Installing the high torque starter
 

This is probably a quick and easy question, but i am not 100% sure what to do so thought I would see what others have done.

On my SC there are two smaller wires with the spade terminals going to the factory starter. One comes from the ignition switch, and the other is for the cold start. On the new high torque starter, there is no connection for the cold start. I am inclined to wire both the ignition and cold start wire to the terminal on the starter motor, so that voltage is also supplied to the cold start circuit when the starter is engaged.

Looking at the diagrams for the starter circuit, this is in effect what happens within the factory starter motor anyway.

What did others do with the cold start wire when they installed the high torque starter?

They are wired together on my 83 SC for my high torque starter...

I went with a "piggy back" terminal I obtained at the local auto parts store. It basically connects to the spade on the starter then branches off to two (2) other spades which connect to the factory wires.

Thats what I did as well JP...

Cool, then I am happy with what I did :)

Thank you....

I changed mine in 2005, and did as all these owners advise: tabbed the wires together.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1121178874.jpg

Big difference.





http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/229072-starter-problem.html

Ground for starter
 

I am finishing up the engine install on my 89 3.2 after it's complete rebuild. Most everything connected...now I have what looks to be a ground wire needing a home. I believe it is for the starter...although I can't seem to find a reference pic from when I removed the engine about 8 months ago...I have a high torque starter and currently have 3 wires going to it...big red + and the two other smaller ones. Is the black wire in the pic (just above the trans output flange) the wire that comes from the battery and thus it attaches around the same stud/terminal on top on the starter as the red wire leading to the alternator? Let me know if you can help! Here is a pic of the wire looking for a home.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1409235447.jpg

Yes, that big black wire is the 12 Volts coming from the battery.

*$%k knows why Porsche went with black???

Before installing it, do a continuity check to the battery to remove any doubt you may have but more importantly, either slip on some Red heat shrink on it or wrap some Red tape around it.

"*&^% knows why Porsche went with black???"

Because it's the German standard, followed by every German automaker. Unlike the US, the Germans have agreed on standards for non-proprietary stuff found across the board. All circuits and electrical components have standard terminal designations, as well. Simplification!

The Cap'n

Aye Aye Cap'n,

I knew there will be some kind of explanation :)

starter
 

Thanks guys!

I did find the Terminal Standard but can not find why the 12 V from the battery to the starter is black but all others are red as per the wiring diagram.

DIN 72552 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1409246950.jpg

Well, I can't answer that question. IIRC, the battery/starter cable has been black on every German car I've worked on over the 40+ years of my career as a wrench. I agree, most every other "30" circuit wire in the car is red. In some German cars, the battery ground cable is black, too (i.e. that of a 914). Most are brown, though, or a braided strap. All things considered, searching for the answer to this conundrum is a bit of a time waster, and the answer of no importance in the overall meaning of life.

The Cap'n

True but when I Goggle it I came across a few posts on Pelican that some fried their battery because they "assume "that black was ground.

I guess the same as why the Oil Pressure will peg up when the circuit open as opposed to go to 0.

They probably ran out of red wire :D:):D

Thanks for bringing that up! Think about that assumption those folks made for a minute. You have the battery out and you're gonna install it. You look at the wires. You have a 6"-8" wire (often a braided strap) going DIRECTLY to a stud on the body, and a small assortment of wires connected to a terminal, one large one disappearing somewhere into the body, and some smaller ones going up to the fuse box. The battery itself has a (+) and a (-) embossed next to the terminals. If you can't identify the negative terminal/cable connection, you have issues that require more attention than we, as members of this forum, can ever give you. As Ron White famously said, "You can't fix stupid". Furthermore, while there a lot of good things about being an American, or other English speaking person from the West, we ARE NOT the arbiters of electrical and mechanical convention. Italian cars are filled with pink wires. Does that make them wrong? Just because Ford, GM, and Chrysler chose red for (+) and black for (-), doesn't mean the rest of the world has to do so. They weren't the first to build cars, so they don't get to say what the rest of the world does. FWIW, our arrogance here in the USA has made us one of only three countries (along with the industrial powerhouses of Liberia and Myanmar) that haven't adopted the metric system as the official system of measurement.

Please note this is not a rant aimed at YOU, rather a general poke at both absurdity and stupidity (and there's a LOT of that on the internet!).

The Cap'n

New install. If the large black wire goes on the blue covered stud ok. I have the loose red wire but it was not installed on my old starter and the alt was working. Any He;p?

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1523618308.jpg
Where does the black wire in post above (the one connected to battery) go?
Thx.

Why do you think we haven't converted to metric?

I'd say it has to do with aviation. We DO rule the world in aviation. The US made it mandatory for all aircraft around the world to use our tail number identification and to speak English if you're a pilot.

Can you imagine trying to retool all the machining equipment in the world to metric when all the gradations are in imperial? There's many machines that were built around WWII that are still spitting out parts.

Second, you can't convert all of the airplanes that are currently flying to metric. It would be silly and uneconomical IMO. :eek:

It's piggybacked with the big red one. The black cable feeds power to both the starter and then the red cable, which goes and feeds all of the various things in the engine bay.

This picture just makes me cringe. It's *this* close to touching the transmission case and starting an unintended welding job!!!!!

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1409235447.jpg

Thank you! Just wanted to be sure.

I assume the battery was disconnected during the install.

Here's a shot of mine. Black wire battery . Red wire to alternatorhttp://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1523640017.jpg

Fair assumption. But if somebody thinks black is ground.............

After wiring houses and garages, I would never assume that the black wire was ground. In house wiring, the black wire is always the hot wire. Red is also a hot wire, such as a wire that is switched or the 2nd hot wire in a 240v circuit. White is the color of the neutral wire while ground wires are either green or bare. So, just another color coding convention to add to the confusion!

Easy way to remember is that "brown is ground the world around!"

I love the metric adoption topic. Why aren't all these metric countries using metric TIME?

Sorry for resurrecting an old thread, but I thought I could probably save some other folks some time. I just ordered and received a new Hi-Torque starter from our host. When I ordered, I asked the rep about the need for an adapter for the two quick disconnects onto the new starter. They said they didn't think I'd need any such thing.

I received the starter today and sure enough, only one terminal on the starter as previously discussed. I called our host and they confirmed they don't carry any such adapter. I checked all the local auto parts stores and no one has them in stock. I ordered from Amazon but of course it'll take a couple days. For the next person who orders a new starter, what you need is:

"Dorman Conduct-Tite Interior Disconnect Piggybacks, Double Male w/ .25" Tabs" or similar, such as "Ancor 230613 Marine Grade Electrical Double Male-Female Adapter" on Amazon.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000NI1G0C/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&psc=1

https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/dorman-conduct-tite-double-male-with-250-in-tabs-interior-disconnect-piggybacks-85613/22141310-P

hoping for the battery to be disconnected during the mentioned assembly...

And another resurrection - thanks for posting that Amazon link! Saved me a bunch of time trying to find the right one 🍻

It's a bit annoying when you buy a new starter from Pelican they don't suggest or insist you buy that little piggy-back clip... since it IS needed.

Anyone have a pic of the fully-installed starter, all wired up with any adapter you purchased separately? My new starter from Pelican came with a pigtail with an adapter on one side and a stripped bare end on the other.

Thanks, and happy Easter! 🐇

NAPA sells those clips too. There is also a style that is a spade crimp-on connector (crimp onto the yellow wire) that has a piggyback additional spade on it. Buy a package of 5 or 10 for not much more than that single one at Autozone. You will find other uses for them, trust me.

Check out this thread: https://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/424087-high-torque-starter-install.html

It also covers the possibility that you may have to reposition the mounting plate to clear the heater hose.

Mark

On my 85 i had to get a new heater hose to clear starter without extending battery cable. Old hose was just 3/4” too short. May have been trimmed at some point.

I had same issue as 911obgyn, the cable was too short no matter how I rotated the new hi torque starter. Finally went to Oreilly's and just got a 1 foot battery cable extender and problem solved.

Adding onto this thread because it’s not worth starting a new one. High-torque starter is in and with the power lug on top of the new starter my battery cable just is not getting there. Alternator wire is fine. Am I missing something really obvious, like there’s a bunch of slack somewhere that I can take up?

Súper kosher thing is to run a new, longer battery cable but if this were necessary I’d know it from reading about it. I suppose battery cable extenders are a thing but seems hinky.

Thats a drag.
Might have to splice in a few extra inches or run an all new wire, which might have benefits. I believe I posted about this already but the hi-torque starter I installed on my car had something different about the mounting bolts .. so, again, it was not a simple 'plug n' play'....never is, it seems.

Yeah, one of my good friends responded by offering to fab a new cable for me (he has the tools and hardware).

So, do any of y’all know the length, gauge and terminal sizes of the factory power cable? Or at least length and gauge. Then i can add like 6-8” to the length. I’m about 4” off.

I do not look forward to the idea of running a new cable from the battery to the starter but, as you say, it does have its advantages. Adding an extender is easy but I’ve got to insulate the connection so it doesn’t short on anything. I don’t have tools for splicing anything.

I wouldn't fabricate a new wire w/o removing and getting an actual side by side comparison to get your needed length - exactly. But FIRST I would trace the OEM wire all the way back. You might find an area where the oem cable can be pulled & snugged up a bit toward the alternator. It's also am opportunity to relocate the battery to the smugglers box ~ then you will have a few extra feet of wire