hot rod 911 vs hot rod 914-6

[micksbuddy]

I'd been looking for a 70-89 911 with a 3.2 or 3.6 but have been somewhat sidetracked by the idea of a hot rod 914-6 with anything between a 2.7 and a 3.2. For those of you that have both, or have driven both, which is more rewarding/satisfying to drive? (Primarily as a weekend street car with perhaps an occasional DE or autocross)

[TimT]

get both, thats what I did

[Fishcop]

Dave at TRE would be a good person to ask. He builds and drives both!

[rfuerst911sc]

I have a 911SC and I'm building a 914-/6 useing a 75 chassis and a 1978 3.0SC engine with Weber 40 carbs. I don't have the 914 done yet but here is what I expect. My 911 like most 911s is a great car,handles well,brakes well and is fun at autocross and DE events. Not a bad daily driver and it has ALL that Porsche heritage and history. Resale value and recouping what you invest in her you have a good chance of getting your money back. I got the 914 bug because at the autocross events I attend while I do quite well with the 911 there are Boxsters and Caymans that are generally 2-4 seconds faster. Now some of this is driver and some is car. And I'm not comparing apples to apples when one car is 1983 technology while the other is 2000 and newer technology. However they are mid-engined cars and that's when I decided to build a Boxster killer I have nothing against the Boxster or Cayman as a matter of fact a used Boxster is easily in the price range to purchase. I am however a lover of the air cooled engine. The sound,power and design are tough to beat. Right now I have about $9,000.00 wrapped up in the 914 build ( all work done by me ) and I'm guessing another $2,000.00 and I'll be on the road. I have done the metal GT flares,a fair amount of chassis stiffening, 911 front and rear 5 lug conversion, 911 M calipers/rotors on all four corners I fully expect this car to be fun I have no expectations of being the fastest guy at the track but I'll bet I'll be more competitive then I am now. I also don't expect many 911 owners to agree with me but that's O.K. This will probably be my last project car so I'm trying to do it right and I don't expect to get my money back out of the car if I ever decide to sell her, but to be honest I expect to keep the 911 and 914 for a long time, they can coexist in harmony

[Quicksilver]

Their is a guy locally with a Motronic 3.5L in a 914. (100mm cans in a 3.2L) The best description is pucker up and hold on for dear life.

All other things being equal (suspension prep and other goodies) a 914 will be faster if it has the same engine as a 911 because it is lighter, has a lower CG, and has less frontal area. The upside of a 911 is that you can fit inside the thing and if looks better!

[Maluminse]

Weight
The 76 911 is lighter than a 914:


914 - 2892 pounds
http://vista.pca.org/stl/914.htm

911 - 1140 kg - 2513 pounds
http://www.sikhworld.co.uk/Porsche%20911/Porsche911page8.html

The 71 911 is 2314 pounds which is considerably lighter.


Height
911 is 4.3 ft high
914 is 4.18 ft high
(same sources)

However given there almost the same height I would think the 911 would be faster based on this alone given its aerodynamic shape over the boxy 914.



I dont see how the 914 could be faster than a 911 given the above. The 914 might handle better given its mid engine.

[911quest]

The 914 makes an excellent platform for racing I have owned a real six...and if I were to pick the one for daily driving I would go with the 911 now the 914/6 will out handle the 911 but it does make for a rougher ride just my thoughts.

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by Maluminse

914 - 2892 pounds

better recheck your sources...
cause a 914 is about 1000# lighter

[Grady Clay]

I agree, the 914-6 is significantly lighter.
My ’68 SWB 911 coupe weighs 2220# and my ‘street’ original 914-6 weighs just under 2000# with still full interior but minus some items in the front trunk. It has the 5.5x15 Mahle 10-spoke wheels – the lightest road wheel Porsche ever sold.

My race 914-6 (also an original six and raced since new) weighs about 1760# but is ballasted up to SCCA legal weight.

I agree that a well prepared 914-6 (even conversions) are great fun and a real Porsche “Wolf-in-Sheep’s-clothing”.

Let me tell you a story.

Many years ago I drove to Boulder from Denver to pick up an Airedale puppy. With this ‘fuz-ball in my lap, I headed back to Denver. On 28th there was this guy in a ‘big’ Ferrari (5.0, 12-cyl) making an a$$ of himself trying (unsuccessfully) to advance through heavy traffic. Once on the Turnpike things thinned out.

For those that know the road, around the Louisville exits there is a down-hill, a long (2 mi) flat stretch and then an up-hill. We came over the rise to the down-hill and remarkably there wasn’t a single car in sight. I was off his left rear, studying his exhaust. Needless to say he took the bait. By the up-hill I was about 20 car lengths ahead. Nothing like a well tuned 2.8S, MFI, 11.5:1 CR. Asleep in my lap, ‘Targa’ never noticed.

The story gets better.

A couple of days later John Barker (a noted Denver tuner) called and asked if I had been on the Turnpike that day. It seems the Ferrari owner had immediately gone to his shop and demanded a ‘tune up’ because this ‘VW’ had beat him.

The ‘Wolf’ was nipping at the heels of the “Prancing horse”.

There are more stories.


Everything considered, a well prepared 914-6 is great fun and a great addition to 911 ownership. There are many on this forum and the 914 forums who can advise for all the details. The real key is the light weight of a 914-6 and the mid-engine configuration. The significantly longer wheelbase (compared to a 911) helps also. A LSD is absolutely necessary with a powerful engine and I use the 108 mm CV joints.

There are many more details and very few ‘secrets’. This is well developed technology.

Best,
Grady

[eapcpa]

Grady,

You forgot the disclaimer about "not advocating street racing and all these type activities should be conducted on a closed circuit with professional drivers etc. etc. etc, .
By the way I have never participated in a contest such as that, not even when the honda with the wheels, loud music and fart pipe...never mind. But then there was the time the 5.0 Mustang..

Cheers

[pwd72s]

Check PCA Parade autocross results of past years. More often than not, the top time of the event will go to a 914-6...modified.

[RSBob]

Top rides of my life 2005 GT2 and 71-914 with 2.7RS spec with full upgraded suspension and chassis stiffening. The GT2 took off like a possessed demon and braked with ungodly force. The 914 was equally stunning during acceleration, but it had one advantage, the wail of an air-cooled banshee right over your shoulder. The 914 with subtle fairs not only cornered well but power slid very predictably when provoked. I immediately went out and bought a 914 after that and have enjoyed it ever since.

The 914 is rapidly becoming 'the' car to hotrod - initial low cost to get into and then your wallet is your only limit.

[ZAMIRZ]

The beast:



Dave B's 914-6. With Dave behind the wheel, very very hard to hang with in the canyons.

[retrotech]

I'm in!
I have owned from Franz Blam, built 930 Turbo to 54 356 Outlaw, and everything in between. My 2000#, 2.8 914/6 is the most fun ride I have every owned, or driven. Its raw, its bare, and the engine is in the middle! Mine is therapy when I drive, and great DE car. It feels more like a Spyder, than a Boxster. I also have a 72-911, but no comparison for drive fun.

[BK911]

A modified 914-6 basically uses the same engine, brakes and suspension as a 911, but is lighter and mid-engine. Lighter means it handles, brakes and accelerates better. Mid-engine helps too. So just on paper I would say the 914-6 is the winner.

[J P Stein]

The 911 is a much better road car, IMO. I've had 2: an 82 SC and a 2.7L 73 T, but....when there is a knife fight, I show up with a gun. 1724 before ballast. .......

[84toy]

I have to chime in on this one......I own both. In my opinion the 911 is more comfortable on long trips and has the 911 look that's tough to beat. It ends there (for me). The 914 will out handle, out accelerate, more fun to drive and gives an overall more enjoyable experience....again, just my opinion.....read further....

You can follow the build in Excellence Magazine (the car is now finished but articles are not caught up).

I really don't like the heavy tail on the 911. While some can put it to good use, the rest of us on Sunday drives get into trouble since there is just not enough seat time to get good at it. The 914 can be driven hard and fast from the first day and just feels like a comfy shoe. It just handles so neutral and drives like a go kart.

The above weight is incorrect. My 914 with big brakes, spare tire, 3.6 motor and lots of luxury weighed in at 2200#'s. With a 95 3.6 engine it is quite fun to drive. It has a re-geared WEVO side shifted 915 capable of 53 mph in first gear. Once moving when you step on the gas, it's nothing short of exhilarating.

Now the truth.....I have a BUNCH of money in this car. You could easily build an equivalent 911 for what I have in it. However if you strip it down and remove the luxuries to keep it light, you now lose the big advantage of a 911 which is comfort and quiet (but get the nicer looks and rear engine)

On a final note....EVERY time I take out my 914 I get compliments. You just don't see a lot of nice ones so you are a minority. While I get compliments on the 911, it is 10% of the 914. Bottom line.....If you don't like the looks of a 914 (many don't) it's all a mute point.

A few pics for comparison.......

[RSBob]

Paul, just have to say is one freakin amazing looking teener. The GT flares on black is sensational. Very nice work. (Not that your @$$-dragger looks that bad either)

Now back to the one-sided debate already in progress

[nine11speedster]

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[shamrockcustoms]

Originally Posted by retrotech

I'm in!
I have owned from Franz Blam, built 930 Turbo to 54 356 Outlaw, and everything in between. My 2000#, 2.8 914/6 is the most fun ride I have every owned, or driven. Its raw, its bare, and the engine is in the middle! Mine is therapy when I drive, and great DE car. It feels more like a Spyder, than a Boxster. I also have a 72-911, but no comparison for drive fun.

This is a amazing looking car..would love to see the build photos and more on it for sure..

Jay