Help!!! How much should I pay for....

I am currently looking at a 1980 SC, blk/saddle,7x8,factory power sunroof,29K miles,2 owner, researched the title and all seems to legit, the car is a euro, w/factory turbo whaletail, has turbo chain tensioners and it runs very very tight,paint/body and interior are immaculate. With my knowledge, but not expertise, I need your help, what is the car worth?? Pls give me an idea so I dont get hosed!! I am ready to join your club!!

I don't keep up with the prices my self, but I do know where you can check and get an honest number. 'Excellence' magazine has an ongoing series on current prices, and Bruce Anderson writes it. So, you could check the past year's issues for recent info. Or, you could write Bruce directly at his email addy: Bruce1485@aol.com ... my guess is that he would say extreme caution is advised with a 'Gray Market' car, and that their prices are $1-2K lower because of their dubious nature. One thing is for SURE: you should get an assessment by a known professional mechanic, or an acquaintance with extremely good 911 knowledge, and I mean bodywork, engines, brakes, suspensions, and transmissions, EVEYTHING!!! You should also demand to see the cars EPA/DOT certificate or whatever the paper is called when it was imported. DOD active military were given a one-time exemption at one time, but the proviso was the vehicle could NEVER be sold for use on the street and registered, EVER, by another owner! So, if a military man/woman was the importer, forget about this car unless a lot of paperwork proves its legitimacy, otherwise PASS! If you think I am harping on this subject a little strongly, just write a letter to 'AutoWeek' or 'Road & Track' and ask about EPA/DOT 'horror stories' regarding 'gray-market Porsches' ... and I think you will be enlightened.

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa

2000 miles per year? Hmmm. I'd be careful. Not to say its not legit, but I'd be careful, especially on a car that has probably had its speedo replaced at least once in its life (from KPH to MPH).

The car should look almost new, inside, outside and underneath, I would think, with that kind of mileage. Take it to a pro for his input! It'll be the best $100 you ever spend on the car.

Brian

wow 29k miles, sounds too good, my 81 has 180k, but still goes like a rocket.

I thank you guys for your responses, I think you kind of got off on a tangent, I wasn't necessarily asking if you thought it was possible, I was asking what you think I should pay for the car??? I understand that detective work needs to be done, it sounds like you are telling me to steer away from low mileage car??? In dollars, if all is verified and checked out by experts, how much should I pay for it???? Thank you again.

911 Dreamer:

I guess what most guys are trying to tell you is that such a car sounds too good to be true, and therefore it probably is.

But I can tell you that a 1980 911SC probably is worth only about $10,000 on the used car market, UNLESS it is a pristine USA car, unless it is low milage, unless it has never been in an accident, etc. etc. There are too many variables, and the greatest of them is the authenticity of the car you describe.

Finally, don't forget the number one maxim of a free economy: The cost of a thing is purely up to the person willing to pay that price......Andras

OK, just for fun, I'll take a guess.

I'd say that a true 29,000 mile car would be one that was owned by a collector, or someone similar who did not mind paying for the costs associated with owning a car (storage, insurance, maintenance, lost opportunity costs, etc), even though they only drove it infrequently. This type of person would likely take good care of the car, so I would assume that a true 29,000 mile car would be in near mint condition. It must've been only driven in nice weather, because if you only drove it a few miles a year, why would you choose to do so in bad weather? So, the undercarriage, etc. should be very clean.

I would assume that the car, with very little work, should be a competitive concours car in at least local PCA competition.

With all of those assumptions, I think a seller, if he found the right buyer, could get $18,000 to $22,000 for the car, if it were a US car. Maybe a little more, if he really found the right buyer, who had to have the car.

Being a Euro car definately reduces its value. How much, I don't know, but I think Bruce Anderson says about 20%?

I think that a good US 1980 SC will fetch more than $10,000, one with average miles in good condition would go more in the $12,500 to $14,000 range, I think.

Of course, the above is just for fun, it is true, especially with unique cars (of which a true 29,000 mile SC is one), that the car is worth what someone will pay.

Thanks Warren and Brian:

Once again I do agree with both of you 100%; I have had friends who found their cars in the apocryphal "barn on a farm", that, ONCE RESTORED, was worth lots more than the current used price.

But with Euro cars, one must be really very careful, since they have always been run much harder, faster, with less maintenance, etc. than cars in the USA, which are usually owned by fanatics who religiously maintain their cars (no puns intended).

Again, Warren's advice to 911Dreamer is spot on - do not try to assess the "worth" of this car without help. Any knowledgeable PCA or POC member would be delighted to help you - all of us "fans" love to see 911, love to talk 911, and love to look 911.

Ask one in your area to help you assess the car, 911Dreamer. That way you can be sure.....Andras

Without trying to be 'overly negative' about ALL gray-market cars, it is very hard to analyze and give advice from a distance! There can be, because of many unscrupulous importations that were done out of pure greed in the '80s, plenty of serious repercussions to 'junping too quickly' for a car that looks great at first glance! A car that is in perfect condition with respect to the transaxle, for example, if left to sit up with 'old' gear oil, may be balky to shift into certain gears, and that problem can be cleared up by changing the gear oil. But, an unscrupulous seller is probably not going to have a thorough servicing done prior to trying to move the vehicle, it would cut into the profit margin! I guess the best caveat would be to note ALL mechanical discrepancies, get estimates to repair the worst-case scenario, then discuss any price adjustments with seller, then go back home and think HARD and long about the purchase for a full week! The seller will probably encourage acting quickly before someone else gets this great 'bargain' first, but I emphasize waiting to act, so emotion plays no part at all in the purchase. It took 2.5 years of intermittent searching to find my 911. The extreme price spread between a '71 911T Targa in 'ratty' condition at a VW dealership, and a '73 911S Targa in much better shape from an individual was $3500, so I think it was worth the wait and effort!

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa

[This message has been edited by Early_S_Man (edited 01-27-2000).]