General opinions of tiptronic transmission

[M491Cabriolet]

I was wondering what the general opinion of the tiptronic transmission is on the 964 model. Does it make a car slow or slower? Is it slow to shift from on e gear to the next? Is a tiptronic 964 generally frowned upon and harder to sell, and is its market value much less than a manual? Is it considered a "real 911", or a wannabe for non-drivers? Thanks for your frank opinions. I'm looking at one (lovely car) and am really unsure.

[Dantilla]

Tiptronic is a glorified automatic. Still has a torque converter, still has a big lag between the paddles and when the tranny actually shifts.

Just like if Chevy added shift paddles to a bone-stock Impala.

Great if you want an automatic, but that market is smaller than the manual-shift gang.

[M491Cabriolet]

I don't think tiptronic has paddles, only the stick. Are you saying the PDK is also a glorified automatic?

[Dantilla]

Oops! My mistake.....

No paddles with Tip, haven't driven a PDK-equipped car yet.

I've driven other "Automated manual" cars, my personal preference is still a regular stick.

[TheSt|G]

I don't think tiptronic has paddles, only the stick. Are you saying the PDK is also a glorified automatic?

PDK is absolutely a glorified automatic. If you don't have a third pedal, it's an auto.

Tiptronic seems to knock 20%+ off the price of a 964, and they sell much slower than their manual counterparts. The tip itself was a dog when I drove it.

[uwanna]

Originally Posted by TheSt|G

PDK is absolutely a glorified automatic. If you don't have a third pedal, it's an auto.

Tiptronic seems to knock 20%+ off the price of a 964, and they sell much slower than their manual counterparts. The tip itself was a dog when I drove it.

Yes, it may be an automatic by definition but it doesn't have the dreaded torque converter. It has two each REAL clutches, and can shift a hell of a lot faster then you and I can in auto mode. In manual mode, I can flick a finger faster than I can operate a clutch and shift stick! If it's good enough for Formula One, that's good enough for me!l
I wonder if a PDK has any negative effect on price. I would doubt it.

[triplenet]

About 10 yrs ago, there had been a 993 advertised in the local paper for 2-3 wks.
I finally called the guy and learned it had a tip. His story sounded good, (dad bought it new and had died), desc. sounded great (one owner, low miles, blk/tan) , he said I should drive it and decide.
Gorgeous car, I drove it about 5 miles It made me think of a 2 speed Chevy trans (wasn't really that bad), but I thought it sucked the life out of it.
My opinion is the tip took the "sport" out of sports car, but it's likely OK in creeping traffic, and it does free up an extra hand for texting.
Not what I am looking for in a P-car!!

[m110]

A tiptronic still has "paddles".....buttons on the steering wheel....still just a torque convertor auto with good computer controlled shift pattern. Not even close to a modern PDK. Just think of it as an auto...."not there's anything wrong with that".

[TheSt|G]

Quote de TheSt|G

PDK is absolutely a glorified automatic. If you don't have a third pedal, it's an auto.



Tiptronic seems to knock 20%+ off the price of a 964, and they sell much slower than their manual counterparts. The tip itself was a dog when I drove it.

Yes, it may be an automatic by definition but it doesn't have the dreaded torque converter. It has two each REAL clutches, and can shift a hell of a lot faster then you and I can in auto mode. In manual mode, I can flick a finger faster than I can operate a clutch and shift stick! If it's good enough for Formula One, that's good enough for me!l

I wonder if a PDK has any negative effect on price. I would doubt it.

Driving manual isn't about the speed of the shifts, it is about the involvement in the car. Anyone can push a button.

Porsche gives 1% better residuals on manual spec'd cars over their PDK counterparts, so yes, even PDK takes a hit.

[uwanna]

Originally Posted by TheSt|G

Driving manual isn't about the speed of the shifts, it is about the involvement in the car. Anyone can push a button.

The same case could be made for the hand crank starter versus the electric starter. That's real involvement. Anyone can push a button! God love a Luddite.
Just yankin your chain, LOL.

[TheSt|G]

Originally Posted by uwanna

The same case could be made for the hand crank starter versus the electric starter. That's real involvement. Anyone can push a button! God love a Luddite.
Just yankin your chain, LOL.

Not really an analogy as a hand crank doesn't have anything to do with driving(as in, car control). Better examples would be electronic power steering or traction control that drives for you like the GTR. Both of which I absolutely detest.

If there is only thing I wish my '85 had though, it would be the throttle lever from earlier models. I simple love that type of fiddly mechanical engagement/character.

[uwanna]

Originally Posted by TheSt|G

Not really an analogy as a hand crank doesn't have anything to do with driving(as in, car control). Better examples would be electronic power steering or traction control that drives for you like the GTR. Both of which I absolutely detest.

If there is only thing I wish my '85 had though, it would be the throttle lever from earlier models. I simple love that type of fiddly mechanical engagement/character.

How about a straight cut non syncro gearbox like the old days, love that double clutching! That ought to appeal to your love of fiddly mechanical engagement/character and has to do with driving (as in car control). It certainly has more "involvement"
Time and engineering marches on my friend.

[Dantilla]

uwanna, how about we change the wording from "involvement" to just plain "fun".

A manual stick is far more fun to drive than any automatic I've driven thus far.

Hand crank starters do not add fun.
Non-syncro trannys are not fun.
Traction Control is not fun.
Light steering with feedback is way fun- Think 911, Cayman, Lotus, vs. overboosted Lincoln Town Car.

Yes, time and engineering march on. Most advancements are good, but not necessarily all.

[theiceman]

its an automatic ... end of discusion ..

[NYNick]

If you haven't driven a PDK, and driven it HARD on the track, you haven't experienced the wonder of technology. It's an absolutely thrilling experience, and one I won't soon forget. A glorified automatic is an oversimplified description, at the very least.

That being said, I'm a dyed in the wool stick shift kind of guy. I'm moving backwards in my preference for cars these days, but Porsche is moving forwards. Guys like me are old school, and I'm said to see the stick shift go, but go it will, no matter how loud we yell.
Nick

[TheSt|G]

Originally Posted by NYNick

If you haven't driven a PDK, and driven it HARD on the track, you haven't experienced the wonder of technology. It's an absolutely thrilling experience, and one I won't soon forget. A glorified automatic is an oversimplified description, at the very least.

That being said, I'm a dyed in the wool stick shift kind of guy. I'm moving backwards in my preference for cars these days, but Porsche is moving forwards. Guys like me are old school, and I'm said to see the stick shift go, but go it will, no matter how loud we yell.
Nick

I have driven it hard on track. If I was shooting for the best lap time, I certainly would want it, but beyond that it's the opposite of what I want in a car.

[NYNick]

I'm with ya Stig…Don't see one in my future either.

[TheSt|G]

Originally Posted by NYNick

I'm with ya Stig…Don't see one in my future either.

I'm also the weirdo who drove the G50 and 915 back to back and decided that the 915 was the box for me. So take it all with a grain of salt.

[mike monde]

I owned a tip for over 3 years and I can tell you that I drove that 911 more then my other 3 911 standard shifting cars. It was always my first choice when entering my garage.
For a DD I think it worked well and made the car more desirable. With that said, the car does lose a bit of that "sport" feeling that most desire with a 911.
From a performance stand point? Again, depending how you want to use it....on the track a standard shift is more connected....driving in traffic? Tip all day long.
I can tell you that a 964 tip will give you all the performance that you can handle once you pull off the line....I would call it a great GT thats best on the open road...rallies and auto cross or track? may leave you feeling a bit uninspired...but there are a few tip owners who swear by it on both fronts, road and track.
Would I consider buying another? Depending on my intended use but I would say absolutely!
Pricing? I would say the 15 to 20% reduction in price is in order.