Snow Tire thoughts for 16x6 and 16x7 fuchs on 86 911

[darrin]

Time to replace the old snow tires on my '86 targa daily driver. I live in denver, co and commute to lakewood (around 25 miles roundtrip on mostly limited access, multilane highways).

Tirerack currently only offers Bridgestone Blizzak WS-60 and Michelin Primacy Alpin PA3 in the stock 205/55/16 front and 225/50/16 rear tire sizes and I've been unable to track down any other snows that are same-model available in both sizes.

I had blizzaks on a honda years ago and liked them a lot. The WS-60s look to be pretty aggressive snow tires and I'm concerned about how they'll ride at 70mph+ speeds on dry roads (which they'll face the VAST majority of the time). OTOH, I wasn't too impressed with the snow/wet adhesion of the Michelin snows (pilot alpins) that I'm replacing.

Any suggestions/alternatives/testimonials?

Thanks,

Darrin

[efhughes3]

Gosh, I'm glad I don't have to worry about this!

[Formerly Steve Wilkinson]

Why get such wide snow tires? The narrower the better, with snows: you don't want to toboggan across the snow, you want to cut down through it. What else will fit those wheels? (Actually, I get dedicated steel wheels for snows, which we have on a Boxster and a Volvo V50. Then I can do the changeover myself, in the driveway.)

[tcar]

I've used Blizzaks on both 911 and Audi TQC. Like them a lot.

Denver also.

[darrin]

Originally Posted by Formerly Steve Wilkinson

Why get such wide snow tires? The narrower the better, with snows: you don't want to toboggan across the snow, you want to cut down through it. What else will fit those wheels? (Actually, I get dedicated steel wheels for snows, which we have on a Boxster and a Volvo V50. Then I can do the changeover myself, in the driveway.)

Thanks for the comment -- I currently run dedicated summer tires on 16x7 and 16x8 fuchs and currently use the targa's original fuchs for my winter wheels. While I understand that narrower is better for snow tires in general, since the vast majority of my winter driving is on dry roads, I'm concerned that, coupled with the performance hit one takes running snows, running NARROW snows would leave me with even less dry road drivability.

[darrin]

Originally Posted by tcar

I've used Blizzaks on both 911 and Audi TQC. Like them a lot.

Denver also.

Tcar -- are you running ws-60s on your 911? I believe bridgestone used to make what appears to have been a more "performance" snow tire that's now been discontinued. If you're happy with the ws60s for denver weather, I see no reason not to pull the trigger (especially given tirerack's current $50 rebate offer) . . .

Thx

[rllevin]

I've used Blizzaks on a rwd MB 190D ('87) and found them to be safe and VERY effective on snow and ice. The usable amount of specialized tread is only half the actual safe tread depth and they're soft so they wear quickly. I'd get 2-3 winters out of a set in the northeast. I would not expect summer tire handling on dry pavement but they aren't dangerous, by any means. Overall well worth the peace of mind if you're driving in winter.
I've no experience with Michelin's offerings but, intriguingly, saw a blurb indicating their special compound is full thickness, not just half as in the Blizzak. Again, no experience.

[porschenut]

I live in Denver too and for my '86 coupe I had an extra set of wheels (phone dials) with Dunlop snow tires for the two winters I drove my 911 in. The 911 is a blast on snowpack with snowtires! Even more fun than on a dry road in summer.

Anyway, see if Dunlop or Kumho makes some snow tires in those sizes.

[J2Hanson]

I've used Nokian tires http://www.nokiantires.com/ for some time on my Saabs and BMWs. I love them. They're quiet and provide great traction. I also run dedicated summer tires.
John

[AVIMAX]

Dunlop SP Winter Sport M3 are awesome snow tires and I see both sizes available on Tire Rack, although the 205-55-16 seem to only be available in the runflat version on the site. I have these (runflat version) on my BMW 335i and for a 300hp RWD car, they have been absolutely outstanding. The last two winters here in Toronto have been very snowy and I'v never had a problem with these tires. As good as any blizzaks I have ever owned, but better wearing, better in the wet and better performing in the dry than the blizzaks. They perform surprisingly well in the dry considering how aggresive the tread pattern is and are very quite even cruising at 100+ KPH on the highway. You will not be disappointed with these.

[brendon]

X2 on the Nokian. The WRG2 is available in both sizes as is the Hakka R/RSi.

The G2 is an "all-weather" tire that outperforms most dedicated snow tires. It came in third out of 20 snow tires tested by CR a couple years ago. This one would give you what you want as far as dry/wet pavement performance as well as snow performance for the winter. I would still recomend using them only as winter tires on a Porsche. I have family and friends running these and they love them.

The Hakka R, which is the new version of the RSi, is the non-studded winter snow/ice tire. I have a set I put on our S4. This will be the fourth season on this set of tires with lots of tread left. They are way better than any of the other winter tires I have tried - Dunlop, Blizzak, Michelin. They do fine at highway speeds on dry pavement, but I have noticed considerable tread squirm compared to the summer tires. These work best for me running them at higher pressures than the sticker in the car specifies.

There are also studdable winter tires available if that's your thing. They're illegal in Wisconsin so I have never tried them.

Full disclosure: I am a hobby dealer for Nokian Tyres. I liked them so much after trying a set that I set myself up to sell them (local only - sorry). Helps to know the regional distributor
There is a dealer locator at http://www.nokiantires.com/dealer-locator

[Won]

Can't help you with tire choices but just wanted to point out the possibility of running 205/55/16 all around if that improves your options. I doubt you will be driving the car right at the limit of adhesion in the winter such that going one size narrower in the back would even be noticeable. If you think about it 911s up to '77 came with same size tires all around so it's not going to be the end of the world. As FSW mentioned people go down a size with snow tires anyway, right?

I had old, old Yoko Guardex in 205/55/16 mounted on my stock Fuchs for the last couple winters and they were just awesome. Last winter we had the worst "snow storm" in recent years and while everyone in their big SUVs were *****ing about the snow, I never even got stuck once. People literally stopped on the sidewalk fully expecting to see the little red Porsh get stuck in the intersection. It was a lot of fun looking at their faces while I went on my merry way, plowing the street with my front spoiler for the next guy.

So to sum it all up, don't be afraid to go with a square setup with 205/55 tires. I ran those for winter and currently run 225/50 all around for street and r-comps.

[gtc]

Can anyone comment on whether 15" snow tires work better than 16's?

Also, when running skinny snow tires on the rear of the car, do you use wheel spacers to keep the car from looking funny?

[smarcus]

I have used WS-60's for the past 2 winters on my 87 Targa. I am in CT and we get alot of snow and ice ( I went to school at CU in Boulder so I am familiar with Denver weather and even though it is a bit different I think it is a fair comparison to CT). I run 205-16 in the front and 225-16 in the rear on 6 and 7 inch Fuchs.

I chose the WS-60's because I need to be at work everyday no matter what and I wanted the best possible snow and ice traction. For that they have worked great and I have made it through everything safe and sound. The downside is that the sidewalls are pretty soft and you will not get the dry performance that you will out of a winter performance tire. Having said that you can run down the highway at 100 and they work fine.

If I need new tires this winter (might get one more season out of the Blizzaks but I have to look) I will probably try the Dunlop Winter Sport M3 as I have read that they offer 95% of the traction of the Blizzak with better handling characteristics.

Sean

[Winter]

Given that Denver has (mostly) dry roads during the winter, no matter what you get, don't get studded snow tires. Dedicated snows are enough.

Just the $0.02 from a Colorado native who has driven all different kinds of cars in all conditions.

I'd also suggest, as others have noted here, that you get some cheap(er) wheels to put said tires on for a winter set. As you already know, the deicer that is being used (more and more here) kills the finish on wheels and also damages paint + other parts of your car. Maybe not so much of an issue for you, but my winter wheels on my Audi have seen three years of use and the clear coat is already showing signs of damage (stock rims). I-70 is covered in the stuff (mag-chloride) and it is NASTY!

---

Tom '75 targa

[Winter]

whoops, just noticed you already have dedicated wheels for the winter.

Well, one problem solved!

---

Tom '75 targa

[KTL]

Originally Posted by Won

Can't help you with tire choices but just wanted to point out the possibility of running 205/55/16 all around if that improves your options. I doubt you will be driving the car right at the limit of adhesion in the winter such that going one size narrower in the back would even be noticeable. If you think about it 911s up to '77 came with same size tires all around so it's not going to be the end of the world. As FSW mentioned people go down a size with snow tires anyway, right?

I had old, old Yoko Guardex in 205/55/16 mounted on my stock Fuchs for the last couple winters and they were just awesome. Last winter we had the worst "snow storm" in recent years and while everyone in their big SUVs were *****ing about the snow, I never even got stuck once. People literally stopped on the sidewalk fully expecting to see the little red Porsh get stuck in the intersection. It was a lot of fun looking at their faces while I went on my merry way, plowing the street with my front spoiler for the next guy.

So to sum it all up, don't be afraid to go with a square setup with 205/55 tires. I ran those for winter and currently run 225/50 all around for street and r-comps.

I'll second what Won said. There's no reason to worry at all about 205/55 on all four corners. The 205 will fit the 6's and the 7's no problem. And just like Won said, you're not going to be pushing the limit of the tires in the dry anyway. If you do drive agressively frequently, you'll find that you'll wear them out REALLY fast.

[darrin]

Thanks all for the great comments/thoughts/advice.

Never thought of going with 205/55/16 all around. My current 16/7 fronts are wearing 205/55/16 right now, and I don't believe I'd even notice the difference appearance-wise. Plus, doing this would allow me to possibly rotate tires to account for accelerated center wear on the rears and inside edge cupping on the fronts.

Have run the dunlops on our touareg and, while they didn't last too long (that's a HEAVY vehicle), liked their traction/ride a lot (ended running them through the summer after their tread wore down below what we felt comfortable using for another winter), need to read a bit more on the nokians, though friends swear by em.

bottom line, I have a fair bit more research to do, but am able to approach this from a much more educated angle thanks to y'all

will report back with my ultimate decision.

darrin

[aircooled911]

Darrin,

What tire did you end up with? My 77-911 running 205/55-16 all around and ran Bridgestone Potenza RE750 but they are no longer available. Only needed 2 but may need to purchase a full set

Do not have a second set of wheels so looking for compromising M/S for year round use. Like "Winter", I live at 7500 feet .

Any thoughts??

Thanks, Jim

[old man neri]

I just bought some cheap 15 X 6 cookie cutters (cheaper than steel) and put some Michelan Arctic Ice Xi-2s on there. I was impressed. Yes, on dry roads it does sometimes feel like you are on marshmallows but hey, that's the cost of being able to grip very well in snow, ice, slush..etc.

I found it cheaper just to get 15" cookies and 15" tires as oppose to the 16" options.