Upgrading Headlights

[Mr. MaGooo]

Hey Guys,

First post, and its a question...

I have a 1986 911 Carrera Coupe that has the headlight scoops, or I think thats what they're called. They are recessed within the headlight cone. They're nice but the look is just not for me. I like the look of the 87-89 and would like to upgrade to that, the headlight extending past the headlight cone more like a ring.

Can I buy the 87 headlight rings and the headlight and just switch it out? If so where would I get them and is a conversion kit required.

Any thoughts?

Magoo

[wrinkledpants]

You have to upgrade the whole setup.

Porsche 911 & Carrera Lights and Lenses - Page 1

[darrin]

magoo -- the 87-89 us carreras use a headlight with H5 bulbs ("h5 headlights") -- while perhaps an upgrade over the sealed beams our '86s came with, they do not light the road nearly as well as european headlights.

Your best bet if you like the look of the 87-89 carreras' headlights is to get the headlights used by the european 911s, they're called bosch h4s and our host carries them (see Pelican Parts - Product Information: 0-301-800-103-M14), you'll need two.

You will also need to buy h4 bulbs (i used these higher wattage bulbs -- Pelican Parts - Product Information: 31425-M97), and should add a headlight relay kit while you're at it (especially if you end up using the higher wattage bulbs I suggestged Pelican Parts - Product Information: JWST-911-HLPR) -- the 911 routes all of the headlight current through the turn signal stalk, resulting in a failure point -- the relay kit solves this problem.

The h4 bulbs use the same sockets you currently have, the h5s used by the us 87-89 carreras would need a different socket for the h5 bulbs.

Both are "bolt on" conversions.

i ended up "cheaping out" and installing 6 7/8" round h4 bulbs in my sugar scoops (see Pelican Parts - Product Information: 70476-M44). While still using the sugar scoops, these provide MUCH better lighting than the sealed beams that came with my '86 carrera and actually look quite different than the sealed beam bulbs -- another thought . . .

Most important step when you're done is to properly aim the headlights -- search the web for info, but basically, pull up to a wall at night (on a flat road/parkinglot) turn on the lights and mark the wall where they're the brightest. Then back straight up around 25' and adjust the headlight aim so that they're no higher or lower (or left or right) from the spots you marked. This will get you "roughed in" and provide a basis for fine tuning.

Enjoy -- switching to h4 lights is a HUGE upgrade over stock @ nite

There's lots of info on the forums on installing/etc. h4 headlights, search away!

[Arne2]

I did the H4 in mine, much better light output than the '87-89 H5, and the wiring connectors don't need changed (like they do for the '87-89 H5 lights).

Parts for H4s:
Pair of H4 lights, your choice chrome or black rim.
Pair of H4 bulbs of your choice (I generally use Phillips or Osram), stick to 55/60 watt unless you have relays installed.
Pair of 4 watt bulbs (same as the side markers) for city lights (optional).
Relay kit (optional, but highly recommended for any lights, especially higher wattage).

To add the painted trim covers:

Two primed trim covers
Two inner retaining screws
Two outer retaining screws
Paint for trim covers is up to you.

Here's a couple of pictures. The first is with only the left light upgraded, and before I painted the trim cover. The second is after the project was complete.

[JQ911]

+1 on H4s. That was the first upgrade I did on the 86. Good luck!

[James Brown]

best-lights-ever

[porwolf]

+1! H4's are so much better than the US sealed beam lights so substantially more light and so much better looking!

[spuggy]

Originally Posted by darrin

magoo -- the 87-89 us carreras use a headlight with H5 bulbs ("h5 headlights") -- while perhaps an upgrade over the sealed beams our '86s came with, they do not light the road nearly as well as european headlights.

Your best bet if you like the look of the 87-89 carreras' headlights is to get the headlights used by the european 911s, they're called bosch h4s and our host carries them (see Pelican Parts - Product Information: 0-301-800-103-M14), you'll need two.

You will also need to buy h4 bulbs (i used these higher wattage bulbs -- Pelican Parts - Product Information: 31425-M97), and should add a headlight relay kit while you're at it (especially if you end up using the higher wattage bulbs I suggestged Pelican Parts - Product Information: JWST-911-HLPR) -- the 911 routes all of the headlight current through the turn signal stalk, resulting in a failure point -- the relay kit solves this problem.

The h4 bulbs use the same sockets you currently have, the h5s used by the us 87-89 carreras would need a different socket for the h5 bulbs.

Both are "bolt on" conversions.

i ended up "cheaping out" and installing 6 7/8" round h4 bulbs in my sugar scoops (see Pelican Parts - Product Information: 70476-M44). While still using the sugar scoops, these provide MUCH better lighting than the sealed beams that came with my '86 carrera and actually look quite different than the sealed beam bulbs -- another thought . . .

Most important step when you're done is to properly aim the headlights -- search the web for info, but basically, pull up to a wall at night (on a flat road/parkinglot) turn on the lights and mark the wall where they're the brightest. Then back straight up around 25' and adjust the headlight aim so that they're no higher or lower (or left or right) from the spots you marked. This will get you "roughed in" and provide a basis for fine tuning.

Enjoy -- switching to h4 lights is a HUGE upgrade over stock @ nite

There's lots of info on the forums on installing/etc. h4 headlights, search away!

+1 But whether you fit Euro H4's or replace the sealed beams with decent reflectors (Bosch, Hella, Cibie) in the sugar scoops, also fit the headlight relay kit; by minimising voltage drop at the bulbs, these result in increased light output too - as well as protecting the headlight stalk/switch (because the current for the lights no longer flows through them).

[Mr. MaGooo]

you guys are awesome, what a resorce this is! I am going to go with Darrin's sugestion and change to the period correct european version headlights.

Question, do I need one or two headlight relay kits? Also the new headlights and blubs you recomended from pelican say they are for a 65 to 69 model year, am I reading this right?

Looks like I can buy all the parts I need right from pelican for around $486.00.

[darrin]

you only need one relay kit, it will work both the high and low beams for both headlights.

The headlights we referenced will work with your '86 -- I believe that the US DOT mandated sealed beam headlights in cars in 1970 (hence the 66-69 reference)

These were standard equipment on European 911s

[Mr. MaGooo]

Also, sholud I paint the black trim of the headlight to match the car or did it come black from the factory?

[darrin]

The link I included in my first post is to the headlight with a black (vs chrome) trim ring. You can add another ring that's primered for painting -- this primered ring fits over the black ring. Since your car has black trim, you might be just fine with the black ring that comes with the headlights. This would save you a fair bit of $$$ as you wouldn't need to buy or paint the primered rings. If it were me, I'd pick up the headlights, install, and see if you like what you see. The primered rings could always be added later . . . or incorporated into a repaint of your car?

Originally Posted by Mr. MaGooo

Also, sholud I paint the black trim of the headlight to match the car or did it come black from the factory?

[JQ911]

+1 on Darrin - Mount the black trim ring a couple of days and if you like it, leave it that way. When I mounted my H4s, I let the black trim ring for a couple of days while searching here to get an idea how it looks like on matching colored trims. I ended up matching mine since it looks better matching on Guards Red. What color is yours? Can you post a picture?

[schumicat]

generic round H4 lights (same as for Miata, I think they are 7") will work. with special "Rally" off-road bulbs (sold by daniel stern lighting and on ebay) they provide terrific lighting. I moved the H4s on the Miata onto my 911 when I sold the Miata.

[Mr. MaGooo]

the car is Meteor gray metallic and i think im going to see how the black looks and go from there, Thank's for everything guys!

[jdbunda]

There are many many threads on this topic, you might want to search.

One thing you need to be aware of when switching to H4s, the mounting is pretty weak compared to scoops or H5s. Instead of fours screws onto tabs in the bucket, the H4 assemblies hook over the flange on the top of the headlamp opening, and are held in place by a single screw at the bottom of the lamp. This is a special screw with a concentric hole tapped into it to allow adding painted trim rings.

This presents several potential problems - one is if you don't get the assembly mounted correctly, or if the bucket flanges are damaged, it might look ok, but then fall out while you are driving. For this reason, it's a good idea to safety your assemblies on with zip-ties so that if they do fall out, you don't run them over. The other problem is the threads on the mounting tab for the single screw are easy to strip, and are often rusty. So be careful when mounting that you don't cross-thread or overtighten.

H4s are available in chrome as well as black, so if chrome would work well on your car, you don't need trim rings or paint. Here is a (crappy) picture of mine with chrome:

[spuggy]

Originally Posted by darrin

The link I included in my first post is to the headlight with a black (vs chrome) trim ring. You can add another ring that's primered for painting -- this primered ring fits over the black ring. Since your car has black trim, you might be just fine with the black ring that comes with the headlights.

Heh. I have a black car with black trim and 50 ft paint. And I thought the black rings on the Euro H4's looked awful.

Apart from anything else, the profile isn't right in side view. And the black is a rough primer.

The factory always fitted the trim ring (the extra one, that's smooth and intended to be painted) and the special two-piece screw to Euro H4's. Do it right

[Mr. MaGooo]

[Craig T]

You should look at the D-Zug product. It's nice.

911 /H4 HID Headlight Kit

[jdbunda]

It always eventually comes around to HID conversions.

But seriously, rather than HIDs, I am looking forward to a good LED solution, gotta be coming soon from somewhere.