchase Inspection (PPI) is so necessary. With a very high-end car, I would have several qualified experts completely inspect and test it. I would also seek good market advice. I think spending 5-10% isn’t unreasonable. Many times I have spent $500 and much more and walked.

The term I use is; “Don’t let your money burn a hole in your pocket. It may come back and burn you in a more sensitive place.” It is free to lament over missed deals, it is very expensive to allow passion over good sense.

Best,
Grady

Can't help but feel that price is high. But here I am at the other side of the globe...
The SC's here are around 12.500 EURO's and I got mine for less. I got a black - red '82 SC and I love her ;)
Right now I'm spending what I saved on the chain tensioner upgrade and regular maintenance.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1143068961.jpg

Wesayo,

Your black coupe looks real sweet with the maroon interior.:)