Ignition Wire

I miss you guys and it looks like you've got good discussions going but I've no time to spend. I also don't want to chase past threads right now, but have a question.

Has anybody found good bulk ignition cabling? The auto stores here look at me like an extraterrestrial when I ask about it. further, are there resistor versus non-resistor types? I believe our cars use a non-resisting wire. Is there a chance I could screw up and get wire with too much resistance?

I may or may not put the steel braided sock on the cable. I believe it is not necessary.

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'83 SC

Check the web sites for MSD and ACCEL as both sell bulk cable and the ends as necessary. Summit Racing also sells both brands but is out lots of the time. Depending on the model engine and if there are resistors in the plug wires the after market ends may not work. Good luck.

Resistance is for radio noise suppresion, it can be in the wire, or in the connector or in the sparkplug. Porsche wire for older cars is generally metal(Cu or Fe) conductor(little resistance) with a connector which has a resistor built in to it. Bulk wire can be purchased at most speed shops, I have used 'Accel' with good results in either 7m or 8mm. there is another type of wire which uses a different technique for radio noise supression, it uses a spiral wrap around a central conductor and has a very low resistance. Though it will work ok, you want to avoid resistance wire(usually has a carbon core) WITH a resistance connector especially with a resistance plug. For 911 uses the limiting factor is the connectors, it is difficult to find the proper connectors for the fancier wire. The braided wire has a metal non resistance core and is designed to be used with resistance spark plug connectors. The braid serves the same function as the spiral wrap in the fancy wire sets (it limits RFI), and was introduced to our cars to cure a problem with air boxes blowing up, which at one time was though to be the result of cross firing, No the braid is not necessary, but it does look nice.

Super,

I have a feeling that the Accel wire is copper-cored, but I'm not certain. Another brand to check is Belden, it is a very high-quality mfr of cables and wire. The 'great' silicone 7 mm wire I use is AC-Delco, but it has stainless steel core, which didn't matter with the pre-74 wires since those Beru connectore screwed in the the wire end rather than being threaded!

And, it is perfectly OK to use solder on sparkplug wires, as they don't get anywhere near hot enough to worry about solder melting ... if they did, the bakelite Beru connector would be at peril!

Don't forget about the VW 111.905.449 air seals at an independent VW supplier!
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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa

[This message has been edited by Early_S_Man (edited 02-01-2001).]

I agree with Warren (easy and smart to do, I know). I used the AC-Delco bulk wire, 7mm. The stainless core allowed me to easily reuse the Berl connectors on the new wires. I exposed about an inch of the inner core, doubled it over and screwed it into the connector. I didn't use solder, but then again the connection wasvery tight just by scewing it in. So far so good.
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Paul
78SC Targa

Starting a New Topic is like fishing. got some bites I see. Thank you all.

7mm and 8mm apparently applies to the diameter of the cable including insulation. So, I may be better off using a cable that is stock diameter. Are my stock cables 7mm in diameter?

Also, should I be concerned about copper versus stainless core? If so, why?

I think I'm hearing that my need is for non-resistor wire. NAPA here does not carry bulk cabling. the other stores also do not. They have 'universal' sets (Accel is the most common), but no bulk cable. Where did you get the AC Delco?

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'83 SC



[This message has been edited by Superman (edited 02-01-2001).]

Hey Superdude, my motor wizard uses Belden bulk wire, same stuff he will build the dual plug harnes for my motor out of, same stuff he used on Monte's 600 HP twin turbo race motor. Don't remeber if it is 7 or 8mm.

Randy Jones
1971 911

Superman,

I got my 7mm SS wire from Mesa Performance in Costa Mesa, CA. Cost was about $10.00 for 18 feet. They have a web site and I am sure they could send you some. Even have it in some cool colors.
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Paul
78SC Targa

Great topic for me right now. I am trying to figure out how I am going to wire my project motor which is twin plugged and requires custom lengths. What I haven't been able to find is a source for the "extension" conectors that go down into the cylinder heads. Are they the beru connectors I keep seeing in this post? I need 12 of them so if anyone knows of a good ecomomical source for them, please let me know! Thanks a bunch.

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Mark
www.mark.hargett.com
mark@hargett.com

Accel does use a Cu core. Cu is a better conductor of electricity. The concern of Cu vs Fe conductor is at the junction where the Cu meets a different material like steel. At such a juntion where 2 dissimilar metals meet there will be a place for corrosion to start, it can quickly deteriorate the conductivity of the wire. The prefered wire is stainless with stainless snaplock terminals. The minor decrease in conductivity is more than made up in corrosion resistance. Silicone outer layer is prefered due to its chemical inertness, and braided f/g and/or kevlar cores provide mechanical strength. oem wire were 7mm.

Superman - I'm looking for some bulk wire as well, all I have found is MSD. No AC Delco yet. I do have someone locally who has Packard and found some Belden on the internet. Let me know what you find and I will do likewise.

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Rob Fix
'78 SC Targa

[This message has been edited by robfix (edited 02-01-2001).]

Super,

Packard wire was recommended by Carrol Smith, author of the Prepare to Win, Tune to Win, and Engineer to Win series of books back in the '70s. He said it was more readily available in the boonies than his favorite Autolite wire (before Ford sold off the name) and almost as good.

I bought a 100 ft roll of AC-Delco SS-550 wire back in '78 at a local parts store that handles Delco brand merchandise, and did the wires on my car that June, after I discovered the first bad Beru connector. I have done a couple of additional 911 wire sets and a couple of VW Beetles from that roll, and still have enough for one more 911 set ... for my car, I guess 23 years is long enough service for one set! It is 7 mm wire, as is the factory Neoprene wire for the Beru sets.
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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa

[This message has been edited by Early_S_Man (edited 02-01-2001).]

So, I am thinking 7mm wire would be my best pick, to fit the Beru connectors sleeves and those screw tips, in case I can transfer them. And copper versus steel may not be important. I just need good, non-resistor wire. Or so it seems.

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'83 SC

Superman:

There is a 'rod shop up here in LynnWood that carries what you need. I will check with them for 7mm Belden with stainless or copper and let you know what happens.

B&B and Action Auto are the better vendors in the auto parts biz here in Seattle. They tend to know cars and go the distance---if there is one around where you're at I'd check them out as well.

Also don't forget that many motorcycle shops are after this same wire. Might be worth a poke around?

Jw

There is a motorcycle shop in Vancouver, Wa that had the 7mm Belden. You'd have to wait to have it shipped unless your up for a drive (much shorter for you). It was $.50 a foot.

Thanks gobs, guys. I occasionally get a local guy on the line who admits "we used to make our own wires..." But no one has it. Olympia is just not a big town. I've checked the race shops, we have an Action Auto, and its warehouse, but they say "no." So, I think my next focus is Tacoma, though I get to Seattle occasionally, so all these tips are appreciated.

Someone said that welding cable is the same stuff. I'll bet someone educates us on that. But to be candid, I'm hoping for a more striking color than black.

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'83 SC

Super,

The source of your welding cable info is sadly misinformed! Sparkplug connectors don't come for #4 gauge cable, and welding cable is not rated for more than 600 Volt operation! They are fat, but most of that bulk is copper, not insulation!

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa

There's just a couple of things I know I can really count on. The sun will rise in the east. And Warren will be protecting Porsches from their owners with accurate and appropriate info and suggestions.

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'83 SC

Super,

Thanks! All of this discussion about ignition wires reminded me of a really cheap set of VW Beetle wires I saw at K-Mart once about 28 to 30 years ago, just as they were getting into replacement ignition parts for foreign cars ... for $3.98 you got a wire set of questionable heritage with clear vinyl insulation, very soft any pliable! Reminded me of cheap lamp cord with clear vinyl ... and since the insulation was only about 5-6 time as thick as the lamp cord, I has serious doubts about the quality and reliability! Never was even tempted to go look for some of that clear sparkplug wire!

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa

OK, I will try asking my question again;
Does anyone know an economical source for the extention connectors on our motors? I'm not sure what the proper term is for them but I am talking about the piece that reaches down into the head and plugs onto the sparkplug. I need 12 of them and the mail order prices are @ 12 bucks a pop.

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Mark
www.mark.hargett.com
mark@hargett.com