Harness Question

I've started participating in track events, and would like to install a 5 or 6 point harness in my car. I've found a fellow selling a harness and harness bar, and was talking to him about the set up today. The only reason I didn't seal the deal then and there was he told me I'd be giving up the rear seat belts. My daughter loves to ride in the car, and I'd hate to give that up for the harnesses. She is getting bigger all the time, and will eventually be too large for this to be feasible, but I'm hoping there is some way I can accomodate the harness and the rear seat belts.

Anyone have any ideas/suggestions, or similar experience???

Chuck
'94 C2

You dont have to give up the rears. You can attach both of them at the same point. The rear passengers will have to contend with the front belts being attached there as well. In some cases a longer attaching bolt is needed.

With my bar/harness, I just put it in for track events, and take the bar and top two straps out (leaving the lower three straps down on the floor) for all other days.

It's five minute's work, with a total of two bolts, and they don't need to be torqued any more than finger tight.

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Jack Olsen
1973 911 T (3.6) sunroof coupe

I would get a removable bar if you plan to put kids in the back. It would be difficult for them to get in and out around the bar, also it is potentially dangerous. From the looks of my bar it may be possible for a child to hit his/her face on the bar if you brake suddenly and they aren't properly belted in.

Chuck - -
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A more expensive option than a harness bar is Brey Krause's harness truss. The shoulder belts can be attached directly to the truss, rather than using the rear seat belt mounting points. The truss is far stronger - in our local PCA chapter, it is the only harness bar from which shoulder belts can be mounted directly. With four bolts, the truss comes out in 5 minutes.
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check out: http://www.enter.net/~breykrause/homeharn.html
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Chuck
83SC

Thanks for all the input!

Jack, what brand harnesses and bar did you pick up, and where did you get them? Sounds like your setup would work well for my needs.

Chuck

What's a good source for a harness bar? I never, ever use the rear seats, but I'd like to be able to remove a bar for my daily driver use. Jack, what're you using?

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Mark Szabo
1986 911 Targa 3.2
1987 Escort 5-speed 1.9
The Porsche Owners Gallery

Autopower makes a 4 point bar that has a removable diagonal harness attachment / seatback protector that bolts out. It cost about $400 including shipping, about $100 less then the Brey-Krause truss.I went through the same dilemma with my 3 small kids. My wife and my car have, lets say, a mutual understanding. Being that my kids enjoy in riding it was a big part of our happy family. When I mentioned that I was going to put in a roll bar, her first question was, " Where are the kids going to sit?" This bar was the only one that I felt could stay in and still use the back seats. Make sure to differentiate between a true bar/cage and Harness guide bars. Guide bars offer no rollover protection and actually keep your body erect as your roof caves in.

Unless you are going to alter or change your seats, go with 4 points. I have 5 point in mine but I have a pass through. A lap belt that does not go straight down but is pulled forward over the edge of the seat is not how it is designed. It is actually pulling your other harness's away from your body.

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8 9 9 1 1, The last of the line.

I have kids, and no harness bar. If this were reversed, I'd leave the bar in the car. Using the same principle, if I were buying X-large condoms, I'd tell the clerk I don't need a bag.

Dreaming on both counts.

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'83 SC

I apologize for not responding to this sooner. I have a Weltmeister 1 1/2 inch bar that bolts into the B pillars -- you just undo the bolt for the shoulder straps, and bolt them back in with the harness bar mounted.

Here's what it looks like mounted in a 911 (not my 911, but it's the bar I got).



I think Performance sells them.

Here's a step-by-step page I saw on Rennlist today for a bar and harness.

http://www.feulner.homestead.com/harness.html

Hope that helps.


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Jack Olsen
1973 911 T (3.6) sunroof coupe

[This message has been edited by JackOlsen (edited 01-14-2001).]

Thanks Jack!

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http://home.earthlink.net/~cgrieb/index.html

Jack, Looks like that person in the picture mounted to the harness bar. Like Chuck said the Truss Bar is the only one approved for that type of connection. I am still not comfortable with the idea of belts holding me upright in the seat without a rollbar or cage. But, after driving one "caged" car on the street for a number of years -- it seemed to me that a roll bar is far safer for the street (and mounting the belts). Still pondering the solution.

Alan
83SC
(and one of the intrepic tech inspectors from Chuck's region)