Short Shift Bad For Rebuilt 915?

[Uber-fanatic]

Just had a rebuilt 915 installed in my car, and my mechanic frowned upon my desire to install a factory short shift kit...his logic being that after a few thousand miles the trans would be 'broken in', and then potentially ready for the additional strain that the short shift kit places on the transmission. Is this true? I don't see how, shifting with normal effort in everyday driving, a short shift kit would be more taxing on the tranny. Any thoughts?

Thanks...

[Mr.Puff]

http://www.pca.org/tech/tech_qa_area.asp?id=7&classification=Transmission&startat=26

Short shifters are harder on the synchros. Your mechanic might be worried about you shifting too fast; i.e. if you forget that your throw is shorter.

[john walker's workshop]

the fact that the lever below the pivot point is longer, makes the shift sleeve move over the friction syncro ring faster than the factory designed it to. this happens with you shifting it no differently or faster than normal on the shift knob end. it basically doesn't give the syncro assembly quite as much time to match gear speeds for a smooth shift. i don't like them either, whether on my rebuild jobs or just normal driving. they just feel kind of wrong.

[Uber-fanatic]

Originally Posted by john walker's workshop

they just feel kind of wrong.

That is EXACTLY what he said as we discussed it (and he made the appropriately screwed-up funny face at the same time )

Thanks for the confirmation...

[toddu]

Maybe a stupid question, but why then did the factory offer these?

Todd

[Wayne 962]

For transmission life, I'm not a huge fan of them. That said, I have one in my 1972 RS clone, simply because the transmission throw seemed so large in that car. The short shift kit was installed (if I recall correctly) on all of the 915 Carrera cars straight from the factory, so it is a factory-approved part. The installation of the kit reduces your shifting precision, if you shift slowly (as I usually do), and ease the gears into their position, waiting for the synchros to mesh, then it shouldn't make too much of a difference. But if you slam gears together, it will indeed put more wear on the transmission.

-Wayne

[jhynesrockmtn]

Do the Rennshift or Wevo shifters treat the synchros any better than the factory short shifter?

I've got the factory short shifter in my track car and a standard shifter in the other. I love the throw on the SS but it definately feels harder on the 1-2 shift than the other car. The tranny is rebuilt on the track car and I don't want to put undue strain on it.

[Mr.Puff]

I fixed my link. Click on short shifter from the list (the first question).

http://www.pca.org/tech/tech_qa_area.asp?id=7&classification=Transmission&startat=26

[Britwrench]

I have put the original type shifter back in race cars as the drivers did not like the Porsche short shift "feel"

[jhynesrockmtn]

I love the "feel" of the short shifter and also have a Seine gate shift kit in the car. Makes for a very precise experience vs. stock. But, it makes the shift into second on this tranny more difficult and it's a rebuilt unit done by Chris Powell who is referenced on the PCA link. I spent a ton of time getting it adjusted right.

Britwrench drove my car when I had the PPI done, before I swapped over the shifter which was previously in my other SC. I'm either going to the WEVO or will put the standard shifter in and retain the Seine kit. I've missed the 3-2 shift not wanting to force it a couple times in this car on the track at Pacific Raceways last summer going down a steep hill and had to take the escape road :-)

[Mr.Puff]

Yeah, with my stock 915 I usually skip second gear .

[john walker's workshop]

the other thing the SS does is increase the effort required to shift. standard physics. the fulcrum principle. there is another way out, but you probably would laugh. sure shifts nice though.
the amazing "long" shifter

[Mr.Puff]

I want that link O_O.

[nyne11]

I was considering a SS for my 86 but from what you are saying it will already have one as standard equipment from the factory?
How do I check?

Originally Posted by Wayne at Pelican Parts

For transmission life, I'm not a huge fan of them. That said, I have one in my 1972 RS clone, simply because the transmission throw seemed so large in that car. The short shift kit was installed (if I recall correctly) on all of the 915 Carrera cars straight from the factory, so it is a factory-approved part. The installation of the kit reduces your shifting precision, if you shift slowly (as I usually do), and ease the gears into their position, waiting for the synchros to mesh, then it shouldn't make too much of a difference. But if you slam gears together, it will indeed put more wear on the transmission.

-Wayne

[Mr.Puff]

I thought the 85 or 86 and on had a shorter shifter installed, but that a short shifter would still remove about 10%. Before then it was something like 25%. (I could be blowing wind out my ass... can't remember where I read this).

[ischmitz]

I had a short-shift kit in my 74 for a while and got rid of it again for two reasons: One, it developed a terrible rattle because the lever ball was not fully extending into the cup of the shift rod. I believe mine wasn't the factory design but the Weltmeister design if I remember correctly. I tried everything and finally out of frustration yanked it out. The other reason is that it didn't quite feel right. I actually like the longer throw of the stock shifter.

MikeK has the Wevo gate shifter that also has a much shorter throw plus the gating. It is a nice piece of engineering. But again even if the price wasn't that high I'd still prefer the stock shifter. It simply "feels" period-correct.

[javadog]

Originally Posted by Mr.Puff

I thought the 85 or 86 and on had a shorter shifter installed, but that a short shifter would still remove about 10%. Before then it was something like 25%. (I could be blowing wind out my ass... can't remember where I read this).

Basically, the standard shifter in 1985 and 1986 had a 10% shorter throw than the shifters up to that point. The bend in the lever was also a little different. A short throw shifter was optional from 1985 that gave throws 25% shorter than the original '73-'84 shifters and approximately 15% shorter than the standard shifter of the same year.

JR

[Mr.Puff]

Yeah, my ass was flappin a bit.

I know what ya mean ischmitz . I'm just going to install a shift gate.

By chance, does anyone know what this is:

http://www.***************/productpage.aspx?cid=21&sid=302&pid=105168

?

[911pcars]

That kit was/is manufactured by Target, an equivalent of a WM short shift. The new ball section replaces the lower portion of the factory shift lever (it's only glued together). The aluminum block spaces the shift tube downward an amount equivalent to the increased distance below the lever pivot point so the shift assembly doesn't bind. The WM accomplishes the same effect by instead positioning the shift housing higher an equivalent amount.

At a claimed throw reduction of 40%, it's about the same as the WM unit @ 39%, so it provides the same loss of leverage and the same notchier feel compared to the stock or the factory short shifter (0 and 25%, respectively).

I suggest using either the regular or the factory short shifter and to not rush the shifts between gears. I also recommend double-clutching along with whatever type of shift lever system used.

Sherwood

[Joe Bob]

Originally Posted by ischmitz

I had a short-shift kit in my 74 for a while and got rid of it again for two reasons: One, it developed a terrible rattle because the lever ball was not fully extending into the cup of the shift rod. I believe mine wasn't the factory design but the Weltmeister design if I remember correctly. I tried everything and finally out of frustration yanked it out. The other reason is that it didn't quite feel right. I actually like the longer throw of the stock shifter.

MikeK has the Wevo gate shifter that also has a much shorter throw plus the gating. It is a nice piece of engineering. But again even if the price wasn't that high I'd still prefer the stock shifter. It simply "feels" period-correct.

That's Mike"Z" ya dumkopf....anyways, a 915 is NOT designed for fast shifting. Even though I have a short throw, I shift slowly. I remember how much my rebuild cost....