Back to points.....questions to follow

[sean m]

Background.....car is a 77s with a 2.7 engine. I replaced pertronix that a wire had busted. Thought it would be a simple fix (I know several of you tried to help me through it). Car wouldn't start. All I was doing is replacing the exact same unit. Figured it would be a no brainer. Boy was I wrong. I'm sure I screwed up somewhere but damned if I can find it. I've done everything I can think of as well as what you guys have suggested........I give up. I think I fried the Pertronix unit. No real way to test it without buying another at $70.

Anyway, been reading lots of posts about points, dizzy's, maintenance (several from Early S Man RIP). Decided I've had enough, went to AutoZone and picked up a set of points, and a feeler gauge (read an article about setting the gap at "go no go").

The engine is at TDC. I know this because I read Doug Suds Tech article about the static timing. Pulled the #1 plug, stuck a screw driver down in, rotated the engine by hand, when engine got to TDC the screw driver moved out of the hole so I know the compression on #1 had begun.

Any pointers for a rookie are appreciated because I've never even seen points before.

I"ll post pics as I dive in

[kidrock]

I've never done points in a Porsche before, so I'll assume they are like the points in the dozens of other vehicles I've done point adjustments on. Basically, a very simple procedure.

1) make sure your motor is at TDC
2) pull dizzy cap and rotor, and loosen point set screw
3) gently turn motor by hand (clockwise) to ensure nylon cam "rider" of points is riding on the highest point of the dizzy "lobe" (the center of the dizzy where the rotor sits). You should still be at or near TDC at this point.
4) insert your feeler gauge between the metal points as flat as possible, and tighten the set screw.

Make sure to set your timing after adjusting the points.

[sean m]

OK.....took off the Pertronix, cleaned the dizzy a little. Here's a few pics.

First is the points. Where does the connection go? The prior Pertronix black wire was grounded to the case. Do I connect this black wire of the points to the former black wire of the Pertronix ?


Or....do I need to connect it to, what looks like a ground, inside the dizzy noted here?



In some pictures I've seen on PP there looks to be a place that the points connect, just not on my dizzy.

Sorry for the newb questions, I'm just lost when dealing with points.

[2.70Racer]

Sean,
The points wire goes to the terminal that exits the distributer through a rubber insulator.
There is a terminal inside the distributor connected to a terminal outside of the distributor.
There is a shielded wire that connects to this outside terminal and goes to pin c of the CD box. The shield part of the wire connects to ground. Be certain the shield does not touch the wire inside the shield.
As the points close, the circuit goes to ground. When the points open there is no ground contact.
At the CD box pin B is 12 volts, pin A is the output that goes to the coil.
Pin A sends a 300+ volt signal to the coil when each time the points open.
The points do the opening and closing making a ground then opening it.

[RoninLB]

no shielded wire necessary from dizzy to CD with points

A 14 ga wire is good

points have to "break in"

I do initial recheck of adjustment after 1st 100 miles.

if not using grease on dizzy cam 200 miles should be enough to stop the fast wear on the points contact wafer. If grease is used it could be well over 500 miles before points break in. Keep checking and readjusting every 200 miles till you see points are not rapidly closing.

you should check timing every time you adjust points.

it's even easier to check points adjustment by checking how far off your timing is

Bosch points are a pretty good product

ps: the dizzy inside/outside wire connector may be missing from when the pertronix was installed ?

[sean m]

Doug,
As you can see from the picture (maybe you can't) I don't have what you state here....
"There is a terminal inside the distributor connected to a terminal outside of the distributor"
I'm sure the PO took it out when he put in the Pertronix. Can I buy it somewhere or do I need to get a new dizzy?

[John-1977911s]

Sean,

This terminal that you're missing in nothing more than a barrel (like a video barrel or something to connect/extend a cable or in this case to get through a hard wall).

You could use a piece of the black wire from your old Pertronix and do a light solder to extend the points black wire, run it through the hole in the distro, then connect the lose end to the same wire that your Pertronix black was connected to in the first place> This will be currect: Ala the pic you emailed to me.
.....for the record I don't recommend doing things against stock... but in this case it should get his car running)

The points metal base fit into the distro l just like the Pertronix did.

Then follow the rest of the advice in the thread... This should work.

[moneymanager]

"The engine is at TDC. I know this because I read Doug Suds Tech article about the static timing. Pulled the #1 plug, stuck a screw driver down in, rotated the engine by hand, when engine got to TDC the screw driver moved out of the hole so I know the compression on #1 had begun."

Yup. Either that or it's 180° off.

[sean m]

Hey John,
Thanks for the reply.....that's exactly what I did. I took the old wire from the Pertronix with the rubber square to plug the hole in the dizzy. Now I'll connect to the "old" black wire connection for the pertronix.

I'll get the gap set, try to get it all connected this weekend.

Wish me luck.....

[scarceller]

You never mentioned if you have spark? All the points do when they close is establish a ground, meaning when they close they ground whatever is on the other side of the points. THey could drive a coil directly or a CDI box. Once you understand this you can simply test the CDI box or the coil (whatever you have) to see if it fires. Simply, if you ground the wire that feeds the CDI or Coil and then un-ground it the ignition should fire and produce spark, so take the hi-tension coil wire that feeds the distributor unplug it from the distributor establish an air gap (couple mm gap) and ground or close the points for a second or 2 then unground them you should have spark across the air gap. If you do the CDI and/or Coil are functioning.

I'd start by testing that the ignition can produce spark as per test above then worry about points gap and proper settings after.

In summary one side of the points is hard wired to ground the other side goes to the ignition when the points close the ignition charges then when the points open the ignition fires. The amount of time the points stay closed for is know as the dwell time or charging time.

Hope this helps