Inexpensive Carrera Speed & Reference Sensor alternative?
 

I just got this in a competitor's email:
I replaced mine both last year, and the cheapest I found was roughly twice the price of these sensors. Can anyone confirm if they are/ are not the compatible with the 911 sensors? They sure look to be identical.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1172593523.jpg

At this price, it may actually be worth it for Carrera 3.2 owners to keep a spare or two on hand for strandings.

Interesting. I wonder what engines they are made to fit originally?

HI try a BMW E30 but I forget which engine M20???.

regards mike

I was looking at these when I recently changed my cyl head temp sensor. Can they be replaced with the engine in the car?

HI yes if you can get them out of the holder, if not you will have to re set the gap with a old one and glue a 0.8mm washer to the bottom to set the gap between the flywheel ring gear and the sensor.

regards mike

Yes. There is a BMW replacement part that you can use instead of the original Porsche part.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-used-parts-sale-wanted/312465-wtb-3-2-flywheel-sensors.html

I recently replaced my sensors and tried to get confirmation from Bosch that the BMW parts were the same, or at least compatible. The sensors look identical in the photos, but I couldn't get anyone to to say that they are interchangable.

This is a copy of my email and the reply from Bosch:

7806010230

Ref#2212451

James
Thank you for your inquiry, although both sensors are used by Porsche Bosch Germany does not list these two parts as interchangeable.


Regards, Mike C.
Bosch Automotive Technical Support

************************************************** ********

Can you tell me if the BMW reference sensor # 0 261 210 002 and the Porsche reference sensor # 0 261 210 005 are interchangeable?

Thank you,
James Garfield

************************************************** **********



Someone at Pelican thought that the resistance might be different, but he wasn't sure...he suggested that I check with Bosch.
When push came to shove and I actually had to buy the parts I chickened out and went with the Porsche parts, as I didn't want to have a couple hundred dollars worth of unreturnable sensors that didn't work. If someone has actually used the BMW sensors I would really be interested as the savings is substantial.

Awesome information... wish I'd known this before going through my 22 page no start ordeal. I ended replaced two of the three sensors... one of them looks just like the above photo. I'd love to replace the other while I'm thinking about it... spare would be nice too. Where, where, where?

-Troy

Jay Auskalnis has purchased these BMW sensors and will be installing them. I will follow up with the results.

My gut feeling is they're fine. They're a simple reference sensor, much like an ABS sensor. They simply detect the motion of the flywheel teeth and the set screw in the flywheel. Although simple they may be, they aren't cheap! :D

Mike, are there any tips to getting the old sensors out or is it simply get a good grip on them with pliers and start yanking, hopefully not damaging the mounting bracket?
TIA

HI if the sensors are that tight, remove the bracket and ither warm with a heat gun or freeing fluid, your PB blaster, WD40, plus gass, then fit a washer to the old sensor to set up the bracket again.

regards mike

Any update on this? I need a pair of these...soon.

BUMP.
Anyone have the results on this? It just so happens my reference sensor bit the dust over the weekend. Now I need to order a replacement & would really like to $ave. Thanks!

There is another thread on this where guys have confirmed that the parts for the BMW are functionally identical, and maybe the only difference is a slightly longer cable.

I'll see if I can find it, but from what I recall, there's nothing more to follow up on - they work!

The BMW ones worked for me.. I replaced both, the engine started just fine, my car is not drivable yet but I don't think that makes a difference. The fact it started means the BMW sensors worked.

Excellent! Thanks for the info.

Just to clarify...the gap is adjusted based on the bracket's installation...not how far you put the sensor into the bracket...correct?
Buck

That is correct. The sensor is installed on the bracket via an allen bolt and the bracket has oblong holes to adjust the gap on the tip of the sensor against the flywheel.

Got a no-start problem and diagnosed to be a bad reference sensor by checking at DME connector pins 25-26 and at the sensor connector in engine compartment.
Replaced both reference and speed sensors with BMW ones from Pelican, part # 12-14-1-708-619-M14. They worked just fine and the length of the cable was a good fit, no need to make a loop.

Also replaced the original CHT sensor with a newer two-lead one. Cut the old cable off and used a 13mm box wrench to get the sensor off. The new one fits a 14mm wrench but can be turned in just by hand and slightly tightened with a plier, no special tool needed to really tighten it as it likely will not loosen easily thanks to the rigid cable being held by two grommets.

Thank you guys for the great info!!

Ed Hughes mentioned that he used the BMW sensors as well in his recent rebuild and as far as I know they worked fine.
I'll be doing the same thing shortly on the top end for my '88, although as far as I know the old ones were working fine.

Troy, you mentioned that you have already replaced two of the 3 sensors? Two sensors are the same part #, the speed and reference sensor, the other sensor is the TDC sensor, and it is only used for diagnostic test equipment, it does nothing as far as the operation of the engine, like the speed and reference sensors do. It could be removed, and your engine would not know the difference with it or without it.

Sorry to resurect this thread but any adverse effects on alternative BMW sensors? My Connectors have crumbled and need to be replaced.

No adverse effects so far.

Since they are just sending impulses to the DME for ignition timing there should be no other problems as long as the engine can start and runs on.

The new connectors also make the engine compartment look way better than did those cracked old ones with black silicone glue around the bracket.

Found two sites selling them for $57 USD.

Has anyone compared the signal outputs on these two (versions) WITH an o-scope?

just curious as to waveform similarities..

Thanx!

Except for the extra length, would the signal vary if all remaining components are identical? Please edify

Where did ya find em for $57.00

Update:

The BMW Sensors is maybe less than 1/2 inch longer.

Note: removing the Reference sensor is easy enough due to the fact it is housed by a sleeve and slipped right out. However the Speed sensor does not have the housing and on mine it siezed and could not be removed so I had to remove the bracket to physically tear out the sensor.

If you do not have to replace the speed sensor, don't.

It appears heat has expanded mine and made it impossible to remove by hand.

The sensors are liken to a light bulb, if you twist the sensors to install them you will most likely damage the new sensor, like a light bulb, twisting the bulb beyond it's limits will twist and break the filament wires. Once damamged you will not be able to start your baby.

After 10 hours, I finally gave up and brought it to my wrench and he figured out that I damaged the Speed sensor. He placed a known good one and wouldn't you know it it started right up. Expensive Lessen Learned.

The unsure purchase.....there seems to be several listing of various BMW fits to this part number, 12-14-1-708-619-M14. Anyone have a recomendation or are they all the same.

1984 911 3.2 ref sensor replacement w/bmw part #.

Thanks, Dave

I simply ordered two BMW 12-14-1-708-619-M14 sensors from Pelican. They've worked perfectly for over a year on my 911.

One of my friends is one who confirmed to our local group that the BMW sensors work.

Our cross-reference search yielded the original Bosch part number: 0 261 210 002 which appears to be from E24 635, E24 735, E28 535, E28 533 BMW models. See page 16 of this Bosch application manual

http://apps.bosch.com.au/products/sa...on_modules.pdf.

On Pelicanparts, this equates to the sensor for 535 cars from 1985-1988 and 533 cars from 1983-1984 which is BMW part number 12-14-1-708-619-M14

These sensors are working great (been going strong in Jay's car for two years now), the plugs are the same. So there is no need to buy the Porsche part number!

Great, thanks for the follow up...ordered 12-14-1-708-619-m14 from out host.

I have used that BMW sensor in the 84-89 Carrera they plug right in! They seem to be the same part as the Porsche part just different number. Will work just fine.

Where can I find some instructions on replacing these sensors, I'm in a no start situation on my Carrera and have already replaced the DME relay as well as checked the fuel pump relay so running out of options to get this thing going. Right now not getting any noiuse for the fuel pump but not sure when it is supposed to make noise, is this when the engine is cranking or when the key is turned to the on position.

Pump comes on engine cranking, put a test light on the fuel pump fuse while cranking the test light must come on. The fuse is in the front trunk fuse block. You can also jumper 12V to this fuse to be sure the pump runs.

911 1985 won't start after engin wash
 

My 1985 911 was working fine, until I washed the engine, now it won't start. Replaced the DME realy, checked the connections to the timing position and speed sensors, and they are worn but seem to be working.

The car will only start in hi idle for a minute in fast idle, the it slows down and starts failing, if I disconnect the Head Temperature Sensor.

Any ideas???

first thing I would do is check your distributor cap and plug wire connectors for moisture, and completely dry them off....this happens frequently with our cars.

If this doesn't do the trick, unplug your CHT sensor again and jumper the connector (not the sensor) with a paper clip. If your car continues to run while jumpered, you've found your problem.

the BMW part is 900 ohm vs 1000 for the Porsche. It makes no difference as long as the ecu sees it.

Micker,

Thanks for the info - so, that is apparently a meaningless difference?

Kurt,

No, i have worked with many different setups, and my experience is that sensors in the 4-500 ohm range are quite sensitive to correct gap settings. The "weak" sensors don't like to be further than 0.5mm away.