Have some questions for SWB gurus.

[Hoss3.0]

I came across a car today not far from my house that seems odd. The rear badge says 911S. It has chrome door handles that have the external buttons (not the trigger style like my '72), the dash face is basket weave, the ashtray is above the knee pad(s), there are vent openings in the inner rockers, vent windows, early non sport seats and an engine with one gold sticker on the fan shroud that says 911S, 911L (the rest is faded). It also sports a 915 5 speed (shift knob at least), impact bumpers, a whale tail, blacked out trim, 15X7 rear, 15X6 front Fuchs, flag mirrors in body color and what really throws me is the rear fenders are flared the same as my '72. Now I realize that most of the external things I mentioned could have been added in an effort to "up-date" the appearance but wouldn't the flares be non existent. Unless they too were added but most people tend to throw on the huge turbo flares. Looking under the car I noticed that the ride height adjusters had more of a hex bolt head and were much larger. The rear wheels looked too far forward in the wheel wells. I couldn't find a VIN and the owner wasn't home so I didn't want to get too in depth. My guess is this is a '68 911S. The engine had Webers, there was a CDI box on the left side with a coil right behind it. I saw an aftermarket fuel pump mounted on the forward fire wall that was missing the sound padding. The T-bar end covers looked different than mine. The car has S calipers. It didn't looked too good as both rear tires were flat, it was covered in dirt and dust, the doors were unlocked, the rear bumper was sagging on the left side and the the house isn't even lived in. What do you think?

[Rich Lambert]

Gotta VIN? That should tell all.

By the way, where are the pictures?

[Hoss3.0]

I didn't get the VIN as I couldn't really go in the car. No owners around. The doors were unlocked and the engine cover latch clearly doesn't work so I was able to look st the engine. i will see if i can get a VIN. I left a note for the owner on the front door. I seem to think the VIN on my car is on the drivers A pillar. I looked there but saw nothing. I am told it's on the drivers door jamb near the hinge. I'll see what I can do. How pissed would you be if some guy opened the door of your car to find the VIN was there????? It's not locked. Left all along in a gravel driveway in front of an un-lived in house (under renovation).

[ossiblue]

If the car is a SWB, the VIN will not be on the window pillar.

You've left a note to say you're interested. The house is not occupied and the car sits, ignored. Give it a day and see if you get a call. If you don't, then...

If you are in an area where most folks don't shoot and ask questions later, why not take a peek? The car appears to be a derelict anyway. Pop the trunk to double check the VIN, pop the engine lid and check the engine #. Ordinarily, I'd say "hands-off" any P-car, but given the condition and circumstances, this doesn't sound like someones garage queen. Still, be cautious and polite, and look only for what you need.
And take along a friend to cover your back

[robmog]

fwiw,
if it were your car would you want someone touching it?
and if a cop (mounty?) happens to come by, do you think "i was just looking" is something he's not heard before?
you left a note, its their move.
it ain't worth the trouble.

[haycait911]

IMHO sometimes being a slightly 'aggressive' purchaser pays off. will take 10 seconds to pop the trunk and check the vin. dress well and do it in full daylight, and take a friend, . sounds like maybe LWB quarters on a SWB? if at all possible, drive over in your 911. much less suspicious.

[Hoss3.0]

I was in my 911 yesterday when i first stopped which takes the edge off right away. It looks like the house is being worked on to move into. It's hard to tell when though. I will make regular trips that way to keep an eye on it and stop for sure if the owners are around. It's a strange deal, the tires are flat and cracked, the engine looks like it hasn't run in years and the bumpers are falling off but the paint is very nice and the underbody has very new undercoating. I will up date here what I find.
Mike

[Hoss3.0]

BTW, where excatly is the VIN on a SWB?

[ossiblue]

Originally Posted by Hoss3.0

BTW, where excatly is the VIN on a SWB?

You'll need to look in the luggage compartment--stamped in the sheet metal by the smuggler's box, and on an aluminum plate riveted to either the sheet metal by the trunk latch or by the smuggler's box, depending on how early the car.

BTW, your plan sounds very reasonable, IMO.

[304065]

Rear badge is meaningless on its own

Button door handles are 64-67, 68 had "Flying buttress" protectors over the button.

Basket weave dash is 67, 68 is elephant hide

Heater opening in the rocker is SWB 64-68

Ashtray in the dash is SWB, kneepad should be single piece

Vent windows. 68 has rubber cover on the handle, supposedly to prevent you from doing a Phineas Gage on impact. No cover= 64-67

Tombstone seats? Headrests? No headrests, or 356-style cylindrical headrests = SWB

Gold sticker on the engine suggests non original engine, SWB cars did not have a sticker on the fan strap until the 911T or L in 1968.

The VIN is located above the fuel tank, stamped into the body, and there should be an aluminum data plate on the trunk latch panel on the left side in the later years.

Good luck! Photos would tell all.

[Hoss3.0]

I spoke to the owner today and it's definitely a '68S. He has had it 8 years along with an early Turbo that instantly peaked my curiousity. Then he told me it was a '74! Upon inspection it turns out to be a Targa of unknown vintage, my guess is a '74 based on the interior and other cues. It had a huge whale tail with the intercooler box below it, SC rear flares, and 16Xvery wide rear Fuchs. I couldn't get too close to it because of how it was stored and it was covered in bird crap. So I didn't get a look at the engine. Back to the "S". He bought it with the impact bumpers already on it as well as the tail. He doesn't know the trim should be chrome and the fenders are wrong. I didn't tell him that those items were incorrect, he seems to like it that way. He did however tell me I should get a whale tail for my '72T, I just smilled. He is a very nice man that I think made a lot of money writting a couple of books and selling realestate he owned. I asked if wanted to sell the 68 and he is going to think about. He mentioned having an appraisal for it based on the value when he bought it. There isn't too many people in our area who deal with import estimates so I think I can figure out who did it. What is a '68S with incorrect bumpers, fenders and a whale tail worth. I will do a thorough VIN search of course if I consider this car and possibly restore to as original as possible. Any input is appreciated.

[Shoepop]

An easy way to tell a SWB S from the outside if no interior access is check rear disc brake rotors. An early (67-68 S) will have vented rotors front AND rear a normal will not, they will be solid. It was/is fairly easy to front with solid front rotors to vented so noting the rear is best. Changing the rear required a LOT more work, parts and $ and was not genearly done. Note, in 68 the 'L' version was imported in USA in lieu of S and it too will have rear vented rotors and other S upgrades with the exception of the engine which was the same 130 HP unit of standard/normal 911. Value as it sits now is virtually impossible to determine, to many unknowns. I suggest you obtain serial #, engine and trans axle serial #'s and have someone who knows early 911's VERY well take a look. Rust is a major issue with the early cars, and if it is a 68S it was not sold in the US, no 68S imported in 68. That may not be an issue in this case but in my experience 99% of all SWB euro cars I have seen here have major rust issues. Best of luck.

[Fritter]

Originally Posted by Shoepop

An easy way to tell a SWB S from the outside if no interior access is check rear disc brake rotors. An early (67-68 S) will have vented rotors front AND rear a normal will not, they will be solid. It was/is fairly easy to front with solid front rotors to vented so noting the rear is best. Changing the rear required a LOT more work, parts and $ and was not genearly done. Note, in 68 the 'L' version was imported in USA in lieu of S and it too will have rear vented rotors and other S upgrades with the exception of the engine which was the same 130 HP unit of standard/normal 911. Value as it sits now is virtually impossible to determine, to many unknowns. I suggest you obtain serial #, engine and trans axle serial #'s and have someone who knows early 911's VERY well take a look. Rust is a major issue with the early cars, and if it is a 68S it was not sold in the US, no 68S imported in 68. That may not be an issue in this case but in my experience 99% of all SWB euro cars I have seen here have major rust issues. Best of luck.

My '68 base 911 originally had a sportomatic (now has 901/02), and thus it has vented front and rear rotors and big front calipers. In other words, S brakes on my base sporto 911 were standard.

[Shoepop]

Interesting Mike, wonder why sporto ?

[Fritter]

Originally Posted by Shoepop

Interesting Mike, wonder why sporto ?

I think the reasoning is that the brakes would be used more on a semi automatic trans compared to a standard shift. And possibly, a sporto weighs more.