Top End Estimate Advice

autovon · 11-09-2007, 10:23 AM

I'll try to keep this short. I bought my '87 Cab back in May with 79K miles on the clock, and she started smoking pretty bad over the course of the last few months (I've put about 4K miles on her). From what I learned in this forum, the smoke suggested bad valve guides. I took her to RPM in Lorton, VA, and Stan ran the diagnostics. It came back with great leak down numbers, but the valve guides do need replacing. He estimates it will be an $8K job.

The good news is that I purchased one of those aftermarket warranties with the car for $1K, and the warranty company is going to cover $4,700 of the cost. They don't cover diagnostics, fluids, tax, they only pay $70/hr for labor (who the heck charges only $70/hr these days... Stan charges $110/hr), and their "books" say the job should take 25.5 hrs, not the 40 hrs Stan is saying the job will take. I suppose I should be thankful they are not trying to weasel their way out of paying, and I am.

My question revolves around the estimate I'm getting from Stan. I've seen others write about top end jobs costing in the neighborhood of $7K, and I know it is hard to tell me if $8K is fair without seeing an estimate of parts/labor (I'll get that next week and post it for your review), but what is your feeling with my general situation? I do trust Stan at RPM, have heard nothing but good things from others, and have had good results with him in the past. I know I've left this a bit open-ended but would enjoy hearing any comments you may have. Thanks!

Bill

mca · 11-09-2007, 10:33 AM

Did you get the car from Victory Motorcars per chance? Just curious ...

I had roughly the same quote for my top end. That estimate did not include new pistons/cylinders ... just refurbing them. I would guess that the range would be from $6k to $10k depending on what happens once she is opened up.

Maybe you should fight for some extra duckets?

Best of luck and let us know what happens.

autovon · 11-09-2007, 10:42 AM

I would fight for them paying more, but they told me that technically they don't have to pay anything b/c the car has aftermarket exhaust, and the fine, fine, fine print states the same thing. And they told me that future fixes might not be covered if I don't switch back to stock exhaust (haven't decided what to do on that one). So b/c of that, I feel fortunate and might not push the issue.

autovon · 11-09-2007, 10:43 AM

Oh yeah, and I bought it and the warranty from Car Connections USA in Westchester, PA. Why do you ask?

Super_Dave_D · Super_Dave_D's Garage

I am 200 miles into my top end.

Top End Estimate - Need a review

Dont pay any attention to my origional estimate - I fell down the slippery slope fast!!!

autovon · 11-09-2007, 11:00 AM

Super Dave, I was actually talking about your thread when I mentioned it in my original post. Great info, and are you glad you did the powdercoating? Can you tell a big difference in engine power and responsiveness? Do you find yourself smiling for no reason when driving her? Convince me to take the plunge, brother!!!

autovon · 11-09-2007, 11:02 AM

And my leakdown numbers were great, so I might not even mess with rings. How much of an extra expense were they (parts and labor)?

Super_Dave_D · Super_Dave_D's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by autovon

Super Dave, I was actually talking about your thread when I mentioned it in my original post. Great info, and are you glad you did the powdercoating? Can you tell a big difference in engine power and responsiveness? Do you find yourself smiling for no reason when driving her? Convince me to take the plunge, brother!!!

Dude if you’re going to keep it – why not go ahead and get it done. I was burning a lot of oil so it had to happen. I did the powder coating kind of on a whim because I wanted it to look pretty too – its not needed but it sure is nice to look at. I am only 200 miles in the break in period so I’m not smiling that much – actually kind of aggravated because I can feel she wants to go but I must obtain. I can say that I no longer smoke like crazy and it runs like a champ. If you want to see my total end bill, I will gladly send it to you. Mine ran close to 8k because of the powder coating (only $400) and the speed sensors, head temp tensor, and the guy replace almost every nut, bolt and fastener on the engine (went a tad overboard). Yes I am Happy!!! DO IT!!!

Super_Dave_D · Super_Dave_D's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by autovon

And my leakdown numbers were great, so I might not even mess with rings. How much of an extra expense were they (parts and labor)?

In the grand scheme of things - rings are cheap!

MBEngineering · 11-09-2007, 12:40 PM

HI Bill
just a bit of useless info from a far, the time of 40hr is about right, for a good job on a top-end , to include rings and a full head job, as for the !!

"who the heck charges only $70/hr these days..."

I charge £36/ hr =$75.83 at todays rate for your info, if you would like to ship the engine over I would gladly do the repair for you

gabenheimer · 11-09-2007, 12:40 PM

I had to take my engine out in order to replace a bad clutch. While I had it out I too went down the slippery slope of "while I'm in there." I ultimately had the heads done, replaced the P&Cs, and of course the clutch. My shop charged me about $900 to rebuild the heads and cam towers. I did the rest of the engine disassembly and assembly myself. Fortunately I have a well equipped garage and could do this work at home in my spare time. All in, I've spent around $3,500 on the top end rebuild.

Neilk · 11-09-2007, 12:52 PM

I thought the book rate for an engine rebuild was 40 hours?

JBO · 11-09-2007, 01:22 PM

Heck, a rebuilt engine for about 3k out of pocket 6 months after buying an 80k mile car sounds like a pretty good deal to me. However, if its an extra car and you can let the mechanic work it in as time allows, he will probably give you a better deal.

autovon · 11-10-2007, 09:46 AM

Super Dave, that would be great if you could send me a copy of your final bill; I would feel better having something in hand when talking to my mech. I appreciate all the feedback from everyone. And if there are any Marines out there, Happy Birthday!!!

Super_Dave_D · Super_Dave_D's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by autovon

Super Dave, that would be great if you could send me a copy of your final bill; I would feel better having something in hand when talking to my mech. I appreciate all the feedback from everyone. And if there are any Marines out there, Happy Birthday!!!

PM me your email address

autovon · 11-10-2007, 08:26 PM

pm sent. Thanks Dave

Jeff Alton · 11-10-2007, 09:21 PM

It is hard to comment on the estimate with out seeing how it breaks down. But there is 4400 in labour alone so that only leaves 3600 for parts. Sort through the Pelican Catalouge and decide if you are overpaying..........

I need to charge more!

Cheers

autovon · 11-11-2007, 09:19 AM

Just wanted to give you guys some pics of El Gato Blanco. Happy VD!!!

mgbruno · 01-04-2008, 09:54 AM

Hi Bill,
I've got an 84 cab with only about 55K on the engine. I've had it for about 3 years and after replacing the oil return tubes which were leaking like a sieve, I've been monitoring the oil consumption. Well, I seem to be burning a quart every 1000 miles and maybe less. I have to monitor a little more. So, I'm thinking that a valve job isn't too far out for me either. Aiyyyyyy! Thats in addition to my other woes - laugh. So, did you get the work done yet and if so, who did you decide to go with? I'm in Northern Va (Lake Ridge) as well!

Dueller · 01-04-2008, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mgbruno

Hi Bill,
I've got an 84 cab with only about 55K on the engine. I've had it for about 3 years and after replacing the oil return tubes which were leaking like a sieve, I've been monitoring the oil consumption. Well, I seem to be burning a quart every 1000 miles and maybe less. I have to monitor a little more. So, I'm thinking that a valve job isn't too far out for me either. Aiyyyyyy! Thats in addition to my other woes - laugh. So, did you get the work done yet and if so, who did you decide to go with? I'm in Northern Va (Lake Ridge) as well!

If it ain't smoking (not counting a little on start up or when its been sitting a while), a quart every 1000 miles is well within factory specs. Unless you suddenly get down below a qt every 600 miles, a valve job is a long way off.