5-Point Harness Install

SO,
Just got a Weltmeister harness bar

(The only one which I could figure would let me put the seat back far enough so my head w/helmet will clear the roof)

and a Schroth 5-point cam lock harness. I'm planning to install with stock seats, passing the anti-sub belt thru the break between the seat back and the seat bottom (maybe I should wear a cup?). I have seen a few guys in the local PCA chapter who have set up this way, so I know it works, but I'm not sure where to locate/attach the anti-sub belt mounting bracket. Suggestions would be great.

Also, (Jack?) can I attach my belts to the harness bar, or should I go over it and to the rear seatbelt mount points? Is the bar strong enough/designed for attachment to it? The Weltmeister instructions say so, but previous postings I read say otherwise. Either way is fine as my shoulder harness is adjustable from 20-80".

Thanks as always for your replies.

Nick.

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Nick Shumaker
1982 911SC Coupe
nickshu@yahoo.com
PCA -- Rocky Mtn. Region

If it's the bar that extends back about six inches for more seat clearance, then I would say only use it as a pass-thru guide. I had my belts mounted there, not knowing it was only supposed to be a guide), and am now glad I didn't hit a wall. I now also wear my three-point belt (like the guys who wear suspenders and a belt, I guess), which takes some of the danger out of the equation.

I mount the fifth belt bracket in front of the seat, which is not technically correct. I'm getting the $20 harness that you sit on, that mounts to the side bolts, from Northstar Motorsports, which will eliminate that problem (we'll see if I need a cup for that).

I'm also getting a roll bar installed tomorrow, which means the two harness bars I have (one's Weltmeister, one's something else) will soon be up for sale.

Mounting the submariner out the back of the seat seems like a bad idea to me. Of course, I'm no expert, but it seems that you do not want the submariner restraining you in a collision (strange groin injuries would certainly result). It's sole function is to keep the lap belts down at the correct height. In a collision you don't want any soft tissue (abdominal, or those pieces lying to the south) to be absorbing the impact of the collision at all. You want your shoulders and your hip bones to be holding you in place.



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Jack Olsen
1973 911 T (3.6) sunroof coupe
jackolsen@mediaone.net

There is only one proper way to mount the harness/seat, and anything else is no good and can cause severe injury. Real racers laugh at the way some PCA guys mount their belts. I'm sorry if I'm religous about this.

Mount the belts according to the instructions. Don't rationalize other ways to do it no matter how many creative ways you see them mounted. As far as using a 5 point harness with the stock seat, there is no good way to do it. Just use your 3 point belts.

To reiterate, the sub belt must pass through the seat between the legs, and it must bolt to a hardpoint right under the seat.

As far as the harness bar, that is only a guide. The shoulder belts must bolt to either the rear seatbelt mounts or to eyebolts in the rear deck. The preferred method is to attach the shoulder belts to the rollbar using a wrap around buckling technique.

Per the Schroth "fine print", the sub strap is supposed to deviate no more than +/- 20degs from the vertical plane, and must go thru the seat bottom.

I believe the 2001 PCA and POC GCR's now require a true race seat with pass-thru slots for all non-student time-trial and race classes. They are pretty specific about harness mounting requirements too.

Chris C.

Thanks for the tips guys. I guess I'll rethink the thru the legs mounting for the sub belt I have seen some people do. Maybe I'll just run it as a 4-point until I am ready to get a sport seat. I was hoping to be able to get away with the stock seat for a little while as the car is still more on the street side of things. Guess I need to take another step towards track car.


Nick.

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Nick Shumaker
1982 911SC Coupe
nickshu@yahoo.com
PCA -- Rocky Mtn. Region

Nick you going to have to have your
shoulder belts attached either to your rear
seat belt anchors or the floor but NOT to your harness bar. Hopefully your new Schroth shoulder belts are long enough.
On your sub belt with your stock seats, your only option without cutting your seats is an eye bolt through the floor right ahead of your optimum driving seat position.
The sub belt prevents your other belts from
hiking up and misaligning themselves upon
your body. It is crucial to have one. Your Schroth belts are unique, I believe, in that
they have the patented give (fold of belt material) on the right shoulder belt. Good choice!
I think I see the makings of another track
junkie in our region.

Bill
RMR Tech Chairman

PCA DE events are very much safety oriented,
in our region (RMR) we try to make experience available to all types of P owners. Not every one will be mounting five point harnesses in their Porsches to do DEs.
IF they do, we have to make sure they are installed in the safest manner with OEM equipment in the car. For example, RMR does not permit Boxster and Cabs at DEs if they do not have rollbars with proper clearances. But this could be a National rule
anyway. Safety really is number one and
our DE record is pretty good.

However, I have no doubt that
our man Nick will be buying a racing seat sometime in the future to swap in/out for
track events. I have seen it in his eyes!
So a proper sub belt for Nick will only
be a matter of time.

Well this sucks.

So I got my "great deal" Schroth camlock harness today from Racer Wholesale in Atlanta.

The shoulder harness is only 60" long!! I told the salesperson that I needed at least 70-75" and he assured me that this harness had 80" shoulder belts. Oh well.

I really wanted to use it this weekend at DE.
Guess I'll wait for the next one. Stock belts this weekend. At least the harness bar makes the car feel stiffer on the turns.

So for future reference, you need at least 75" shoulder harnesses to go over your harness bar and reach the rear seat belt mount points.

Nick.

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Nick Shumaker
1982 911SC Coupe
nickshu@yahoo.com
PCA -- Rocky Mtn. Region