Odometer rollback--Red flag for buying?

[Plecostomus]

I have been talking to an '83 911SC owner who's selling it (very nice in all aspects) with an advertized mileage of 57,000 miles and two owners. He states that his mechanic says the drivetrain is very strong. The car is almost immaculate, has the chain tensioner update. He wants $20k for it, slightly negotiable. I just recieved the carfax and am worried becaue it looks to have maybe 4 owners and an odo rollback of around 17k. Please give me your feelings about this car. I might take a flight on Saturday to see it. Heres the report:

02/01/1990 28,360 Illinois
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Barrington, IL
Title #H565xxxx Title issued or updated
Loan or lien reported
01/08/1991 11,979 Illinois
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Barrington, IL
Title #E642xxxx Title issued or updated
POTENTIAL ODOMETER ROLLBACK

CARFAX AdvisorTM
CARFAX analyzed the mileage history and the sources of this information. Our analysis indicates a potential odometer rollback. Please verify the mileage with your dealer or a qualified mechanic.

09/29/1992 Illinois
Inspection Station
Schaumburg, IL Failed emissions inspection
12/11/1992 Illinois
Inspection Station
Schaumburg, IL Failed emissions inspection
02/10/1993 Illinois
Inspection Station
Schaumburg, IL Passed emissions inspection
07/15/1993 Illinois
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Deerfield, IL
Title #N692xxxx Title issued or updated
11/09/1993 Illinois
Inspection Station
Lincolnshire, IL Passed emissions inspection
10/11/1994 Illinois
Inspection Station
Lincolnshire, IL Passed emissions inspection
09/28/1995 Illinois
Inspection Station
Lincolnshire, IL Passed emissions inspection
08/22/1997 Illinois
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Deerfield, IL
Title #T723477xxxx Title issued or updated
Duplicate title issued
10/23/1997 Illinois
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Fox River Grove, IL
Title #T729640xxxx Title issued or updated
07/06/1999 Wisconsin
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Elkhorn, WI
Title #99187Nxxxx Title or registration issued
07/06/2006 Porsche Cars North America No recalls open for repair


Thanks!

[LakeCleElum]

That's a lot of money for an '83.......If someone along the line was dishonest to roll back the speedo, who knows what else is not being disclosed.........Would be a deal breaker for me....

[78targa]

Unless you are set on this particular car, I would keep looking. Plenty of good deals around $15k...even for very nice SC's.

However, to answer your original question, with a car over 20 years old, I guess I wouln't be too concerned about the odometer unless the price was supposed to reflect exemplary low mileage.

At 20 years you biggest concern is mechanical condition and wear.

[MBAtarga]

Another thought on the mileage. The time elapsed during the possible rollback was almost 1 year. The car could have been driven another 15k (or more?) during that time period, and then rolled back the additional 17k - possibly "hiding" 35k miles.

I agree with both posts above - 15k can get you a garage queen SC, or add another 5k and get you a garage queen Carrerra.

[Plecostomus]

Bob- You are right on with that thought. Thanks!

Casey- I agree

Mark- I just calculated that the car has a MINIMUM of 84,000 miles on it based on what you suggest. Thanks so much.

Time to keep looking. Thanks everyone,

C

[Plecostomus]

Socal- Awesome point! I didnt think of this one. Thanks for your kind input

C

[SCHNELE]

Here we go again, Carfax is not the ALL END ALL to a car's history, there are sometimes numerous errors in a single report and the information can be read very subjectively. In this case the two owners may have had loans on the car, whenever the lien was released it would show as a title update, also if the owners moved from one state to another that would also necessitate a new title. The Carfax report is only as accurate as the person entering the data, I am in R.L. Polk & Co. neck of the woods and I am a New Car dealer we use carfax all the time but it is not infallible and you have to be able to discern some nuanced info sometimes, so just try to find the best car with the cleanest bill of health from an independent pre- purchase inspection.

[Plecostomus]

Thanks Schnele! Good point, but the owner eventually came out and said that when he bought the car it had an odometer disclosure document with it. I'm not sure what this entails, but he knew there was an odo discrepancy and never disclosed it from the getgo, which is suspect to me and the reason I'm bailing. Thanks again,

C

[RickM]

Here's a car that you may be able to get down to a decent price: http://newjersey.craigslist.org/car/178970431.html

[Brant]

Originally posted by SCHNELE
Here we go again, Carfax is not the ALL END ALL to a car's history, there are sometimes numerous errors in a single report and the information can be read very subjectively. In this case the two owners may have had loans on the car, whenever the lien was released it would show as a title update, also if the owners moved from one state to another that would also necessitate a new title. The Carfax report is only as accurate as the person entering the data, I am in R.L. Polk & Co. neck of the woods and I am a New Car dealer we use carfax all the time but it is not infallible and you have to be able to discern some nuanced info sometimes, so just try to find the best car with the cleanest bill of health from an independent pre- purchase inspection.

AMEN....
I had an 83 SC that I sold to a long time (30year+) family friend.
5 years later he decided to sell it and the car fax showed all kinds of undisclosed mileage multiple registrations It was a long thread here on pelican. Some of the car fax was obviously wrong. The interested party at the time came back to tell me how I was a crook and lying for my friend...

needless to say it was all upsetting and the car ended up selling for 9K instead of 15K just due to the stupid car fax report.

car fax is not infalliable.
brant

[Rot 911]

Really doesn't matter anyway. No matter how good that SC is, it is not worth $20K!

[pryord]

If you're willing to travel, there appears to be a nice low mileage SC on Craigslist in Portland, OR for $13,500. I have no affiliation with the car, but I'd be happy to take a look at if for you.

http://portland.craigslist.org/car/177775625.html

David

[VaSteve]

Originally posted by SCHNELE
Here we go again, Carfax is not the ALL END ALL to a car's history, there are sometimes numerous errors in a single report and the information can be read very subjectively. ... I am a New Car dealer we use carfax all the time but it is not infallible and you have to be able to discern some nuanced info sometimes, so just try to find the best car with the cleanest bill of health from an independent pre- purchase inspection.

I have a 1986 944 that I bought from the original owner. It had 172K miles when I bought it. On the drive to the inspection station, I hit a rough patch in the road and a sticker from the back of the speedometer fell down in front of the last 3 ODO digits. The inspection guy entered "172" miles into the system., which I discovered after I left. Um, thanks. The the state entered the wrong purchase date into the computer, which this reminds me I need to address. Swell.

The car was destined for hard track duty and I already blew and replaced the engine, so it doesn't mean anything, but it's a good lession that CARFAX isn't perfect.

[VaSteve]

Oh, and BTW, if you're serious about spending $20K on an SC, check out Rick Lee's. It's close and it's nice.

[Rick Lee]

Just saw this thread. Yes, my SC IS worth $20k. Read the ad to see why.

And the CPO BMW 330i I just bought has a odometer rollback alert on the CarFax too. But it's very obvious that the mileage was typed into the computer incorrectly when it was at the dealer for service a year or so ago. It was just a typo. But because it wasn't caught right there, it stays with the car.

[Plecostomus]

Thanks to each of you fellows. Its much appreciated,

Kurt

[anthony]

Originally posted by Rick Lee
But it's very obvious that the mileage was typed into the computer incorrectly when it was at the dealer for service a year or so ago. It was just a typo. But because it wasn't caught right there, it stays with the car.

One can dispute incorrect entries with carfax though I'm not sure what documentation they would require.