Front suspension help!!!

[torresmd]

OK I have spent the last three days upgrading my entire suspension. I am sore and finally have everything installed. The car has been lowered and looks great. I took it around the block to let the suspension settle for final adjustment and i hear clunking coming from the front end, mind you I am going slow and easy.

I suspect it may be that I need to tighten my shock tower nuts, too loose and might be moving a bit. Not sure though.

I also am wondering if I re-indexed my front torsion bars incorrectly. When I installed new torsion bars and bushings up front and first lowered the car, it looked like a 4 wheel drive. I adjusted the bolt for height and not even close so I wanted to re-index the torsion bars. I did this by jacking up the front control arm, then placed the torsion adjustment cover about mid way and lowered the car. It worked but not sure it that is the right way to re-index. I jacked up the car and removed the wheel and the adjustment nut hangs down, but with the car on the ground looks normal. I took a picture to help you understand what I am talking about. Just doesn't seem right. Please advise, it is going to be a late night.

[chocolatelab]

great timing i will be paying attention to responses as i am 2 days behind you

bentley says that you should have counted the number of visable threads before removal

guessing you didnt as i didnt as well.

also, tell me about what you did to the front end

[torresmd]

I replaced installed polybronze bushings, Torsion bars 22F/30R and Tarrett swaybars. Oh yeah and new bilstein sport shocks. Can't wait to try it out when I finally get things sorted.

[w21055]

That does not look right. Off the top of my head I am pretty sure you want the adjustable bolt to rest on the rubber stop otherwise the torsion bar is able to move until it hits it anyway. You can take the end cap off and move it so it rests in the middle.

[Flieger]

To re-index the torsion bar, you must pull the bar out of the splines in the front of the A-arm, turn the bar, and re-insert. That is the only place the bar is attached to the A-arm. The crossmember acts as the anchor point and adjustment point via the screw adjusters. The screws will hang down when the suspension is in full droop, like jacked up on a lift. They will be fine when you put the car on the ground.

It sounds like you did not actually re-index the torsion bars, just adjusted the screw.

[SteveinTO]

I like the adjusting screw in about the middle of the adjustment when the T-Bars are indexed close to whatever ride height you're shooting at. I think they're for final adjustments.

On a less happy note, is that a rip in the steering rack boot?

[Gordo2]

I ran into the same issue/confusion: it didn't seem right that the front ride height adjuster bolt didn't contact the stop when the car was on jack stands (suspension fully extended) - but that's the way mine was to get the correct ride height.

My initial set up was by the book - setting up the adjuster at mid-point on the bolt, with the bolt making slight contact with the stop. Resulted in the 4x4 look. I made one follow up adjustment - making sure I was even on both sides, but not worrying if the bolt contacted the stop (while on jack stands). The second try put me at the ride height I wanted with the adjuster close to mid point.

Doesn't seem right; you would think that the bolt would back off of the stop as the suspension extends, but apparently it was correct. The shop that did my corner balance and alignment said it was good enough to fine tune.

BTW, this was with larger 22mm front torsion bars.

Hard to describe it, but I think you are headed in the right direction.

Best of luck, Gordo

[torresmd]

Keep in mind that the pic shown is with the car jacked up and the suspension hanging free.
I am confused because with the suspension hanging, when I pull the torsion bar out and turn the bar then re-insert, the angle of the control arm does not change at all. I can pull, turn re-insert till the cows come home and nothing changes. It seems that the only way to change the angle of the control arm is to jack up the control arm and then place the torsion cap back on for a new range of motion.

[torresmd]

Thanks Gordo. That makes me feel better.
Not sure where the clunking noise is coming from. BTW I have not put back on the rock shield before I went for a test drive. Would that make any difference?

[SteveinTO]

Just don't hit a rock.

(I think you're O.K.)

[Flieger]

Originally Posted by torresmd

Thanks Gordo. That makes me feel better.
Not sure where the clunking noise is coming from. BTW I have not put back on the rock shield before I went for a test drive. Would that make any difference?

If you have Bilstein struts, check the linear bushings on the piston rod. Bilstein struts (as opposed to simple Bilstein inserts for Koni struts) are inverted and use a linear bushing to guide/support the shaft as it goes through its range of motion. This bushing often wears out quickly, causing a sloppy clunking noise. I am not sure if this is due to improper lubrication or what?

Anyway, that is one common cause for front-end clunks.

[Flieger]

Originally Posted by torresmd

Keep in mind that the pic shown is with the car jacked up and the suspension hanging free.
I am confused because with the suspension hanging, when I pull the torsion bar out and turn the bar then re-insert, the angle of the control arm does not change at all. I can pull, turn re-insert till the cows come home and nothing changes. It seems that the only way to change the angle of the control arm is to jack up the control arm and then place the torsion cap back on for a new range of motion.

Yes, I see what you mean. If you keep the adjuster cap in the same postion relative to the A-arm, it does not matter what the spline alignment is. My bad.

So yes, taking off the adjuster cap and re-attaching at a different angle relative to the A-arm+torsion bar spline alignment will be a re-indexing. You can put the cap on in a spot beyond the normal range of the adjuster bolt, however, if you put the cap in while the splines are extended out farther than the crossmember. Sorry if you cannot picture what I am trying to say.

This would facilitate the "Safari Rally" ride height setting (or the opposite low setting).

[911pcars]

Yes. Check the tightness of the top strut nuts. Make sure the large, keyed washer is under the nut.

Did you also install steerging rack spacers?

".....then placed the torsion adjustment cover about mid way and lowered the car. It worked but not sure it that is the right way to re-index."

That sounds right.

Once installed, the front torsion bar inner spline doesn't have to be re-indexed. Just re-clock the adjuster one spline cw or cc. You do this only if the adjuster runs out of range in either direction. The object is keep the adjuster threaded arm in the middle of its adjustment range.

Sherwood

[Gunter]

Yep, bump-steer spacers installed?

Whenever you adjust height, Camber and Toe are affected.

What Camber and Toe are you aiming for?

[torresmd]

I did install the bump steer spacers. I pulled both front tires and re-inspected everything and it all seems tight. The only thing I can think of is the shock tower bolt not tight enough. I am using an air wrench but only have 80 lbs of pressure and only for a second or two.

Gunter..... I am not sure what camber and toe. I was going to take it to TurboKraft tomorrow.
Any suggestions?

[barndoor]

did you install monoballs ?

[torresmd]

I did not install monoballs,

[Gunter]

Originally Posted by torresmd

I did install the bump steer spacers.
Gunter..... I am not sure what camber and toe. I was going to take it to TurboKraft tomorrow.
Any suggestions?

Decide beforehand. Is it for mostly street driving? Or track?
Big difference between the 2.

I went with fender height 25" front and 24.5" rear. (SC body, street driving)
Camber: 1 deg neg front, 11/2+ deg neg rear.
Toe: 1/8" total Toe-in front, 0 rear.

Don't go until you're sure that you have the height you want.
Then, on level ground, I would do a home- alignment first.
It's easy; all you need is 2 jack stands plus string and a carpenter level cut to fit right on to the rims. That way, you can see where the limits are on your adjustments.

You'll get close to what you want and then go to have it checked and corner balanced.

And make sure that the shop has experience with 911's.

[911pcars]

Originally Posted by torresmd

I did install the bump steer spacers. I pulled both front tires and re-inspected everything and it all seems tight. The only thing I can think of is the shock tower bolt not tight enough. I am using an air wrench but only have 80 lbs of pressure and only for a second or two.

Gunter..... I am not sure what camber and toe. I was going to take it to TurboKraft tomorrow.
Any suggestions?

Adding spacers raises the steering rack. This places the steering column under more stress. Typically, one loosens the steering rack shaft coupler to relieve any tension. In some cases, the coupler will contact the steering shaft U-joint producing a clicking noise as the steering wheel rotates through the interference area. If the symptoms open appear in straight line driving, never mind.

I'd double check the upper strut-to-chassis area. Make sure there's no play at this contact area.

Sherwood

[torresmd]

Well after a few grey hairs I finally figured out what the problem was. Kinda embarrassing really. After checking things over and over, I pulled the roll pins and yes the bilsteins were not seated properly. Crazy because I looked carefully before installing the pins but it was an optical illusion. Problem solved and now the car is getting an alignment and corner balance and fender rolling. Should pic her up tomorrow afternoon.

Thanks for all your input and help.
Steve