Eureka! I have found the secret to PERFECT black paint! (long)

[CarreraS2]

Maybe this is obvious to everyone, but it wasn't to me.

After going through probably $400 in different products, including Zaino, Zymol, and everything else over the past year, I finally figured it out. This is the first time I've ever had a black car, and this was driving me absolutely nuts.

The thing is, only this very specific combination worked to get PERFECT black paint. By perfect, I don't mean paint where your neighbors say "wow, that's a shiny car!"

I'm talking about totally scratch and swirl free, under all lighting conditions and all sun/cloud conditions. Even under very careful examination under the harshest florescent light, the paint is absolutely flaw free. The gloss is unreal, but it's the total lack of any swirls that makes it spectacular. It's like looking into a pool of pure black oil.

The other products and combinations worked from ok to very good, but not PERFECT.


This is done with a random orbital, I use a Porter Cable. IMO, you can't get perfect black paint by hand. Pull your perfect black hand job car under my florescents and I'll prove it to you!

Start with the Fine Cut Cleaner, and the Meguire's yellow pad. It has to be the yellow pad. One thing that got me off track was a shop that recommended one of the other pads. Didn't work well.

Apply it with the RO, in small areas at a time (divide a fender into 3 sections or so). Work the product until it is almost dry. That is critical.

Wipe clean (more on that below).

Next, with a separate Yellow Pad, apply the swirl remover. Again, small areas, worked until almost dry. Wipe off.

You should be close to perfect at this time. However, if not, redo the swirl remover one more time. You WILL be at perfect by now. I promise.

If you still see any scratches, then your paint has defects that are deeper than light swirls or very light scratches. You'd have to go with a stronger polish to get those out. Meguire's sell stronger polishes, and a stronger pad (Burgandy Pad), but I didn't need those.

Finished up with the #20 wax, and the Tan Pad. You could substitute other good pure waxes (no cleaners in them), but using the Tan Pad is critical.

Finally, to wipe and buff, you MUST use microfiber clothes. This is another mistake I made in my quest. I was using 100% pure cotton Fieldcrest towels. They are fine for any other color, but I found they introduced minor swirls into black paint. Not something 99% of people would notice, but something that drove me crazy.


The issue I had over the past year in trying to figure this out was not having the perfect combo. Using the wrong pad at the wrong time ruins it. Using the wrong finishing towel ruined it. So then even though I was close, I'd go off in a different direction (like Zaino, which was a waste of money and time).

It was only the combo above, and that exact combo, that finally worked perfectly. Those that know me know that I don't use the word "perfect" lightly, but this process really did result in a perfect finish.

[Wil Ferch]

I've said it before...but this is an emotional topic like "religion" or politics...

Dri-Wash 'N-Gard....a polymer product that is not a wax..does the same amazing result with a LOT less work... if need be, do a pre-step with 3M Imperial Hand Glaze...applied with bare, clean finger tips for "heat" or a clean soft cloth... straight line motions...never in a circle.

Especially nice for black cars...have had a number of positive black car experiences with this method..

( I know, I know..people tell me I'm nuts...but try this first before you object). May require multiple applications to make sure ALL old wax and wax build -up is gone first)....

No denying this posted method looks superb, though....

Wil

[Jgordon]

That's some good looking paint. I'll give this a try.

On a related topic, I usually wash my black car out in long island - east end. Lots of water spots, harsh water, car never looks perfect (relatively speaking). Washed it in my garage in the city, and it's like night and day. The water in NYC is amazing. No water spots at all.

When I get a chance, I'll give your method a try.

ps - I'm assuming those towels went in the wash first, and not straight from floor to car.

[DavidI]

SoCal, I am going to try your method.

David

[304065]

Wow!

JGordon, how can you wash your car in the City? Is it next to a Yoga studio?

[Jgordon]

John, my garage in the city has a water feed and a drain. It was seriously the cleanest water I've ever used to wash the car - no spots at all.

[kilodawg]

First not to start a war, I'm glad you found something that works for you and the results look great but Zaino a waste of money? I'll take your leftovers. I think you are missing the point. In a nutshell, all of your results are based on the polish you did for the finish. You topped it with a wax (I think you meant sealant).

Zaino won't get all the swirls out unless perhaps you are good with the PC and Z-PC. I'd prefer the Menzerna polish line myself to the 3M products but 3M has worked well for me before. Zaino as a post polish process excels at reflectivity and longevity. It's what you use after you get the swirls out.

Nothing I have used beats several coats of Z-2 Pro with a topping of Z-8. While I know of people who want more depth than a Zaino finish supposedly can provide I could never think of calling it a waste of money.

You'd have to pry Z-8 out of stone cold hands. Maybe in a few weeks when the sealant (wax) is gone you could try the Zaino again.

Zaino on 22 year old paint in daylight

and on 10 year old paint in daylight

[1973911s]

SoCal911SC,

Did I miss an addition to the stable?

Michael

[vesnyder]

SoCal - I can relate. I have an '83 black cab and went through similar money and heartburn. I will have to read your post in more detail come Spring - I am in the process of more mechanical upgrades - but I've had similar results with the Meguiars rubbing compounds but finishing with Zaino. But I agree with KiloDawg that Zaino is good stuff.

[kilodawg]

Yeah I had to post a bit more. Aside from Pelican I spend some time on "Autopia.org" as well and on that site there has definitly been a love/hate war between those who use Zaino and those who don't. However, it seems that the real emotion behind the issue has more to do with how passionately the pro Zaino camp has historically been. They seem to have turned a lot of people off just by their attitude. I don't want to come across that way here.

I think the real difference between Z and some of the higher grade carnubas has to do with the perceived difference between depth(wetness) and reflectivity. Here there is probably an issue with some merit although I think Z8 has closed the gap if not eliminated it. For durability and quality of water beading I haven't seen a carnuba that can compare especially after a few weeks when the carnuba is gone and the Z hasn't even gotten warmed up yet. So it really becomes a matter of personal preference and what you find to be most important.

vesnyder has it right, as pro-detailers will tell you the final result completely depends upon the preparation of the finish and it's the polishing that makes all the difference. I used 3M Hand Glaze before I got my PC. Then I tried the Menzerna line (IP and FPII). I think I'll stick with them for a while.

I'd just hate to see SoCal put off by Z because he was expecting it to do something it wasn't intended to do. Next time if you tried the Z in place of the sealant I think you'd have a completely different opinion. Especially if you started the whole process off with the clay bar, then did the polishing routine, then the Z routine and finally finishing with 2 coats of Z8.

Back off box

[WydRyd]

WHOA!!! Amazing results! Might have to give it a try on my car. Paint certainly looks tired these days

[JeremyD]

Griots garage had a similiar product for sale for years. - I agree - it worls well.

[kilodawg]

SoCal,

I think your'e seeing consistency between what you've read and what I've said. Z-5 can't replace a good polishing process like you performed. That job "removed" your paints imperfections. Z-5 does "hide" minor problems. In addition you were working on black so it's ability to hide flaws would be stressed to it's limits. If you read more you will also see that Z-5 is not the final step in the Z system but actually one of the first. You need to press on with Z-3 (if your's is a single stage paint or Z-2 Pro if it's got a clear coat) and in between wipes with Z-6 and finally Z-8. Now I know this sounds like a lot of work but the beauty of the system is that after your first coats of Z-5 you really no longer need to use the ZFX accelerator and applying a coat of Z-3 (or Z-2 Pro) is simple and can be put on and taken off in less than the time it takes to dry the car.

Realistically, I polish the wife's 993 (daily driver) similar to what you did once a year. I wash it once or twice a week and use Z-3 once every couple of months or so on average. I'll also give the car a quick light wipe of Z-8 once a week as part of the drying routine. the results are so good it's not a chore but something you look forward too.

Another good thing about the Z products is that the less you use the better they work. For me this was hard to get used to. However, now I've learned to use very little product which speeds things up and makes the system pretty cost effective over time.

The car always beads water like crazy. I guess I should add that I have no affiliation with Zaino and if someone can point me to something better I'd gladly give that a shot.

I have lots of different car care products right now for both interior and exterior detailing. Zaino's line continues to impress me in most areas. Their tire dressing is real good too as long as you haven't used a silicone product on them before and their glass and plastic polishes work well too. I wasn't all that impressed with their real first attempt at a true polish (Z-PC) but maybe that's just because the Menzerna line works so well for me.

Good luck and a couple more pics just for fun!

[Vipergrün]

I second Wil, Dry Wash is simply awesome stuff. I do not recall who, but someone on the boards distributes it.... I use to use it on my Black Metallic paint and it did a really great job.

[village idiot]

Wow, both cars have gorgeous finishes kilodawg, what color is that?? It's unusual but very cool

[Vipergrün]

Originally posted by village idiot
Wow, both cars have gorgeous finishes kilodawg, what color is that?? It's unusual but very cool

5 bucks on Rosewood Metallic

[bigchillcar]

socal..is that a picture of your hood? good grief i've stared at it for a long time trying to figure out what i'm seeing. whatever you did, it must have worked..the damn car seems to have disappeared!
ryan

[village idiot]

Originally posted by bb80sc
5 bucks on Rosewood Metallic

whatever it is, I like it

[crashmy911]

try using liquid glass from pep boys that looks good too. The more coats you put the deeper and more luster.

[Wil Ferch]

bb80sc ( Brad):

Brad... I told ya.... this topic takes on "religious" proportions....it seems we are in the minority..but it doesn't mean we're wrong.....

Any wax, no matter how good it is...will eventually cause a wax build-up and may yellow. Maybe not these guys since they do it so often. Often, you need to occasuonaly strip old wax before the next application. Why the extra work? The Dri-Wash was a tip I got from a high-end local body shop... it was found to be safe to use fairly quickly after work was done to cars... the more it's used on a particular car, the better the results...and no wax build up.

I noticed that the Gunnar Racing web site ( with those *awesome* restorations) ...showed Dri-Wash in a recent build-up thread they had too !!

I didn't post pics, but my car ( and others done with Dri-Wash) compare favorably to he pics shown....

Oh well....

Wil