Nitrous Oxide System With Webers?

Ok, I hope some of you "purists" don't flame me on this one

But anyways I want to get a little more power out of my 912. It already has a few mods, (headers, dual webers, K&N's, etc.) but it's still rather weak. I am thinking about trying to get a 40-50hp Nitrous oxide system for the car. Problem is I'm not very smart when it comes to adapting a N2O kit to a car with Webers carbs. Anyone know how this would be done? Would I mount 1 jet in each intake runner or what? I really have no idea and not many people seem to have done this so that makes it even harder to find out

Also has anyone ever ridden in a 911 or 912 with Nitrous Oxide? If so what did you think?

No to both questions ... no expertise with N2O, either. A couple of cautions, though ... a 912 is NOT the engine to be playing around that kind of fire with, IMHO! It has what I would call a 'marginal' crankshaft when normally carbureted turning above 6000 rpm. You could, of course get a set of '1750' pistons and cylinders ...

Just one observation, 356 parts and rebuild prices are INSANE!!! An article a couple of years ago chronicling a one-owner 912 rebuilt a couple of times, most recently at a cost of $13K ... just for the engine!

So, if you want to play with power increases, my suggestion would be to SELL that goldmine under your decklid, and invest in a monster 3.4 liter Type 4 VW engine, essentially updating your engine to '76 912E specs without the 'E' part! About 160 to 180 hp in a streetable Type IV is reasonable, but not cheap, and certainly more 'modern,' and significantly beefier, and easier to get parts for than what is under your decklid now. Remember, Type IV engines are readily available at junk yards everywhere (almost) in the tail of VW Buses post-1970 ... just don't tell the junkyard people what you want to put it in, or you risk a 'mysterious' price escalation!

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa

How hard would it be to install a Type IV? I heard the transmission bolt pattern and all is the same. What all would need to be done to the car to drop in like a turnkey Type IV?

I haven't done that conversion, but have worked on a number of Type 4 VW buses and 914's, so bear that in mind. Bolting up is no problem ... and neither is the clutch, the biggest problem would be fitting/modifying the engine sheet metal/tin to fit the 912 engine compartment and fabricating the rear engine mount. Of course, if you could find an engine fire 'donor' from a 912E ... your problems would be trivial! And, a 914 could provide you with plenty of transaxle parts and engine parts for a 'song,' too! There is a '71 914 for sale here locally for roughly half the going price of a used Beetle! The 914 is $1800 (asking) and Beetles typically go for $3500 here!

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa

I would probably enjoy the car for what it is right now (a good car ) and keep my eyes open for another car (911) that has a bit more pep.
As Warren points out you may end up with an expensive pile of metal. I think that the detonation potential associated with NOS is greater with an air cooled eng over one that is water cooled (because it will heat up much quicker and will not cool back down as fast) so caution should be observed here. However, if you are still bent on the idea then NOS (the Company) can help you out with the jetting of a custom 4 cylinder direct port injection setup (4 nozzles that you will plumb yourself) but it is my guess that a 40-50hp kick will break things (due to the power "shock" that it will bring) and in the end you will be more unhappy.

Good luck

steve

Yea I'd sure like to try about a 50hp setup. It would definitaly be fun in such a light car. I'll call up NOS and talk to them and see what they say.

I am with Warren on this one. I have 25 years experience with hi performance air cooled mods, including nitrous oxide.
The 912 engine is not the engine to playing with, the rods are very weak and so are the crank shaft. You are asking for a big mess.
You need to get a type 4 engine or possible a type 1 engine. I have a buddy of mine that put a type 1 vw engine in a early 70's 912.
The engine makes about 200 hp on weber carbs, and is way steetable and realible.
The motors will bolt up, the starter are the same, clutch and flywheel I don't know about but, it will work. Sheet metal will be a project but it will work. I would run a big cc vw engine, on low compression, giving you 200 horse or easy.
Nitrious oxide is a great thing, but very hard on bearings, also wants to blow the heads off.
Good luck
DRD 85 Carrera

Just one last note about the 356 engine history ... the 912 and its' predecessors:

The 912 crank shares it crank main bearing journal size and spacing with the VW 25 hp engine of 1938 ... and 36 hp engines up through 1959. VW went to a beefier design in the 1961 Type 1 engine that has been so successfully hot-rodded over the past 35 years or so. The Type IV engine is even stronger, and cranks for it are available that use small block Chevy rods ... not known for their weakness! The 356/912 engine has has reliability problems anytime owners have tried to stretch any more hp than the factory's own limit of 95 DIN hp achieved is the early '60s ... then backed off to the 90 DIN hp level in the 912! If I am not mistaken ... I believe I read a couple of years back that 912 replacement cranks cost more than some 911 cranks ... so be warned that you are treading over some VERY expensive waters when searching for that extra 40-50 hp ...

If you are looking for better acceleration through the gears, primarily, my suggestion would be to go to PowerHaus II and look at their gear choices for the 901 transaxle ...
http://www.phII.net/

There is a 6:29 (4.88:1) ring and pinion available, and over 30 different gears available to choose from for 1st to 5th ... check this thread for some ideas:
http://www.pelicanparts.com/ultimate/Forum3/HTML/001192.html

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa

[This message has been edited by Early_S_Man (edited 04-24-2000).]

Ok Ok guys I'll take your advice then and I won't put my lilttle 912 on Nasal Spray!

I guess i should just enjoy the car for what it is until I get the money for either a nice 911SC or a nice 911 motor to put in this 912

And I'll look into the gears and see what all I can do. Thanks for all the info guys!

PartsHeaven has a 912E with an engine in it ... check this out:
http://www.partsheaven.com/wrecks_pass_2.html

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa