Found a nice '88, but some red flags...

[logan2z]

I came across an '88 Carrera with 97K miles that appears to be in very good condition, but after speaking to the seller and running a Carfax there are some red flags. Firstly, the white options sticker typically found under the hood is nowhere to be found. The seller says it wasn't on the car when he bought it. I can only assume that the hood was replaced, although the Carfax shows no accident history. Secondly, the Carfax indicates that there was a discrepancy in the odometer reading at the time the car was sold at auction - to the tune of about 13K miles (not too happy about the auction either, since that usually means any service records were tossed). Finally, the car has been owned in several states, some of them winter climates like NY, MI, etc. I guess that if the car was subjected to a thorough PPI and came through ok, then I'd feel fairly comfortable purchasing it, but some of these things have me spooked. Would you pursue such a car or move on? The color combo is one I'm looking for and the price is fairly reasonable, which is why I haven't abandoned it just yet.

[slodave]

Carfax does not list every bit of history. It is not required for a shop to report fixes to Carfax. It is possible that the hood had minor damage and it was replaced. Not really a deal breaker in a normal daily driver type car.

Can you have the car taken to an independent Porsche shop in your area for a PPI? If you are really interested in the car, this route will give you some of the best info.

My dad owned my 911 and under his ownership, someone with a tail hitch backed into the hood - 911 was stationary in a parking lot. I believe the hood was replaced/repainted. There is no sticker. In my case, I know that it was cosmetic and no tub damage.

PPI

[DRACO A5OG]

My car's history had a hicup on the odo. PO had it serviced but aparently something happened with the reading. But I have the signed receipt of the company so I am not worried.

I concur with Dave, PPI then decide.

If the option sticker really bothers you, maybe you car get the original sticker from Porsche NA?

[amschnellsten]

I would say if the car checks out well I would not worry about it. If the hood was changed big deal. Some auctions automatically put odometer discrepancy. I had a 928s4 that showed 96k and the carfax showed 169k. After a lot of research a dealer in Florida was responsible for reporting the wrong mileage once.

[175K911]

Carfax reporting is typically unreliable for any damage more than maybe 10 years old. If the damage was from 15 years ago, quite likely it won't show up. Likewise, if it was minor and the owner paid out of pocket it won't get reported.

And Carfax isn't perfect. My previous Audi showed up as a rental car in Carfax, even though I bought it new. Took months to get it changed. Carfax refused to believe they were wrong. Then when one of my turbos blew, requiring $6K of warranty work to replace both turbos, Carfax reported a $6k front end accident. Huh?? I was in the process of trying to get them to remove that as well when the car got rear ended and totalled. Guess what- 6 months after the car went to a salvage yard, the VIN still showed a $6k front accident but no mention of the car being totalled ($28K damage estimate). Go figure. I have very little faith in Carfax.

[Bob S]

Most 20+ year old cars have some type of paint work.... If the work was done correctly, that wouldn't turn me off unless I was looking for a show car....

As long as the PPI checks out ....

[JB36]

The hood might not have been replaced. Mine is missing as well, but the VIN number is tagged at the top of the hood towards the wind shield.

[Shadetree930]

Some dealers removed the hood options sticker as part of the customer prep process.

Its absence is not an indication of a hood replacement or respray.

If the original owners manual is still with the car there may (again .. not always) be a duplicate of the hood sticker in the book.

In both cases, its nothing to be concerned about. Some cars have them, some do not.

[logan2z]

Thanks for the thoughts so far. Most of the comments have focused on the options sticker, but does the auction, odometer discrepancy and the fact that the car has bounced from state to state quite a bit not trouble anyone? Or would you just rely on a thorough PPI to tell you that, despite everything, the car is a good one?

[kanadary]

I too don't have the sticker under the hood, it was with the owners and service manuals.

[Shadetree930]

The car is 20+ years old. She's had an active past history but that does not necessarlily make her a slut.

Average of 5,000 miles per year is not abusive.

Unlikely that its was daily driven in snow and salt. Most likely spent most of its time in the country club parking lot on summer weekends.

Auction tells me it was probably a trade-in on some other new car purchase and was not the kind of car that particular dealer wanted to work with at that time.

Get a good PPI, analyze the results and enjoy.

[89911]

Like said, every car that is 20 years old is going to have some kind of history. The 911 is such a basic piece of machinery, the PPI is what should be your determining factor. I think my car was owned by 4 people and was factory delivered, went to Arizona, then Ohio, and Pennsylvania. If your looking for a one owner, low milage car with all the records, you will pay ridiculous prices for that. Try www.sloancars.com.

[dw1]

Originally Posted by logan2z

Thanks for the thoughts so far. Most of the comments have focused on the options sticker, but does the auction, odometer discrepancy and the fact that the car has bounced from state to state quite a bit not trouble anyone?

Those are by far the most troubling of the items you mention. The combination of an car sold at auction and an odometer discrepancy would tell me to keep looking and find a car with a cleaner history. In this economy, prices are down and availability good (although it is summer driving/vacation season, when more people are driving their cars and fewer thinking about selling them.)

My '87 doesn't have the option sticker under the hood either, but evidence clearly indicates it was the victim of some touch-up painting. The vin and option listing in the service booklet checked out fine, and I am only the second owner of a car that was originally sold new by a local Porsche dealer. And I didn't have to pay a premium price, I just had to spend a lot of time looking.

Patience and persistence pays off, and PPI's are far from infallible.

[Nine17]

If you like the car, there are no red flags here which suggest that a PPI would be a waste. If the PPI checks out, remember that flawless 20-year-old cars are rare and expensive and most of our Porsches have a few "stories" to tell. I've ALWAYS got some project or another going on my '88, but I really enjoy driving it.

[CBRacerX]

Originally Posted by JB36

The hood might not have been replaced. Mine is missing as well, but the VIN number is tagged at the top of the hood towards the wind shield.

This VIN sticker is how you are going to know if it was replaced or not. Overall nothing sounds very troubling up front, PPI is everything.

[logan2z]

Originally Posted by JB36

The hood might not have been replaced. Mine is missing as well, but the VIN number is tagged at the top of the hood towards the wind shield.

I spoke to the seller and there is a VIN tag under the hood that matches the VIN elsewhere on the car. So I guess the missing options label isn't a big issue. I'm still a bit concerned about the odometer discrepancy at auction, but that may be as simple as a clerical error. I'll likely have the car PPI'd and take it from there.

Thanks for all of the replies!

[Elombard]

You are new so I am going to suggest you do some searches on PPIs, you need to ask for some specific things...otherwise you may get back a big report about the scratch on the interior door handle...

FOr instance, in my experience a leak down is NOT part of a normal PPI. You want to verify that the motor is in good shape if the miles might be messed with.

Also, let them know about its life in the land of salt so they look at the undercarriage real carefully..

etc. etc.

I think I would be wary of top dollar for this car....but I am not a top dollar kind of buyer.

If the PPI checks out and problems found match the price...I would have no worries - Enjoy